Random Car Question?

[lovelylittle]

so i have an older car, and just found out it is apparently burning oil. i have been told by car-savvy friends that older cars tend to do this and it isn't a big deal as long as i stay on top of it. i seem to be putting 2-3 bottles of oil in it every 6-8 weeks or so. my question is, if i'm filling it up with clean oil this often, should i still be getting oil changes? it doesn't really make sense to me to do so, but i'm a girl and i don't know anything, so maybe i'm wrong.

[Repaid1]

You should still need to change your filter, just probably not every 3 months.

[Daddy R]

Ditto on repaid's statement, w/ a add you might look at leaks, I wouldsay if using that much & not fouling plugs I would guess your leaving puddles where it sits.

[Jinxed]

You can't change the filter without emptying the oil reserve....without making a hell of a mess that is.

[lovelylittle]

I haven't noticed any oil leaking anywhere. My boyfriend said there's something you can put in it that will make the rubber parts swell and help the problem but he doesn't know what exactly it's called and I have no idea what he's talking about...? and how often should i have the filter changed?

[beallucanb]

I would suggest that you get the car looked at by someone who knows what he or she is doing.

Check to see if you are indeed burning oil and not loosing oil due to a leak or multiple leaks.

Burning oil is caused by poor maintenance, and abuse, leaving the oil get dirty can lead to worn rings, running your car without the proper air filter also causes oil and compression rings to wear out before there time.

If you start doing oil changes now, it will not stop what is happening but it just might help you keep your car on the road a little longer..

First check and make sure the oil is not leaking, if it is see about repairing the leaks, if it isn't then change your oil to one with a higher viscosity (thicker).

If you live in a northern area you may be limited to thinner oils because starting a car with thick oil in below zero conditions doesn't always work too well.

Find what weight oil is suppose to go in your particular make and model, and if it is burning oil go to a slightly thicker oil.

If your car takes 5-30 oil try going to 10-40, the first number is important for colder areas, but if you live where it rarely gets colder you can use 20-50.

This will not stop the oil consumption, but it might slow it down.

[babyvr6]

That its actually a lot of oil to be burning in that time frame. How many miles are you actually traveling in that 6-8 week period?

[babyvr6]

And maybe a make/model/engine/year/miles?

[Loveable_guy]

Lovely, if you car is not leaving wet spots and you are not seeing or smelling burning oil from the drivers compartment then you must be burning it while driving and its going up in smoke out the exhaust. Adding a sealant will be of no be a big help. Do you get a cloud of blue smoke on the first start her up in the morning? If so it is likely the valve seals are leaking. Expected on an older vehicle and there is some oil additives that will could offer some help. Overall I would continue to do regular oil changes and keep checking the oil level weekly. More often if you are driving more than a few hundred miles in a week. My 69 Firebird would use two quarts in 200 miles. Gosh I wish I still had that car.

[Diapered Jason]

I would suggest that you get the car looked at by someone who knows what he or she is doing.

YUCK. Only as a last resort. For me, the internet is really good. Generally, troubleshooting cars is made much easier with the internet. Just search for the make, model, year, as well as description of the problem, and you will probably find your car is notorious for a number of things which can give you a good indication of where to look first. This is made even easier if you have information from a check engine light, but this is probably not the case with an oil leak. Oil leaks can be very difficult to see, but you will probably have to replace a gasket or seal. If you do not see the oil leak, the problem is more complicated. In that case, you probably better take it in and have someone fix it. It will be very expensive if it is a piston ring problem and with an older car, it may not be worth it.

[Dirty Diaper/Maxipad Lover]

Loveable_guy is correct--if you don't see wet spots, you're burning oil. If you do see wet spots and it's a dry day, then you're probably leaking oil.

Under normal driving circumstances, you should change your oil filter every six months--more if you drive excessively or have an owners manual that recommends more frequent changes. Given that you're burning most of your oil, you can probably go a year between changes.

I also have an older car, but the fuel injection system in it was completely replaced a few years back so it's running like new now. With all of the work I've had done on it, it really is a "new" old car. A family member used to have a car that went through oil like yours. Okay to be fair the thing should have been totalled and a class action lawsuit should have been filed over what nearly totalled it, but that's a story for another day--the point is that I understand what you're dealing with. Depending on how long you plan to keep the car, and how much your spending on oil, it might be worth figuring out what your most economical solution is. If you're not planning to keep the car very long, just keep putting oil into it. If you're planning to hang onto the car for awhile, a more economical solution might be to listen to beallucanb, and to take it to someone who knows what he/she is doing for repairs.

Now, keep in mind that in the case of the vehicle I mentioned that should have been totalled, the dealer that usually serviced it had gone from being really reliable to being really shady. The sales guy wanted to sell the owner a new transmission--the mechanic told my family member to just keep putting oil in it, which is exactly what was done. If the car had been in better condition, the new transmission would have been a worthwhile investment. Case in point: A female friend had a used car that had its transmission die when it was two years old--she only had it for a year and a half. It would have been completely economical to replace the transmission in her car, but she traded it in for another used one that was a model year newer--the dealer had her old car up for sale with a new transmission within a week, and within two weeks they had sold it, because it was a popular model.

Your car is probably more comparable to the first one I mentioned, so if you do take it in for repairs, do some research first. Talk to other people who have used the same repair place regardless of if its a garage or a dealership. Find out what kind of experiences other people have had. Are they happy with the repair? Did they feel like they overpaid, underpaid, or paid just enough? Were there any problems, and if so, how were they resolved? Most important though, was the repair similar to yours? Some places do one thing really well and another really poorly. If your car is an import, you're probably better dealing with a dealer then a garage if you have a reputable dealer nearby. If it's a domestic vehicle, a garage will probably be less expensive and just as reliable. Once you do your research, you can make your decision on whether you want to proceed with repairs or just keep throwing oil into your car, but I can't tell you which you should do without knowing more about your vehicle or your situation.

Oh yeah, and that owners manual I mentioned? Do yourself a favor and read it if you haven't done so already. I read mine from cover to cover, and my family and friends have done so with their cars as well. A lot of the more basic issues that your car may have will be addressed in the owners manual, and you should keep it in your glove box at all times. It probably won't help with your oil problem, but it could make your life easier in the long run.

[Bettypooh]

As cars wear they begin to burn oil. The most important thing is to check it frequently and never let it get below the 'safe zone' marked on the dipstick. Do that and it may go kaboom Most older cars will do fine changing the oil twice a year (spring and fall) but every three months is really better. Have a mechanic run the car up on a lift to look for leaks. Ask about the cost of that repair and consider how much oil you can buy in comparison. If the car isn't going to be around in 3 or 4 years replacing a rear main seal may cost more than just keeping it filled with oil till then. Also rate the value of the leaking areas against each other- sometimes a bad one that is cheap to fix is worth fixing and lets you live with the lesser leaks, but fixing a small one while leaving a big one is stupid. In some cases there is a plastic shield under the engine where oil can collect when the car sits and oil gets blown out of there only when driving so you don't know there's a leak till it gets really bad

Ok that covers leaks, so now the burning question (pun intended) There is usually no harm in a carburated engine burning oil but you've got to go back a long way to have one of these- like some early-90's Hondas. Since you've probably got an injected engine, burning oil can cause you grief. It coats the oxygen sensor which tells the system how to mix the fuel you need, and when it doesn't work properly you can lose mileage, the car can run rough, it can stall at certaIn times, it won't pass a smog test, and is generally a bad thing to have happen for more technical reasons. I have that problem with my car but it still runs well enough to suit me and the needed repair (valve seals and maybe rings too) is more than the value of the car so I ain't going to fix it unless it dies completely, and then only if it isn't a catastrpophic and expensive failure. Replacibng the oxygen sensor is a temporary fix since it will get coated with oil again- I may go there since I supply my own labor, but that's about all my car is worth. My rule here is this: If the car still runs well enough to suit you, then you don't need to make any expensive repairs- just keep up with the little stuff and plan on a replacement sometime in the future. Once again never let it get low on oil- engines going kaboom are always expensive problems

Going to a thicker oil may help, but going to a too-thick oil can kill a car faster Oil grades are almost a science to themselves and there's a lot of misinformation out there based on past generalities which do not always apply to today's engines. You can usually go up one step safely, such as going from a 5W30 to a 10W40. Climate also matters. The number before the "W" is the cold viscosity. In cold winters you don't want to go too high there or it will starve for lubrication when cold. Hot climes will usually let you go two steps higher with the second number after the "W" or go to a straight-grade oil without a "W" that is a higher number. This change often helps with oil burning and sometinmes helps oil leaks too. I prefer single-grade oils and change their viscosity (the number) based on the season- thinner in winter and thicker in summer

There is no magic in oil and there is no magic additive that will fix anything in your car. Some engines will tolerate additives that thicken oil but again this is mostly older engine designs. STP and Lucas oil additives do this. Seals which harden over time cannot be restored with additives though sometimes they will give temporary relief till the seal becomes so soft that it fails completely requiring the same repair it did before but now you can't just put up with it- you're going to have to make the repair immediately, like it or not. Marvel Mystery oil can soften seals. All the mentioned additives are high quality and can help in certain situations- but you may not be in those situations and in that case they are a waste of money at best. If additives really helped the car manufacturers would recommend them; none of them do. Using the correct oil is enough- it's the best way to minimize the wear which is going to occur with time. Read the first line of this paragraph again until you understand it., and if you still think you want to try an additive make sure you ask a good mechanic about it. I no longer use additives in the oil unless I'm getting rid of the car right away and I know they will not cause a problem with that particular engine. I do like Lucas for some gearboxes and differentials where it can really work wonders. I like Marvel for the manual gearboxes which use ATF for lubricant. In those applications they are often worth more than their cost, but they still will not fix anything; they will only make things work a little better, a little longer, and a little smoother

There is one potential problem with this approach- if you live in a state with required smog inspections an oil burner may not pass. If you can see bluish smoke from the tailpipe at any time then it's likely a fail- checking visually can save you a testing fee. Maybe you know a way around that; maybe you can risk a non-current inspection or registration fine better than repair costs. Just know what you're risking. If the car has a current smog rating and you can just barely detect oil smoke it may be time to trade it off while you can get full value from it. Without the smog certificate or with visible oil smoke the car will be worh a lot less on the market since it will have to be repaired before it can be put on the road legally. If you'e near a non-smog testing state you might do well to sell it there instead. These are legal issues so know what you're doing before you try any of them

Really good mechanics are a rarity but decent ones can be found. Ask around and find one who understands that older cars are not usually worth extensive repair costs, and who will let you know when they think it's best for you to get rid of it instead of dragging you along doing repairs to a car that isn't worth it. If you find a good mechanic then give them all your work- don't 'cut their throat' by getting the oil changed at a cheapo shop based on price. Support him because in the long run he's looking out for your best interests and in the end it will cost you less even if some things can be done cheapr elsewhere in between. And like your doctor, follow the advice given you or wish you had later on when things go really bad because you didn't listen when you should have!

Bettypooh

[Diapered Jason]

Ok that covers leaks, so now the burning question (pun intended) There is usually no harm in a carburated engine burning oil but you've got to go back a long way to have one of these- like some early-90's Hondas. Since you've probably got an injected engine, burning oil can cause you grief. It coats the oxygen sensor which tells the system how to mix the fuel you need, and when it doesn't work properly you can lose mileage, the car can run rough, it can stall at certaIn times, it won't pass a smog test, and is generally a bad thing to have happen for more technical reasons. I have that problem with my car but it still runs well enough to suit me and the needed repair (valve seals and maybe rings too) is more than the value of the car so I ain't going to fix it unless it dies completely, and then only if it isn't a catastrpophic and expensive failure. Replacibng the oxygen sensor is a temporary fix since it will get coated with oil again- I may go there since I supply my own labor, but that's about all my car is worth. My rule here is this: If the car still runs well enough to suit you, then you don't need to make any expensive repairs- just keep up with the little stuff and plan on a replacement sometime in the future. Once again never let it get low on oil- engines going kaboom are always expensive problems

Why replace the oxygen sensor when you can just clean it with some isopropyl alcohol and q-tips?

[Repaid1]

Why replace the oxygen sensor when you can just clean it with some isopropyl alcohol and q-tips?

First of all. It's not whether it can or can't be cleaned. Anything can be cleaned, if you go about it right. The question should be, first of all, whether cleaning it would do any good, and if so, whether it needs to be cleaned. Oxygen sensors are exposed to such extreme heat that the only thing that it can get (dirty) with is carbon. Extreme heat will turn any organic matter, such as gasoline or oil, into carbon. Well the bad thing about that, is that baked carbon is not soluble in any kind of solvent, and even if it was, the sensing unit within the o2 sensor module, is not exposed, and is not visible. It is covered by what is usually a louvered steel cylinder. Therefor if you're going to brush it, use a wire brush and brush it as hard as you want, because it isn't going to hurt the steel cover. But this is the problem. The only thing that you can really clean with any success is the outer cover. Since solvents won't do any good, I really would not recomend using electric motor cleaner, since the active indredient in it is Trichloroethylene which is not a very strong solvent. not only is it's strength very low, but also, since it is designed to clean electronic components, it evaporates very rapidly, resulting in a very short working time.

Since o2 sensors are disigned to hande such extreme temeratures. The best method of cleaning them, is to heat the bottom part of the sensor (the part that inserts into the exaust) with a propane torch, to the point that it just begins to turn red. You do not want it to glow chery red, even though they are designed to take extreme heat, you can still over do it. Once you have it heated to the point that is just turns red, or to the point just befor it turns red, quench it in water. This will break free any carbon build up inside the sensor. After the first time, some pieces may still be to big to come out of the sensor so I would recomend doing it 2 to 3 times, blowing it out with an air compressor between each time. But I would have to say, good luck, since O2 sensors very seldom fail do to being dirty. This is not common at all.

[sarah_ab]

we get our oil changed when the stick says to... we go to oil can henry's down the road, and when they change it they give us a sticker for at which mileage it should be changed.

once a week when we put gas in it, we also check the oil, to make sure it doesn't need any added.

it never does, but its just something i was always taught to do.

[lovelylittle]

*blink blink* lots of this is going right over my head. but let me see if i can answer most of your questions.

it's a 2001 toyota corolla. there have never been any wet spots under it or signs of an oil leak, i never see any smoke, and it runs perfectly fine- the only time i've noticed anything wrong is the first time it got low on oil it was starting to make some really awful grinding noises and i asked a friend what the noise was and he checked the oil for me. since then i check it every 3 weeks or so and usually have to put some in every 6-8. but with staying on top of it, there have been no problems with the performance of the car, other than a decrease in gas mileage, which one of my friends also recently pointed out could be due to the fact that i need air in my tires. i drive quite a bit between work, taking my daughter back and forth to babysitting, and random errands... maybe 150 miles a week or so.

and i use 5W-D because that's what the cap on my engine says, it doesn't get like really, really cold here a lot but it might get down in the teens when Ohio actually realizes that it's winter. we do get below zero sometimes, it just depends.

i don't know if any of that info changes any of your answers, but remember, you're talking to someone who knows absolutely nothing about cars.... i know you have to put gas in it, and changing the oil is good, and running into things is bad, and the way an engine works has something to do with tiny little explosions and pistons, and the oil keeps all the engine parts all nicely lubricated so if it doesn't have oil it will make terrible grinding sounds. that is the extent of my knowledge.

oh, and i know where to put the windshield wiper fluid.

[sarah_ab]

so u put oil in it... do you ever get your oil changed?

[Diapered Jason]

First of all. It's not whether it can or can't be cleaned. Anything can be cleaned, if you go about it right. The question should be, first of all, whether cleaning it would do any good, and if so, whether it needs to be cleaned. Oxygen sensors are exposed to such extreme heat that the only thing that it can get (dirty) with is carbon. Extreme heat will turn any organic matter, such as gasoline or oil, into carbon. Well the bad thing about that, is that baked carbon is not soluble in any kind of solvent, and even if it was, the sensing unit within the o2 sensor module, is not exposed, and is not visible. It is covered by what is usually a louvered steel cylinder. Therefor if you're going to brush it, use a wire brush and brush it as hard as you want, because it isn't going to hurt the steel cover. But this is the problem. The only thing that you can really clean with any success is the outer cover. Since solvents won't do any good, I really would not recomend using electric motor cleaner, since the active indredient in it is Trichloroethylene which is not a very strong solvent. not only is it's strength very low, but also, since it is designed to clean electronic components, it evaporates very rapidly, resulting in a very short working time.

Since o2 sensors are disigned to hande such extreme temeratures. The best method of cleaning them, is to heat the bottom part of the sensor (the part that inserts into the exaust) with a propane torch, to the point that it just begins to turn red. You do not want it to glow chery red, even though they are designed to take extreme heat, you can still over do it. Once you have it heated to the point that is just turns red, or to the point just befor it turns red, quench it in water. This will break free any carbon build up inside the sensor. After the first time, some pieces may still be to big to come out of the sensor so I would recomend doing it 2 to 3 times, blowing it out with an air compressor between each time. But I would have to say, good luck, since O2 sensors very seldom fail do to being dirty. This is not common at all.

Baked carbon? You must mean soot. Burning it off would probably be the best way as you said since it would oxidize and complete the combustion reaction thereby evaporating the soot. It is also dissolvable, but obviously not by IPA. Unfortunately, the solvent necessary may also damage the sensor. Orginally, I was thinking it would be as easy to clean the air intake oxygen sensor, which is my experience. I have never handled the exhaust oxygen sensor before, so I learned something.

[drynot]

Well if you let it get so low on oil that it started to make nasty grinding noises then you've done some damage internally. Not a lot as you say that it still runs OK.....

It won't get any better even with additives. Your best course of action is to rebuild the engine or replace the car. Not everyone can afford that though so keeping the oil topped up as best you can will keep getting you down the road. I am a big fan of regular maintenance so I am still going to recommend regular oil changes but in reality with how much oil you are going through you CAN get away with just doing the oil filter at TOYOTA's regular intervals. DO NOT run a higher viscosity oil in your engine to try and reduce the amount of oil consumption as someone else suggested.

Replacing the spark plugs right now will likely bring back some of your lost gas mileage as they are likely to be all carboned up from burning so much oil. And yea.....top up your tires to recommended pressures. If you can't find out how much air pressure to run in your tires then take it to any tire shop....they'll set you up properly.

[Loveable_guy]

Not changing the oil because you keep adding assumes the oil filer is not getting dirty when in fact it’s working as it always did.

Keep up normal oil changes.

You mentioned wet spots, if you have a few bucks I would get it looked at. You may find it’s a easy fix costing less than $100.

[sarah_ab]

ok best advice.. GET A MECHANIC!!!! seriously.... i mean you have already gotten advice from just keep putting oil in it to rebuild your entire engine. GO TO A MECHANIC!!!!!

there best advice... also my guess is you have never had a tune up on it huh? spark plugs checked, all your fluids check, filters checked etc.... so find a mechanic and get a tune up with everything checked etc..... older cars need these more often... our car is 11 yrs old... we get a tune up 1x yearly, and change our oil every time the mileage sticker tells us too....

[Repaid1]

Actually I am a ASE certified mechanic. The part that scares me is that she says it doesn't smoke and doesn't leak, so that only leaves one route for the oil to go, the water jacket. Now before we get to that, when you say it doesn't smoke we don't mean like a fogger truck but it should be blowing a bluish white smoke out at least on harder acceleration. that should be noticable somewhat. I would have someone stand behind it and revit up a few times, and have them hold a folded paper towel over the exhaust pipe. Let it return to idle, and pull the paper towel taught and flat against the opening. if it blows out then sucks into the pipe a bit your valves are bad. Those are what seal the explosions in If it is burning oil yyou should see the smoke I mentioned at some point. Generally you shouldn't be using more than a quart a month for that year of car.

Next we move to a quick question..who is checking the oil level.. I only ask as you said you don't know much about a car. I will just to add that I am not trying to belittle you, just wanna make sure. You are checking it without the engine running and only after it has set for about five minutes. You should have a upper limit and a lower limit on the dip stick. Neither should ever be crossed. Never over fill a car with oil, generally the lower level is at a basic setting of a quart or two low, depending on engine size. Only add a quart at a time if it is at the lower limit and wait for the oil to filter down to the pan and dip stick, make sure you wipe clean the dipstick each time you recheck.

Okay now for the water jacket.. if your car has a radiator cap on the radiator itself open it when it is cool and check the fluid, hopefully it will be a nice green color, if it is milky white to brown, we found your problem and the car isn't long for the world as it sits. That only works if the radiator proper has the cap not a over flow tank to just add to a sealed system. hopefully this isn't the case.

personally it just sounds like to me your episode of letting it run low on oil chewed up the rings on the piston a bit and your just getting blow by. If not to bad you can go a step hotter on the plugs, thicken the oil like was mentioned, and just drive it till she blows. If it's a toyota it's gonna be good for a couple of years or blow up in a day..with these things you can never tell.

Personally, I would never take a car to a dealership, many mechanics have it hard out there and dealerships let the oldschool 30 to 40 year guys go for the book worms outta tech school cause they can get them for $10 a hour. Many of my friends work out of their garages and have more knowledge and tools than most dealerships mechanics. As your close I can give you one that could take a look at your car and diagnose your problem by a quick compression test which will tell them where your oil is going, and how bad it is. While not free I can guarentee you it will be cheaper than taking it to anyone else. Other than that, my rule is simple, keep the fluids full, the engine tuned, the tires at proper pressure (Nitrogen in Ohio here is preferred for winter) And drive it till she drops girl! Then see craigs list for a new one!

EDIT: Okay I just for the heck of it Googled your situation, your not alone! : http://www.carcomplaints.com/Toyota/Corolla/2001/engine/using_excess_oil.shtml

[redneck diaper boy]

I would still keep the oil and filter changed. Typically the oil rings or deteriorated valve seals cause engines to burn oil. If you are not burning it, check for leaks. Check the oil pan gasket, the valve cover gasket or the crankshaft seal.

[Bettypooh]

I'm changing my advice based on repaid1's link- see what this thng will bring on trade while it's not smoking and if it's enough then dump it while you can! Once this issue becomes well-known you won't be able to get more than junkyard prices on a sale or trade, and the oil consumption some mentioned is outrageous- wanna add a quart of oil ($5+) every day or two? You're headed that way!

To the techies here: Have any of you been into one of these deep enough to check cylinder wall wear or scoring? With just a 5W oil I think scoring is probably the culprit, but if the walls are OK a cheap in-car re-ring job might be worth the cost. A rebore would probably exceed the car's worth since she's paying for the labor too. Plus I don't know if this one has plated aluminum cylinder walls- if it does it's probably scrap now. If it has iron liners there's hope. Any thoughts on this, and any experience with how well todays thinner oils work in the modern engines? I just can't see them performing well on the cylinder walls though they might be OK on the bearings as long as everything is tight. 5W is darn near watery compared to using a 50W to get a few more miles out of an old high-wear cast-iron detroit V8! Oh how the world has changed in my lifetime.

Bettypooh

[bbgirlmichelle]

I just can't see them performing well on the cylinder walls though they might be OK on the bearings as long as everything is tight. 5W is darn near watery compared to using a 50W to get a few more miles out of an old high-wear cast-iron detroit V8! Oh how the world has changed in my lifetime.

Bettypooh

I'm with you there Betty, I've had tons of fun (and money) fixing my 96 Plymouth Neon (stupid car computers) yet my 77 V8 Dodge (manufactured in Aug 76, and is actually older than me) keeps on running and passing emissions. She just yelled at me on the side of the road a few weeks back for some maintenance though by blowing a coolant hose, thankfully you can actually get into the engine compartments to fix 'em without pulling an engine on those older girls. Come spring she'll be getting all of the hoses and belt(s) replaced and I'll bet she'll last at least another 10 years.