Trying to become urine incontinent

[BabyCat2]

Hi all I have been wanting to since forever to become urine incontinent. I have tried hypnosis and nothing. Well this time around I have tried hypnosis again I will link the site if interested. So far I just drink a lot of water and just let it flow so hoping eventually my bladder will learn just just let go.

[Cute_Kitten]

Some people here have achieved incontinence or diaper training.  Patience and unwavering persistence and time seem to be the general recipe. Like going diapered 24/7 and living their life as if they're already incontinent, shifting their mindset to accepting themselves as incontinent, etc.  best of luck!

[BabyCat2]

Yes im now diapered 24/7 unless if I need to poo, I don't think I could manage pooing in my diaper I have a high gag reflex ?

[Cute_Kitten]

I've read of some people who originally just wanted urinary incontinence, but unintentionally ended up with both or had weakened control back there from diaper training themselves.  Other people seem to have no problem retaining bowel control while being urinary incontinent. it seems to be one of those "everybody's body is different, so your mileage may vary."  Just some food for thought. But if you do end up find yourself loosing bowel control along with bladder, you'd probably have time to put the brakes on/ adjust your diaper training as needed. 

[BabyCat2]

Good to know thanks so far haven't had any accident back there had one close call but made it in time.

 

So on another note how do I stay hydrated since after I drink I pee (flood/leak my pull up) 

Is this normal the good thing is then my bladder should be learning fast how to release 

[oznl]

17 minutes ago, Cute_Kitten said:

I've read of some people who originally just wanted urinary incontinence, but unintentionally ended up with both or had weakened control back there from diaper training themselves.  Other people seem to have no problem retaining bowel control while being urinary incontinent. it seems to be one of those "everybody's body is different, so your mileage may vary."  Just some food for thought. But if you do end up find yourself loosing bowel control along with bladder, you'd probably have time to put the brakes on/ adjust your diaper training as needed. 

I’m about 3.5 years on 24/7 through which I’ve not been practicing urinary continence at all.  To be honest, I do still have a degree of pee-continence during the day (I can if I really need to, choose to stay dry for brief periods of time – maybe an hour or two) but at night I’m prone to wetting in my sleep.

My experience is that it’s true that there has been a concurrent weakening in bowel control.  I’m still fairly continent in that department but urgency is much more pronounced, my for-decades-rock-solid “schedule” is disrupted and there have, on occasion, been “incidents” (contained by my diapers).  It’s arguable that I’ve allowed these incidents to occur because I know I’m diapered anyway and somehow subconsciously opted for comfort over cleanliness but I can’t be 100% sure of that.

If your experience resembles mine, you won’t suddenly become incontinent of bowels but you MAY eventually end up with the odd, rare dirty diaper you didn’t really expect  here and there which frankly, hasn't been the end of the world.

[Enthusi]

43 minutes ago, oznl said:

If your experience resembles mine, you won’t suddenly become incontinent of bowels but you MAY eventually end up with the odd, rare dirty diaper you didn’t really expect  here and there which frankly, hasn't been the end of the world.

Boy and how!  That’s precisely where I am after 5 years of 24/7.  For all intents and purposes in diaper dependent when it comes to urinary control.  I’m no stranger to messing but  I have never pursued bowel incontinence and I don’t plan to.  That said there have been a handful of times where I felt an urge to poop and I just sort of give up trying to hold it in because I figure I have a diaper on and on rare occasions I had a legit accident.  
 

I don’t know how it is for you, @oznlbut I imagine it’s one of those  “woah moments” you had referred to in a previous thread.   As in: 

- “Woah, I accidentally pooped myself!” And

- “Woah, it’s no big deal that I accidentally pooped myself!”

[Little Cub Pants]

I just wanted to jump in here and weight on this really quick. Trying to become urine incontinent could also be MORE psychological than physical. I only say that because the other day I had a dream where I was an baby again and I was going wee-wee in my diapee and my Mommy was changing me as I was continuing to go pee-pees in my diaper! And it turned out that I was actually going pee-pees in my pants without even knowing it.??????♥️??? And it actually felt good to go UNCONTROLLABLY like that. I was only going in little amounts though, not BIG amounts.???

[oznl]

54 minutes ago, Enthusi said:

 

I don’t know how it is for you, @oznlbut I imagine it’s one of those  “woah moments” you had referred to in a previous thread.   As in: 

- “Woah, I accidentally pooped myself!” And

- “Woah, it’s no big deal that I accidentally pooped myself!”

I think the magnitude of my tragedy here is muted on two fronts ?

Firstly, I'm wearing a nappy so I'm well aware that there's only so bad things can get.

Secondly, my internal talk-track is telling me that I didn't really lose control but simply realised it wasn't worth the discomfort because of #1.

I'm well aware that reason #2 is quite possibly one of those self-delusional rationalisations that my brain is so fond of here.  If I really started uncontrollably loading my diapers when out in company, that's a serious thing that would force me to re-evaluate where I was going.  So far it's just looking like it's somewhat-degraded control and I need to be a bit more careful or, if circumstances permit, allow for a bigger clean-up exercise at my next change.  Pee accidents happen every other night.  Poop accidents I can count on one hand over the last year.

[DLJeff52]

I will only add here that I am and have now been trying #2 incontinence in addition to urinary under the potential premise that losing control of bowels may help increase total loss of control of urinary.  I know physiologically they aren't linked, but psychologically it has helped!

[jeremy12312]

9 hours ago, DLJeff52 said:

I know physiologically they aren't linked,

Aren't they, though?  The pelvic floor is engaged with both sphincters, so it would seem that weakening both at the same time is doubly related in weakening the floor.

[Stroller]

4 hours ago, jeremy12312 said:

Aren't they, though?  The pelvic floor is engaged with both sphincters, so it would seem that weakening both at the same time is doubly related in weakening the floor.

They're clearly linked to some extent, unless my body is different from everybody else's.  Trying to hold back wetting and trying to hold back an urgent poo, you're using much the same muscles.  They appear to be exactly the ones I've stopped using so I can wet on automatic instead.  So I have to move quickly when I feel any urgency back there, as I know my ability to stop things has drastically reduced.  I can still cross my legs of course, but that isn't always going to be enough to stop the action.

[oznl]

1 hour ago, Stroller said:

They're clearly linked to some extent, unless my body is different from everybody else's.  Trying to hold back wetting and trying to hold back an urgent poo, you're using much the same muscles.  They appear to be exactly the ones I've stopped using so I can wet on automatic instead.  So I have to move quickly when I feel any urgency back there, as I know my ability to stop things has drastically reduced.  I can still cross my legs of course, but that isn't always going to be enough to stop the action.

 

5 hours ago, jeremy12312 said:

Aren't they, though?  The pelvic floor is engaged with both sphincters, so it would seem that weakening both at the same time is doubly related in weakening the floor.

I haven't studied anatomy but my lived experience is that they ARE linked and in degrading my urinary control through disuse, I have also degraded bowel control.  I have enough bowel control to manage things mostly but if something goes off the rails, I may not be able to hold it like I used to.  In TRYING to hold it, it seems that I also inhibit urination.

 

[BabyCat2]

On 8/16/2022 at 7:19 PM, Cute_Kitten said:

I've read of some people who originally just wanted urinary incontinence, but unintentionally ended up with both or had weakened control back there from diaper training themselves.  Other people seem to have no problem retaining bowel control while being urinary incontinent. it seems to be one of those "everybody's body is different, so your mileage may vary."  Just some food for thought. But if you do end up find yourself loosing bowel control along with bladder, you'd probably have time to put the brakes on/ adjust your diaper training as needed. 

How can I adjust my unpotty training I've now had to poos one yesterday and one today. And sick part is I can't feel them I don't want poo incontinence I just want urine incontinence 

[babykeiff]

On 8/17/2022 at 12:25 AM, BabyCat2 said:

Good to know thanks so far haven't had any accident back there had one close call but made it in time.

 

So on another note how do I stay hydrated since after I drink I pee (flood/leak my pull up) 

Is this normal the good thing is then my bladder should be learning fast how to release 

A few things here, pull-ups are not usually good for an adult sized bladder, they can handle a weeping bladder, not a full wetting. Overnight they work for some as when some sleep, they relax their sphincters and their bladder weeps. This is one of the reasons one does not wake before / during wetting their overnight diapers / pull ups.

Wetting while drinking is a common reflex action that toilet trained individuals tend to supress. It seems that in your case, the act of wearign pull-ups / diapers allow that reflex to continue - which means that you are well on your way to revert to the pre toilet trained behaviour of using the diaper when ever there is content in your bladder / bowels.

Older babies wet via reflex when drinking, and mess via reflex when eating.

Babies don't wake before wetting / messing their diapers due to the older baby handling their need to void by just voiding. A yournger baby with less muscle tone does not even get informed of their need to void as it just leaks out. This type of 'lack of informing' is carried on to the older baby / toddler / pre- toilet trained child.

On 8/20/2022 at 12:03 AM, BabyCat2 said:

How can I adjust my unpotty training I've now had to poos one yesterday and one today. And sick part is I can't feel them I don't want poo incontinence I just want urine incontinence 

What is happening with your bladder / bowel control is your body is reverting to the pre toilet trained behaviour i.e. when your bladder and/or bowels have content in them, you are releasing same into your diapers. This is a pre programed behaviour you were taught within the first few weeks after birth - relax and sate the need and fuss / inform another of it. As I stated, pull ups are not good enough for this.

Although you do not want messy diapers, as a baby/child who wore diapers, you never made the difference - you just used the diapers when ever you needed... and this is what your body is reverting to.

To keep control of your bowels and loose bladder control will need you to do either A or B

A: Revert to full loss of control (what you already know) and then train to gain bowel control.

B: Train to loose bladder control only.... this is a lot more difficult as it requires learning a new behaviour rather than reverting to what is already known.

Most ABs that wish bladder loss only try 'B' and get frustrated as this is a new 'adult' behaviour rather than a baby behaviour. As a result, there is little link between your actual babyhood and only wetting diapers, which may not sate the 'AB' drive you have. It also means that you have to make a firm decision in what type of AB you wish to be. Will your 'mental drive' be sated by one or more of the following:-

• Baby type clothes
• Baby food
• Baby behaviour
• Diaper wearing
• Diaper usage
• Baby mind - ie the removal of responsibility for actions
• other (not listed)

As it is our 'mental drive' is what is driving some of us to diapers etc, and it needs to be sated, what sates it is not our choice. It is similar to being thirsty, one can try to sate thirst by eating bread etc to no avail... but the only thing that sates thirst is liquid (water etc). Our AB side is only sated by one or more of the behaviours listed.

Most of us do not 'examing' deeply what sates our AB drive - and just attempt to 'regress' hoping to sate the need. Sigmund Freud warns us not to attempt to analyse this too deeply as we may not be able to cope with the actual answer, and with the answer removes some of the drive and therefore, the ability to sate the need.

I suggest that you focus on 'A', reverting to the pre toilet trained behaviour and enjoy that behaviour. Althout you state that you have a high 'gag' reflex as the reason you do not want messy diapers, I would suspect that the high gag reflex is triggered by someone elses mess rather than your own. Also, a decent shower can clean one up completely from a messy accident, so it is nothing to really be scared off.

[BabyBoi91]

On 8/16/2022 at 8:31 PM, Enthusi said:

Boy and how!  That’s precisely where I am after 5 years of 24/7.  For all intents and purposes in diaper dependent when it comes to urinary control.  I’m no stranger to messing but  I have never pursued bowel incontinence and I don’t plan to.  That said there have been a handful of times where I felt an urge to poop and I just sort of give up trying to hold it in because I figure I have a diaper on and on rare occasions I had a legit accident.  
 

I don’t know how it is for you, @oznlbut I imagine it’s one of those  “woah moments” you had referred to in a previous thread.   As in: 

- “Woah, I accidentally pooped myself!” And

- “Woah, it’s no big deal that I accidentally pooped myself!”

Yeah @Enthusi I actually tried using a pull-up for a few days and ended with several accidents, including one #2 accident that I didn’t realizing leading to a small case of diaper rash. 
 

While the diaper rash was annoying, the accidents were a good reminder that I got what I wanted and I def need diapers (or at the very least pull-ups). 
 

back in diapers now to be safe . ?

[BabyCat2]

4 hours ago, babykeiff said:

A few things here, pull-ups are not usually good for an adult sized bladder, they can handle a weeping bladder, not a full wetting. Overnight they work for some as when some sleep, they relax their sphincters and their bladder weeps. This is one of the reasons one does not wake before / during wetting their overnight diapers / pull ups.

Wetting while drinking is a common reflex action that toilet trained individuals tend to supress. It seems that in your case, the act of wearign pull-ups / diapers allow that reflex to continue - which means that you are well on your way to revert to the pre toilet trained behaviour of using the diaper when ever there is content in your bladder / bowels.

Older babies wet via reflex when drinking, and mess via reflex when eating.

Babies don't wake before wetting / messing their diapers due to the older baby handling their need to void by just voiding. A yournger baby with less muscle tone does not even get informed of their need to void as it just leaks out. This type of 'lack of informing' is carried on to the older baby / toddler / pre- toilet trained child.

What is happening with your bladder / bowel control is your body is reverting to the pre toilet trained behaviour i.e. when your bladder and/or bowels have content in them, you are releasing same into your diapers. This is a pre programed behaviour you were taught within the first few weeks after birth - relax and sate the need and fuss / inform another of it. As I stated, pull ups are not good enough for this.

Although you do not want messy diapers, as a baby/child who wore diapers, you never made the difference - you just used the diapers when ever you needed... and this is what your body is reverting to.

To keep control of your bowels and loose bladder control will need you to do either A or B

A: Revert to full loss of control (what you already know) and then train to gain bowel control.

B: Train to loose bladder control only.... this is a lot more difficult as it requires learning a new behaviour rather than reverting to what is already known.

Most ABs that wish bladder loss only try 'B' and get frustrated as this is a new 'adult' behaviour rather than a baby behaviour. As a result, there is little link between your actual babyhood and only wetting diapers, which may not sate the 'AB' drive you have. It also means that you have to make a firm decision in what type of AB you wish to be. Will your 'mental drive' be sated by one or more of the following:-

• Baby type clothes
• Baby food
• Baby behaviour
• Diaper wearing
• Diaper usage
• Baby mind - ie the removal of responsibility for actions
• other (not listed)

As it is our 'mental drive' is what is driving some of us to diapers etc, and it needs to be sated, what sates it is not our choice. It is similar to being thirsty, one can try to sate thirst by eating bread etc to no avail... but the only thing that sates thirst is liquid (water etc). Our AB side is only sated by one or more of the behaviours listed.

Most of us do not 'examing' deeply what sates our AB drive - and just attempt to 'regress' hoping to sate the need. Sigmund Freud warns us not to attempt to analyse this too deeply as we may not be able to cope with the actual answer, and with the answer removes some of the drive and therefore, the ability to sate the need.

I suggest that you focus on 'A', reverting to the pre toilet trained behaviour and enjoy that behaviour. Althout you state that you have a high 'gag' reflex as the reason you do not want messy diapers, I would suspect that the high gag reflex is triggered by someone elses mess rather than your own. Also, a decent shower can clean one up completely from a messy accident, so it is nothing to really be scared off.

Thank you so much yes I guess I will just do A. And then ill work on gaining bowel control after fully incontinent. I watch baby/toddler shows whenever I can and I even just recently bought a paci unfortunately its way to little but still fun to suck on and I have a sippy cup. And toddler clothes I already pretty much wear those already since I love my cartoon shirts

[Rob110]

On 8/16/2022 at 7:25 PM, BabyCat2 said:

Good to know thanks so far haven't had any accident back there had one close call but made it in time.

 

So on another note how do I stay hydrated since after I drink I pee (flood/leak my pull up) 

Is this normal the good thing is then my bladder should be learning fast how to release 

I would recommend switching to tapped diapers as they are easier to change when out and about and leak less often as they fit better snd are more absorbent especially a premium diaper like Betterdry or megamax

its been almost 9 years for me and I went through the trial and error stage and after a few accidents that left me standing in a puddle I switched to premium diapers and leaks are almost a thing of the past

 

[babykeiff]

On 9/9/2022 at 2:42 PM, Rob110 said:

... and leaks are almost a thing of the past

 

All babies diapers leak at times... its part of being a baby in diapers

[stevewet]

Relax and let it flow whenever you need to go.

[babykeiff]

On 9/9/2022 at 2:42 PM, Rob110 said:

...especially a premium diaper...

Premium ABDL diapers are designed to contain wet, and not usually mess. As a result, tend to leak mess when one messes in them. A babies diaper is designed to be loose/have space around the rear so it can contain mess. If one sees an actual baby in a diaper, the diaper can come down to close to the knees. An ABDL diaper is designed to be thick, and its selling point is it can hold 1000ml - 6000ml of liquid. A medical diaper is designed to be 'discrete' so it is thin, and usually can only hold up to 500ml or less.

If we put a baby in a diaper, a baby that is adult sized with that bowel / bladder control response, the diaper will need to have the same proportions to the 'adult sized baby' as a baby diaper is to a baby.  This means the ADBL will need a diaper one size larger than what would fit them, to allow the space for the mess. ie, if you normally fit into a medium, wear the large / xl size, and the onesie etc to hide same. Females can get away with this by wearing tights and a long dress over same to hide the diaper. The body will soon revert to not holding and voiding at its own whim.  To reinforce this, use a clock and only change at certain times - ie mid morning change out of your night diaper, mid evening change into a night diaper. Therefore you will only be using tweo types of diaper - a daytime one and a nighttime one (much thicker). Your body will revert to wetting on an almost constant  basis (your bladder fills, and empties without telling you almost every 15-30 minutes 24/7) and your bowels empty either just before a meal, during a meal, or just after a meal. This is the reflex action of the bowels - triggered by the smell of a meal being prepared, and/or eating a meal.

Once you have reverted to the autonomic voiding, you can reduce the thickness / size of the diaper and change more often - ie on wake up, after breakfast, before/after lunch, before/after evining meal, before sleep - into a thicker nighttime diaper.

If you do all your changes in one room / area of your house, your body will accept that as the 'diaper changing area' and behave accordingly. Baby diaper usage is all about triggers, and triggers are all about smells and feelings.

@BabyCat2 - Diapers already trigger you to use same as a baby. All you have to do is reinforce the triggers, and you revert to the full 'baby usage' of using the diapers without you being informed about the state of your diapers and/or your bodies need to wet / mess. A baby doesn't need to know / care about the state of its diapers - that is the responsibility of another. All the baby cares about is the full feeling, that is sates when and wherever it is - into whatever it is wearing. A baby rarely gets the 'full feeling' as its bladder / bowels empty via triggers - of drinking / eating / smell of food / feel of diaper, and at times, stress or shock. A baby will wet/mess its diaper if scared and/or frustrated. A baby throwing a tantrum will also be wetting / messing its diaper at the same time - only it does not know about that. Also, a baby will wet via gravity - ie when lying down, there is little pressure on its bladder, so the bladder will weep. When the baby contracts its muscles to stand up / is standing / is lifted, the weight of its internal organs press on its bladder causing the babys to wet. This feeling of the rush of urine being different, causes some babies to laugh. It is also something that has been supressed during toilet training - enjoying the sensation of wetting oneself so much one laughs.

What I suggest is that when you feel yourself needing to wet/mess OR are wetting / messing, to enjoy the sensation and giggle at same = remove the supression of that event.

You will eventually start to giggle etc when you need to wet/mess, but will not be told of your need to wet/mess and just wet/mess your diaper almost autonomically. You will also again, as in pre toilet trained, start to enjoy the warm wet feeling of a squishy diaper. Waking up with a warm squishy diaper will cause great, almost euphoric pleasure. This has the trigger to tell your subcontious to wet / mess when asleep so to trigger the euphoria. Due to toilet training, when one needs to wet / mess while asleep, it triggers you to wake. Enjoying the feel of a warm squishy diaper, and giggling on how squishy it is, tends to supress the trigger that wakes you when you need to wet / mess = you will wet / mess freely while asleep... the pre-toilet trained action.

Contrary to what P&G advertise, a baby does not wake from a wet / messy diaper.  The diaper is warm and comfortable, the baby has been taught to use diaper for its eliminations, and the baby is happy doing so. What wakes a baby is a disturbance - either noise or light or temperature. Once the baby is awake, might cry for attention - since it has been taught to do so - after it fills its diaper - and another will take care of it. That is IF it is aware that it has filled its diaper. Most babies are unaware of that since the baby filled its diaper during its sleep. It is their parent / career that notices such, and changes the baby. The baby is aware of the warm squishy feeling between its legs, and will explore (play) with that feeling. Since this 'feeling' is repeated so often (after every nap / sleep) almost 4+ times per 24 hours (or greater depending on the amount of naps a baby takes) for a period of 2+ years, approx 3000 times, this feeling is euphoric to the baby, and also the ABDL.

Similar occurs to bedwetters - they are unaware that during their sleep that they wet, and also when the wake. It is not until they check - via touch / smell, do they realise that they have wet during their sleep. Do to the fact that we only remember the dream we had just before we wake, if we have the classic 'pee dream' it is our subcontious telling us that we have wet sometime while we slept. Some think that if we wake during that event, we could prevent the bedwetting. Since the 'pee dream' is information of a past event, we wet, probably 3-4 hours ago, even if we wake during the pee dream, we would wake to a wetting that occured 3-4 hours ago. Most bedwetting occur not due to an actual wetting, but more due to the total relaxation of the relevant muscles - which takes on average 30-90 mins before one is in a deep enough sleep. As a result, the bladder weeps. We don't instantly recall the 'pee dream'. It is not until we have checked if we are in a wet bed do we remember the dream. This is how the contious mind works - give it a trigger (similar to a key word search) and the subcontious mind will search for an event that matches the key word. The most recent match will be the 'pee dream'. If you ask the subcontious to search again only deeper, it will not find the wetting event. It really does not know when you wet, as you wet when you were in such a deep sleep to relax all muscles (including your bladder sphincter).

A baby wets / messes its diapers exactly the same way - it cannot recall when it wet/messed. All it knows is that it's diapers are warrm and squishy. It does know (sometimes) when it is wetting / messing - but the trigger are to make it laugh from the feelings, and let it happen. The baby was told, from birth, that it is expected to wet / mess in its diapers - so the baby just does that.  

Bedwetting is caused by deep sleep - and one of the failures of medical science, it does not address the 'deep sleep' issue, but tries to reduce the amount of urine being produced by adding chemicals to effect water balance in the body. This has the reverse effect, as the body reduces manufacture of the same chemical. As a result, the child taking that drug may be dry day 1 / 2, but will be in a worse situation from then on since the body is no longer producing the chemical to reduce water production in the bladder. (See vasprossen etc)... and will not revert to producing it until 3-4 weeks later. As a result, the child will wet almost constantly overnight - roughly in proportion to size, the same s/he wet when s/he was a baby. Since most babies as they grow, increase their water production, overnight it will get to a stage where one diaper will not be absorbant enough for the baby. Thus, the overnight diaper will leak / need to be changed to cope. Some babies are placed in the next size up diaper overnight to cope.

Carrying this on to the child that has been taking vasprossen for bedwetting, after 2-3 days the diaper size that his child needs to cope with the overnight wetting is now one to two sizes larger than would fit that child - and that is for about 2-3 weeks until the childs body reverts to producing vasprossen.    

The most effective cure to bedwetting is letting the body deal with it. Diapers / pull-ups are reinforcement to the infantile act of voiding - when the body will revert to full wetting as and when needed. It it common for bedwetters who wear pull-ups etc at night to develop weak daytime bladder issues and visa versa (those with daytime baldder control issues who wear protection during the day to develop night time issues which will revert to full autonomic voiding based on triggers)

To cure bedwetting is easy - remove the stress and increase the time spent in bed = increase the lenght and quality of sleep. The normal intervention some parents do when they have a bedwetting child adds to the stress levels of the child, which increases the tiredness of the child, deepens the level of sleep of the child, and increases the bedwetting. One has to create a total stress free environment for the child by accepting that bedwetting is part of childhood - and that given the proper environment, the child will grow out of it. A disposable underpad will protect the bed, and allow the child to place same before sleep / and remove and dispose of it in the morning. Letting the child sleep in the nude / without bottoms removes the need for laundry of pyjamas, plus the underpad being disposable, the associated smell of a urine is never allowed to grow. A morning shower wiht the same shower gel etc as used by parent (not being bathed by parent), removes smell - and also inforces the 'adult' behaviour. This is treating the child as if s/he is an adult - where the act of wetting the bed is being totally ignored as if it doesn't exist.

Some here were chastised / abused / infantilised due to their bedwetting - which created their desire for ABDL i.e. seeking a time when bedwetting / pants wetting was accepted - and the feeling of waking up in a warm squishy diaper was euphoric.... and the associated love and care given to you by another as they changed you out of your night diaper into another diaper for you to make warm and squishy all over again.

It really is unusual that there is not more ABDLs in the world.... but I suspect there is, just those people tend to hide it a little more. 20-40% of the age group 5-16 year report wet the bed. Due to puberty changes, this figure should be close to 80-90% of of the age group 5-16 year olds. Due to simle maths, that makes 40-60% percent of of the age group 5-16 year who wet the bed were chastised / abused / infantilised due to their bedwetting. This creates ABDLs out of these, which is a life time behaviour.   

One can see the infantile sucking action in those that smoke - one of the main triggers of smoking. 23% of the world population smoke. That would be 23% of the world population use a cigarette / cigar etc as a replacement for their pacifier. Prior to the recent drive to reduce smoking in adults 60+% of the world were smokers.

Totaling these figures would be 60% smokers / ex smokers plus 10-20% ex bedwetters who never smoked = 80% of the world population who have some link to the ABDL interest. Compare this to the adult 78% to baby 22% ratio with the sale of adult diapers being twice that of baby diapers, this would work out at 44% (twice 22) to 80% (combined ex smokers and bedwetters) of the world population have some link to ABDL. The reason it is being denied is the due to the abuse that these bedwetters suffered during childhood. What a lot of people assume (incorrectly) that if one wets the bed at night and/or wets their pants during the day and/or choses to wear diapers / some protective garment to contain wet/mess, they have somehow failed to advance from babyhood to adulthood.

These are hidden ABDLs, most of which deny to themselves and others that they are ABDL.

Your actions are not unique. One can easily state that you are just copying up to 80% of the world population.   

[FretaBWet]

@babykeiffI seldom have any real disagreement with your advice or opinions but in this instance I must reply to your post above. I have had bladder issues my entire life. I was a nightly bed wetter from birth until I was broken shortly before I turned 18. As I was born in 1953 there were no drugs available to take for my bladder issues. You are absolutely right about sleeping deeply and wetting at night, I never woke up at night to the need to pee, I just woke up soaked each morning.

My parents didn't diaper me for bed after 4 or 5 years old (not sure exactly when) and they didn't punish me or verbally abuse me for it. They just put a flocked back rubber sheet on my bed when I was young and at some point they bought a fitted vinyl sheet for my mattress. Most of the time nothing was said about my wetting. According to your post this would cure me of bed wetting but I can assure you it did not. I was a heavy wetter and there were many mornings where even the top sheet and blanket had to be washed because they were soaked too. I suspect that I rolled around in bed and wrapped myself up in the blanket in an unconscious desire to stay warm. I think it was a mistake that is unlike you to say curing bed wetting is easy because you are always constructive in your posts.

My parents did not infantilize me with night diapers yet I have a lifelong unbreakable diaper fetish so not using diapers at night so your child can be comfortable will not necessarily mean they will not have a diaper fetish. Sorry about all the knots in that paragraph.

Hugs,

Freta

[babykeiff]

@FretaBWet you are close, and your parents may not have wanted to infantilize you, but the diaper changing unintentionally did. You were changed into a night diaper from birth until you were 4/5. It was expected of you to wet the bed - so diapers were put on you, and it was kept to be 'your secret - between you parent(s) and yourself'. I presume that the reason that your parents stopped diapering you for bed is when you started going to playschool / kindergarden etc hoping that treating you as a 'big boy/girl' might get you to stop bed wetting. However, you had become comfortable wetting your night diapers - and were already an ABDL, but without the 'A'.

Side question -

13 hours ago, FretaBWet said:

...I was broken shortly before I turned 18...

 

... what broke you of the habit, if you don't mind answering?

I stated that curing bed wetting is easy. I omitted to state that it is even easier to muck it up... and it is how and when one was toilet trained that causes the issue, not the actual bed wetting per-say. It is the extremly rare person that do not go through a phase of (secondary noturnal enuresis) bedwetting at some time in their childhood. However, it is even rarer for a bedwetter to not be, in some way interested / attached to ABDL.   

 

Toilet Training, at what age, and why is it taking longer and longer each generation...

Babies born after 1940/45 diapers were covered by a plastic pant of some form. As as result, you got used to being in a wet diaper, and trying to train you out of that habit was difficult. Babies born prior to 1940/45 were changed very quickly after they wet / messed AS there were no diaper covers to speak about. Yes, there were knitted ones etc, but a knitted on stops some wetness, but needs to be washed also - increased laundry considering when a baby wets, s/he wets his/her diaper, all his/her clothes and whatever the baby is sitting / lying on. Diaper covers etc were only used when the baby was 'out' at a function etc. Nighttime, a wet diaper = wet sleeper, cot, bedclothes etc.

As a result, most babies prior to 1945 were trained within 10-14 months of birth (as soon as they really could walk, some even earlier). Plastic pants etc contain wetness - so careers clothes / furniture etc does not get wet, so the baby gets used to being wet, and then indifferent about it. All this does is decrease the drive for a baby to not be in wet diapers etc. The  disposable 'stay dry' diaper decreases the drive so much, that some babies are in diapers up to 12-14 (and some here even older ? ). 

• Babies born 2016+ generation, (5-6 year old today) 30%-50% on the class starting school are still dependent on diapers. Toilet trained age 5 / 6+ year old.

Babies diapers changed from tape on to mainly pull on. As a result, actual toilet training is now more difficult as the child does not 'know' s/he is wearing a pull up diaper or a pull up underwear. To address this issue, diaper manufacturers created a limited run of 'wet feel' / training pull-ups. It seems that the accountants of these firms stopped the production of same - as it would cause the 'customer - baby' to dry up faster and earlier = a reduction in profit.  

• Babies born 2006+ generation, 5%-15% on the class starting school are still dependent on diapers. Toilet trained age 4/5 year old.

Pull-up type diaper created (for bed wetting etc) - to fit the 'larger child'

• Babies born 1996+ generation, 0.5%-1.5% on the class starting school are still dependent on diapers. Toilet trained age 3/4 year old.

SAP used in disposable diapers etc.

• Babies born 1986+ generation, Toilet trained age 2/3 year old.

Disposable diapers became 'stay dry and thicker'

• Babies born 1976+ generation, Toilet trained age 20 mth / 2.5 years old

Disposable diaper invented and used instead of cloth

• Babies born 1966+ generation, Toilet trained age 18 mth / 22 mth old.

Widespread use of washing machines

• Babies born 1956+ generation, Toilet trained age 16 mth / 20 mth old.

Plastic pants introduced

• Babies born up to 1946+ generation, Toilet trained age 10 mths to 14 mths. Normally a baby was toilet trained before s/he reached age 1. This is also due to the labour involved in cloth diaper laundry. To reduce this, the baby was held over a potty, almost from birth, so s/he did not mess in his/her diaper. A diaper was only used overnight, and the baby used to be mostly naked. As a result, the baby got instant feedback from wetting etc.

[FretaBWet]

@babykeiffto answer your question, my mother was given a bet wetting alarm by the mother of a friend of mine. Our mothers knew each other casually and my friends younger sister was a bed wetter also. It worked for her so she passed it along so my mother so she could use it on me. They do work but the cost is too high in my opinion. My bladder was never very capable of going a long time without relief so the alarm created a situation where I could keep my bed dry but at the cost of almost never getting a night's sleep without having to wake up and get out of bed.

Your observation of me being ABDL without the A was accurate. I did want to wear diapers and I always assumed my desire for being in diapers was due to all my issues with bed wetting at night and daytime accidents frequently. I think the cause of my being ABDL is far more complicated than I thought it was but at the end of the day it doesn't matter why.

Hugs,

Freta

[babykeiff]

2 hours ago, FretaBWet said:

@babykeiffto answer your question, my mother was given a bet wetting alarm by the mother of a friend of mine. Our mothers knew each other casually and my friends younger sister was a bed wetter also. It worked for her so she passed it along so my mother so she could use it on me. They do work but the cost is too high in my opinion. My bladder was never very capable of going a long time without relief so the alarm created a situation where I could keep my bed dry but at the cost of almost never getting a night's sleep without having to wake up and get out of bed.

Your observation of me being ABDL without the A was accurate. I did want to wear diapers and I always assumed my desire for being in diapers was due to all my issues with bed wetting at night and daytime accidents frequently. I think the cause of my being ABDL is far more complicated than I thought it was but at the end of the day it doesn't matter why.

Hugs,

Freta

I have, in Home > Diaper Talk > Incontinence - Medical > Bedwetters > Bedwetting - causes, cures and failures....    identified the role of vasopressin and how it effects ones night time control. In your case, and with a lot of bed wetters, I suspect may have issues within their hypothalamus, and how it regulates vasopressin. S.N.E. is only the side effect. In your case, you sacrafice rest in order to stay dry overnight - which in my humble opinion, is not good for you, or your stress and/or I.Q. levels. You need uninteruppted sleep for your mind, primarily, to sort all its inputs from the day. Without it, you will slowly 'overfill' your short term memory etc which will make you 'foggy', uncordinated etc.

In the 60s*, a study was carried out on the memory effects of shift workers, and it was discovered that long term sleep reduction (ie sleeping 4-5 hours instead of the approx 7.5 hours per night, or disturbed sleep - waking every 2/3 hours) reduces the brain function to about 10-12% of what was normal. = one looses the ability to perform tasks that they had mastered in the first 6-12 months of their life. This is exagerated the younger the person is - i.e. 5-10 year olds need approx 9+ hours undisturbed sleep, 10-16 year olds need 8+ hours undisturbed. 3-5 year olds need 12+ hours undisturbed sleep. The key is not 'sleep', but undisturbed sleep. The idea of numerous 'cat naps' to add up to the sleep level, science has identified that as a myth.

There are some people that supposedly don't sleep, but under scientific examination it has been found to be false.    

Vasopressin dependency

Simply, the body creates urine on a 24/7/365 basis - it is needed for fluid to pass the cell walls with food / waste materials.

In tests, Krimimologie states one can do without food for 8-21 days while the British Medical Journal extends this to about 40 days. However, one can only survive without water a maximum of 3 days. That is in the range of 3000ml / 24 hours with a urine output to match. Bladder capacity is circa 300ml = filling and emptying 10 times per 24 hours. This equates filing and voiding every 2.4 hours. The ideal water intake is 4000ml+, and the higher the intake, the more capable the brain is in processing. Think of water as the fluid used to cool the brain (processor)... and the 'cooler' the brain is, the faster it can work and the smarter you are.

In a person 18-55 year old range, enough urine is produced to fill the bladder on average, every 2 hours depending on the fluids intake. Overnight, to ensure the body can rest, ADH is released, and level is controlled from the hypothalamus mainly to reduce the quanty of fluid entering the bladder, thus ensuring a person doesn't need to void = waking up and disturbing sleep. A pre-toilet trained person does not create such high levels of ADH = their bladder fills, and empties overnight. A bedwetter and/or those with issues with ADH production and/or their hypothalamus either disturb their sleep - wake to void OR do not wake and wet their bed / diapers.

Additional Edit: It was only as recent as 1982* that it was discovered how critical R.E.M. sleep is to learning and recollection, (20 years ago) so in reality, for your local 40+ old doctor / physician not to be aware of the intricities of needing night diapers to help one to get the required sleep, it is not unusual.

See also: History of Sleep Research - by Dr Carl Rosenberg, specialized in sleep medicine and neurology. He is also certified by the American Board of Sleep Disorders Medicine and the American Board of Psychology and Neurology

Conclusion

With a required 7-8 hour sleep duration, the bladder, without ADH, will fill 4+ times = getting up every 2+ hours OR wetting the bed /diaper. For the sake of your brain, and ultimately your life, wear diapers at night, and be happy.

*1956 Burwell; 1958 Lerner; 1968 Rechtschaffen / Kales; 1982 Smith