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iraq got a better health system than US aka US got the worst system in the world

according to "US" ur supposed to just lay down and die if u cant pay for the threatment

thank god i didnt get born there

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As far as I know, nobody in the US is refused treatment. The health care in the US is second to none. Look at all the illegals that are draining our hospitals. How are they getting treatment? Stick to your own country that you know and love where you are taxed 60%!

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That's what my taxes pay for. LOL.

and my taxes and insurence too, but i dont mind i think the medical sould be free to all .. dose a viris care if your illigal . i for one would do what ever i could to get my loved ones the best care i could .. if that ment crossing a border fine by me

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If you have full-time employment in the US your employer is obligated to provide some sort of coverage at a flat fee--the employer pays the majority. It typically ranges from $0-$40 month for a single person, more for families.

My previous employer paid 100%, which was nice. I only had to come up with $10 copay for doctor's visits.

My present employer offers a range of plans from free to $40 a month. I signed up to the most expensive one, but I also signed up for an additional employee health program that gives me a $30 credit per month. So my coverage is presently $120 per year, though I have to come up with 10% of all expenses with a $1500 annual cap. But I hit that annual limit in the first or second month, so from there everything is paid for the year

You generally only have to self-pay for insurance if you are self-employed. A lot of self-employed groups (farmers, etc) band together and do a group insurance purchase to offset the fees.

Horseshit. The self-employed are not the only people buying their own insurance, employers don't always pay the majority, and it sure as hell isn't $40 a month. Yes, SOME businesses are able to offer plans like that, but they are not obligated to. I work for a small business (somewhere between 25 and 30 employees) and insurance is NOT offered. My boss was looking into it earlier this year, and if we wanted to get it, we would have had to pay about $60 a WEEK (that's right, WEEK, not month)...and that's for the single people.

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Horseshit. The self-employed are not the only people buying their own insurance, employers don't always pay the majority, and it sure as hell isn't $40 a month.

Well, I'm not lying, I've been working longer than you have, and that's what it has always been for me. I know some small employers are exempt from providing insurance (at least in my state, you have to be pretty small to get away with it). But I would never work for a company that did not provide insurance. I would not even consider it.

I would be amazed if it is legal anywhere for a company with that many employees, unless you're less than full time. If it is, I suggest you move on to a new job.

Please don't tell me I am lying.

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I agree that the US does need a revamping of the health care system because there are some parts of it that are unfair. However, I don't really suggest we go to a universal healthcare plan like most countries in Europe. I have friends that had a little girl almost die because they were relying on Germany's national healthcare system for their daughter. The thing was so backed up that when their little girl had RSV, they almost weren't able to get her a hospital bed in time! Needless to say, they started paying for private insurance after that.

I do think that the income guidelines for things like Children's Medicaid should be raised - and their benefits for psychiatric care (etc) should be enhanced. However, it isn't true that in America they just let you lay down on the street and die. Every ER in America is required to treat you regardless of your ability to pay. Sure, if you don't pay it'll go on your credit report, but if you're in that much trouble your credit report is probably in bad shape anyway. Also, at least in Texas, ever county has a hospital. These hospitals often offer free or low cost treatments on a variety of things on a first come first serve basis until those funds are depleted. In our county, you can also take in your property tax receipt and have your property taxes deducted from your hospital bill.

Even for private insurance in America, it's not THAT expensive (depending on what you want). A good basic health insurance plan with a reasonable deductible will cost you less than $150 a month for an individual. Sure, the more coverage you want, the more you have to shell out upfront. However, I hardly think $150 is all that much to pay to not end up having to get on waiting lists to get tests done or surgeries preformed, or to have to appeal to a government council for a second opinion! Also, most GP's in my area only charge about $70 for an appointment. (I've seen them range anywhere from $50 to $95 - though the $95 was actually a pediatrician). If you're REALLY sick, $70 isn't all that much. Trust me, I paid it often enough when I was temporarily uninsured, or when the local doctor wasn't on my insurance plan and I couldn't see spending the time and gas money to drive a sick child over an hour away to find a doctor who was.

Of course, if you're seriously ill, then finding insurance is harder. However, in every national healthcare system I've seen, getting top of the line treatment is JUST as hard. At least here, if you're disabled to the point you can't work, you can get SSI and Medicaid.

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Even for private insurance in America, it's not THAT expensive (depending on what you want). A good basic health insurance plan with a reasonable deductible will cost you less than $150 a month for an individual. Sure, the more coverage you want, the more you have to shell out upfront. However, I hardly think $150 is all that much to pay to not end up having to get on waiting lists to get tests done or surgeries preformed, or to have to appeal to a government council for a second opinion! Also, most GP's in my area only charge about $70 for an appointment. (I've seen them range anywhere from $50 to $95 - though the $95 was actually a pediatrician). If you're REALLY sick, $70 isn't all that much. Trust me, I paid it often enough when I was temporarily uninsured, or when the local doctor wasn't on my insurance plan and I couldn't see spending the time and gas money to drive a sick child over an hour away to find a doctor who was.

I pay over 9000 per year for one adult one child and then pay the first 3000 before they start kicking in 80%. Family insurance

was 13000 per year. this is the price of group health care that you pay the full cost for.

*huggies* baby eddie

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I don't think our health service is too bad, and the things that are bad about it are down to mismanagement of the funds by our Government, rather than lack of ability on the part of the overworked staff.

One thing I will say though, too many people in the UK see it as a free service. It's not free, we pay for it in our taxes. The only people that don't pay anything for it are the unemployed and illegal immigrants, and even they don't get it free because people like me pay for them in our taxes too.

Beth

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right now health insurers and life insurers are seeing profits of about 300 billions a year. u realise that it is after everybody is paid off and that money just goes to the owners/shareholders.

its fine to be capitalist and all, but there are things that should not be capitalized on. health care is one of them.

now you think we would have problems in this country with nationalized health. first of all you must realize that to generate profits of this magnitude, the current companies have to overcharge by a lot. and then not everybody requires the care at the same point in time.

if Obama makes it happen, you can see a cut in current prices for health care that will remove this profit margin. a government institution does not run for profits.

then, once this 300 billion is cut off the current insurrance prices, expect your employers to give this money back that they spend on plans for their employees to them, wich will go back again in taxes to found the universal system.

instead of being selfish, now ur gonna end up helping others. for a majorly christian nation, you'd think that its not too hard to digest, right ? seriously.

unless you make over 50 000$ a year you cant afford healthcare. current plans are bad. unless u pay 500$ a month they wont give you everything. you'll have to dish out between 2000-10 000$ if you ever need anything serious done to you.

most of us have to plan before spending this much money. this is something rather essential. if you barely have the 10 000$ to buy a car for exemple, you can chose to not buy it. when the health crisis strikes you.. there is no choice.. and all your plans are off for the next 5 years or so, while them over there are laughing and are happy you got sick.

it gets even worse when you make less money. can you imagine what a bill like that does to a family that barely makes it with 25k/year ?

its not like 33% of the country makes over that 50k mark i gave above. its more like 15-20% ..

waiting is much better than having your life wrecked because of a nasty bill on your ass. if you cant afford it, its not just that bill that you have to pay.. you can also say goodbye to your chances to ever own a house with a wrecked credit score.. or a car .. or anything else to make your life more enjoyable.

in these days, we should be past the surviving. private healthcare is for those who are living and to kill those who are surviving.

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If you remain ambulatory, they probably won't resort to a full brief. Unless your incontinence is neurogenic in origin and you have absolutely no warning that you're about to pass urine(more rare than most people think), it's usually just easier and 'more dignified' for them to provide a urinal if you can't get out of bed.

For instance, when I had a really terrible muscle spasm in my neck and couldn't really sit up without suffering a pain level of about 9 on a scale of 1-10. I had an issue where I really had to pee while I was in the hospital room, they just provided me with a female urinal and I fanangled into a position where I could use it w/o hurting myself too much.

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Eddie,

I'm sorry you're getting such a bad deal. However, I've shopped for insurance several times, and never had to pay anywhere close to what you are. Maybe you need to do more research before you buy in next year.

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Oh i get to finally tell this story!!

Okay, so Mommy had to go to the hospital for some reason or another and she was like passed out hardcore from all the drugs, and due to something she had to get like a super big enema, and Mommy told me that she was barely awake... but she could feel how she was about to mess herself, and a nurse was shaking her, holding up a super big diaper, saying "If you dont wake up and use the bathroom, you'll have to go in a diaper" and Mommy was so out of it from all the drugs, but she still managed to get to the bathroom.

When she told me I said that she should have just taken the diaper... acted like she was completely passed out. Less effort on her part, plus she got to be diapered by a nurse, plus she'd have to get cleaned up by one later, and she'd have an excuse to wear a diaper. It's not involving the nurse in her fetish or anything because it was offered for one... and for two, it was probably better for her health... Mommy was so delusional, she shouldn't have been walking anyway.

And Mommy doesn't mind being babied sometimes... so she probably wouldn't have minded messing a diaper. She's done it. And on top of that, she really likes the humiliation... just like me... so it would have been an interesting experience.

Oh well. I'm just glad she came out alive. I got really scared... but i tend to overreact.

-Sophie

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Eddie,

I'm sorry you're getting such a bad deal. However, I've shopped for insurance several times, and never had to pay anywhere close to what you are. Maybe you need to do more research before you buy in next year.

I did research it along with several others in the same boat needing insurance and there were not better options.

This is a group plan but I pay 100% of the cost so if you are subsidized by your employee, or single or have

very limited coverage it should be cheaper.

*huggies*

baby eddie

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  • 10 years later...

I often think people who have insurance are charged more, I'm UK so in theory everything is free at the point of use, but there are many things that NHS won't provide, we pay about $12 for prescription meds, unless over 65/on a low income or unemployed, unless you have savings,,,

Please don't get me started about wealthy pensioners getting free prescriptions, bus travel, and TV Licences!!!

 

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IMO healthcare, like everything, the more the government gets involved the worse it is for the working middleclass.  Free market may be chaotic, but compared to thousands of bureaucrats it does a far better job of regulating supply & demand and keeping cost down.

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On 4/19/2019 at 11:54 AM, WBxx said:

IMO healthcare, like everything, the more the government gets involved the worse it is for the working middleclass.  Free market may be chaotic, but compared to thousands of bureaucrats it does a far better job of regulating supply & demand and keeping cost down.

I agree with you 100%.  The more involvement by the government the more corrupt and useless the endeavor becomes.

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On 4/19/2019 at 10:54 AM, WBxx said:

IMO healthcare, like everything, the more the government gets involved the worse it is for the working middleclass.  Free market may be chaotic, but compared to thousands of bureaucrats it does a far better job of regulating supply & demand and keeping cost down.

Keeping costs down? Not so with healthcare in the US. We pay more for the exact same meds- sometimes hundreds of times the prices the rest of the world pays. I can go to places elsewhere in the world who have healthcare which is deemed to be good and get an entire sex-change surgery done for what 3 days of laying in a hospital bed costs here, that before you add in Meds and treatments. The government could do the job better even with all their inherent inefficiencies. What we've got now id politicians who are heavily invested in insurers and big pharma who are getting rich by not implementing regulations which could improve things. In doing nothing they can plausibly deny any conflict of interest so that's exactly what they do. Looking worldwide there are many nations with lower GDP numbers who have much better healthcare than the average American gets and done at lower costs too. Of those many, almost all have near-universal healthcare coverage at least for serious conditions requiring a hospital stay or surgery. 

We could do similar here without much cost by simply eliminating the for-profit aspect and by eliminating the waste of excessive malpractice lawsuits and the costs of malpractice insurance by making Doctors face their responsibility better and by eliminating all the closed doors of the AMA where bad Doctors get what is essentially a free pass to continue being bad for decades if not forever. Nobody is doing anything in the US to look after our healthcare unless you're rich with massive insurance coverage- then you can get the best of everything while most people barely get decent treatment. The problem is inherent in the system and has only been getting worse,m and as bad as Government usually does with out money they would be hard pressed to do any worse than what we've got now.

Before you offer political-based opinions you should do some research on how the many Countries of the world address healthcare for their people and see the many ways it can be successfully done at very reasonable cost. Then you'll understand why the US has second-class or worse healthcare compared to any other major Nation. Unless you're rich that is, and that is always the end outcome of all totally free-market approaches to everything. A totally free market always creates a small number of those who have and a huge portion of those who have not, and of the latter the former keeps the doors to change closed when the rich rule over the rest. Being rich should not be penalized but neither should it be given any power beyond it's percentage of population, and the masses should always set the rules everyone has to live by. Healthcare should be deemed a human right and treated as such with all involved being responsible for doing their part to not be an unnecessary burden on anyone else.

Bettypooh

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While I too like to avoid anything that seems political in nature, I must respond to this latest post about our healthcare and medical systems in the USA.  I strongly disagree with what you say  that they are not at the top of the tier when it comes to the best in the world.  IE Mayo, St Jude, Cleveland clinic, the Cancer centers of America etc!

I see first hand all the international people coming to Mn for treatments not possible any where other in the world.  I see continued breakthrough in curing serious health issues IE Bubble boy syndrome was just solved, Aids is about to be solved I believe, and some forms of cancer have become treatable and survivable. 

I see huge advancements in robotic surgery, or much less invasive treatments that used to require more cutting, more hospital time etc.  Myself, I am scheduled for a heart pacemaker that is now solid enough to withstand even MRI magnetic pulses.  I have already had a heart ablation to resolve eradic heart beating, and all paid for not by a rich uncle, but by an insurance system some of which was a plan funded entirely by a company I worked for, and latter in retirement by medicare.  

I also see new drugs coming out on regular basis, things that treat symptoms that were not considered possible just a few years ago, and often used in combination with surgery to produce recovery rates that are fast, and nearing zero risk in many cases.  

Do you believe these breakthroughs are result of govt funded research?  If so,  there is still a lot of lakeside property in Arizona that can be purchased if you talk to the right people.

I do agree with one point you make, that attorneys have drastically impacted the cost of medical treatment.  For certain, many tests that are ordered are done so to cover a docs liability, silly or not.  I also believe that there is an alternative to this, look no farther then these same attorneys.  When have you seen an attorney lose a suite for malpractice, it never happens.  Rather they take care of the bad attorneys within, by disbarring many for wrong doing.  This could work as well in medical if it is allowed to by taking the ambulance chasers off the street in this country.

And last, I will make a few points about what is held up as the gold std by many these days, govt managed health care.  While I am now reliant on medicare that I paid dearly for over my working carrier, what I get is a fraction of what I had  with my company managed plan.  The premiums for my wife and my self when considering Part B, Part D and the necessary supplement are 3 times what I co paid for the company plan and coverage is not great.  I can't go to some of the specialists that I used to see, as they do not accept medicare patients due to reimbursement cost.   Try running a business where a high volume client expects to pay less than 50% of the going rate.  Even worse in Medicaid, as low as 20%.  This great system is putting providers out of business in record fashion.  A great example is nursing homes  closing at record paces across the Midwest due to many more patients being on Medicare or Medicaid, and this in areas where it can be least overcome and medical workers are already getting much lower wages than urban areas.

So please think this through a bit more and look closely at what we have before so many jump on the bandwagon of giving it all up for something that seems better as it is less expensive so they say.  Keep in mind, you always get what you pay for, and there is no magic pot of gold.  And finally remember the child hood story about the king that killed the goose that laid the golden eggs as we seem to be rushing toward this same outcome

 

 

 

 

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Any time government gets involved in something, they make it worse and nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program.

Look at student loans. Every time the government ups student aid the tuition goes up that much and more.

Same with healthcare. Medicare is prohibited from negotiating most things. If you want to force doctors and hospitals to be not-for-profit, you will watch doctors and hospitals exit the system at record rates! Even the UK has private hospitals and doctors that you can use if you are willing to pay the price instead of waiting in line for a year for a hip replacement.

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Medical bills in the USA is fake/inflated

IF you pay cash, the bill get cut in half or even lower, showing the true price, the price insurance pay, if you have insurance

At least I have a read a few stories about that

I have been to the hospital in Norway a few times and not paid a dime

Its also way beyond stupid that people risk their lives and others, by driving them self to the hospital, cause an ambulance cost too much!!  Should be free

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It's true that we lead the way when it comes to new treatments and meds, but when you look deeper you find that there are huge government grants funding most of the research so you're paying for it all now, and you pay again when you need that med or treatment. In the headlines recently we've seen where insulin prices have skyrocketed but did you wonder what was behind that? Nothing has changed in the world to cause that- it would be called price gouging in any other industry becausecthat's what it is. People either pay the price asked or die. Insurance to cover medical bills is just another for-profit industry which raises prices to the consumer without adding to the medical art. Show up at an emergency room and they ask who your insurer is before they ask what your medical issue is. My GP has a wall full of documents showing where he was head of research, head of surgery at highly acclaimed hospitals,  led the way in various researches and publications, and much more. He was one of the top Doctors in the nation and then he did something foolish- he walked away from the limelight and money to get good healthcare to those who didn't have insurance or lots of money. He saw what you don't see- the under-treated masses who deserve good treatment as much as the rich people do but who couldn't get that. He opened a small local practice where the first thing you do is sign an agreement to limit his liability in lieu of him carrying malpractice insurance and agree to handle all claims on any insurance you have by yourself. He told me that adding malpractice coverage would triple his costs and that having his staff do the insurance paperwork (like most Doctors do for you) would mean tripling his staff with the majority of them becoming non-productive medically. He saw the waste and profiteering in the system and decided to do something about it. Since he couldn't change the system all by himself he opted out of it. Where you or your insurance pays hundreds of dollars for 10 minutes of a Doctor's time he charges only $60. Where you need more time you pay vastly more but his price is fixed- whatever you need it's $60 no matter how long it takes. He's making a reasonable profit, not going broke or adding massively to his wealth. He sells some of the more common meds right there at his office for far less than the pharmacies do because he sells them at his cost.  So to get a simple treatment I pay around $100 but you or your insurer pays $500 for the exact same thing. That extra $400 you're paying isn't advancing the art of Medicine; it's going to investors who don't give a damn about you or your health- they only want your money and the current system lets them get it.

So yeah- we've got the best if you've got the money to buy it, which most people don't. So please explain to me why only rich people deserve good healthcare? Is there something bad when a person who has worked hard all their life not breaking any laws does not deserve to be treated for a disease unless they first sell their home and cease working so they can be eligible for Government assistance which you can't find anyone willing to take in lieu of cash? That's exactly what America does and it's not right. If we take the profiteering out of the system everyone could have good healthcare but the only way that's possible is for the Government to step in and regulate things- it's not going to happen any other way. Nobody except the profiteers would lose anything and the costs would go down as my GP has so clearly proven can be done. The system is broken so we must change the system, not just the peripherals, or the inherent problems will continue or pop up elsewhere. If you've for a better solution let me hear it. Just because something is "socialized" does not mean it's inherently bad. It's a proven way that benefits the majority more even if it isn't perfect. Our roads, Fire departments, Police services, and much much more are already "socialized" which is something you're not seeing. I base my thoughts on facts, not politically-driven hysterics spouted by people who are profiting from keeping things as they are now. Take a deeper look at those you follow then maybe you'll see the merit in my approach of not following anyone, but thinking for myself instead. Only fully open minds function properly so have a look around and once you see what I've seen you'll begin to understand what's wrong with healthcare and indeed almost everything else in our Nation of America.

Bettypooh 

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