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Move that meter - April Edition

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Babypants Diaper Royalty

Babypants

Posted
Posted

I'm curious.  There are quite a few individuals posting stories on this site who openly solicit for their patreon/other accounts.  As I write this (16:30 on 30 April), there is one individual with visible patreon tags on 2 stories sitting on page 1 of the table of contents.  Are you charging people a fee for using this site for advertising purposes?  If not, why not?  Web sites need funds to operate, and this is a pretty obvious source of revenue.

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kasarberang Diaper Royalty

kasarberang

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Babypants said:

I'm curious.  There are quite a few individuals posting stories on this site who openly solicit for their patreon/other accounts.  As I write this (16:30 on 30 April), there is one individual with visible patreon tags on 2 stories sitting on page 1 of the table of contents.  Are you charging people a fee for using this site for advertising purposes?  If not, why not?  Web sites need funds to operate, and this is a pretty obvious source of revenue.

That sort of thing is a mutual beneficial relationship, at least the way I see it. If it wasn't for the stories posted on this site, I'd never have found this website. Charging writers to advertise their off-site work would make them less likely to share free work on here and might turn off some individuals entirely. I think this site gives writers advertisement, but the writers are kind of what makes a huge part of this site the way it is. That's personally the way I view it anyway.

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Babypants Diaper Royalty

Babypants

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, kasarberang said:

That sort of thing is a mutual beneficial relationship, at least the way I see it. If it wasn't for the stories posted on this site, I'd never have found this website. Charging writers to advertise their off-site work would make them less likely to share free work on here and might turn off some individuals entirely. I think this site gives writers advertisement, but the writers are kind of what makes a huge part of this site the way it is. That's personally the way I view it anyway.

Thanks for taking the time to respond.  The solicitation for donations is never ending, so it seems logical that the site managers would look for more dependable sources of revenue.  Personally, I think that a site with more than 50,000 registered members in its community is the horse, not the cart.  The people advertising here need this platform to attract new subscribers, and we should charge them for the service that we provide.

And while I'm at it, I believe that the standards for criticism of stories is outdated.  A one-sized fits all standard is fundamentally unfair when some contributors are submitting stories just for the pure joy of it, while others are trying to attract subscribers who will pay for the privilege of reading their work.  Once you start doing this for money, you are claiming to be a professional, and the standards for professionals and amateurs are quite different.  I strongly recommend that the administration do a thorough overhaul of the site, to catch up with the many changes that have occurred since the site was originally constructed.

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kasarberang Diaper Royalty

kasarberang

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Babypants said:

Thanks for taking the time to respond.  The solicitation for donations is never ending, so it seems logical that the site managers would look for more dependable sources of revenue.  Personally, I think that a site with more than 50,000 registered members in its community is the horse, not the cart.  The people advertising here need this platform to attract new subscribers, and we should charge them for the service that we provide.

And while I'm at it, I believe that the standards for criticism of stories is outdated.  A one-sized fits all standard is fundamentally unfair when some contributors are submitting stories just for the pure joy of it, while others are trying to attract subscribers who will pay for the privilege of reading their work.  Once you start doing this for money, you are claiming to be a professional, and the standards for professionals and amateurs are quite different.  I strongly recommend that the administration do a thorough overhaul of the site, to catch up with the many changes that have occurred since the site was originally constructed.

That's just fundamentally not how the current landscape works. I can't think of any website that charges users to advertise/promote their off-site work. And I certainly can't imagine it being seen positively.

I also think a massive overhaul to the site is a suboptimal move, too. Many people view this as a comfortable safe-space to hang out, changing everything about it would most certainly drive away a huge amount of the community. I also disagree with your assessment that if someone is posting stories up on something like Patreon that they are saying that they are claiming they're on the level of a professional. Writing takes time, hobbyist or not. Most of the Patreon stories that I see are basically just glorified donation pages where people can support the writers they enjoy and get some early content (which is eventually hosted on this site entirely free.)

I don't disagree that potentially different monetization methods might be worth looking into, I also think your proposed solutions would just anger/frustrate users who feel comfortable here, rather than anything else. Personally, I definitely prefer the donation model as opposed to alternative methods of monetization, which usually involves selling/exploiting user data.

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~Brian~ Diaper Royalty

~Brian~

Posted
Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, kasarberang said:

That's just fundamentally not how the current landscape works. I can't think of any website that charges users to advertise/promote their off-site work. And I certainly can't imagine it being seen positively.

I also think a massive overhaul to the site is a suboptimal move, too. Many people view this as a comfortable safe-space to hang out, changing everything about it would most certainly drive away a huge amount of the community. I also disagree with your assessment that if someone is posting stories up on something like Patreon that they are saying that they are claiming they're on the level of a professional. Writing takes time, hobbyist or not. Most of the Patreon stories that I see are basically just glorified donation pages where people can support the writers they enjoy and get some early content (which is eventually hosted on this site entirely free.)

I don't disagree that potentially different monetization methods might be worth looking into, I also think your proposed solutions would just anger/frustrate users who feel comfortable here, rather than anything else. Personally, I definitely prefer the donation model as opposed to alternative methods of monetization, which usually involves selling/exploiting user data.

@kasarberang @DailyDi

I have been a member of daily diapers for Four years in August of this year. Throughout the years I've been a member here, I've always liked the fact that I can come here and I can talk to people and I can read the stories and I can post, and I can talk to friends on the chat and do other things, and recently I started writing my own story. None of this would have been possible without a lot of help from a lot of people, especially when I was dealing with problems in 2018, 2019, And 2020.  Throughout this entire journey, the place I needed to be while I was dealing with all of these things and I was trying to figure out why I felt the way I did or why I liked what I did or what I was or why I was wired the way I was, was right here. About this site, and the good people, and the welcoming atmosphere, and the niceness of Mikey and his staff members, and other people that I have seen on the chat, I would not be a member here, and I would probably be as mixed up as somebody else that doesn't know what the heck is going on. It without daily diapers I would not be the person that I am today, and without a help of a few special people, I would not understand what I am dealing with or why I feel the way I do, and I would not have accepted my need for diapers, because sometimes what it is according to my doctor is that it takes a lot of guts to be able to walk into a doctor's office and ask for help. I will always remember those words, because after I got help from my doctor, I came here and I was looking for advice and help, and I got it.

I thank everyone that helped me when I needed it, and I must say that without the site Being the way it was and is now, I would not have been able to come to this site to be able to get help. far too many of the sites around us are being monitored and they are being chastised or shut down because of the content that is being served. Daily diapers is good because they set the rules that they have to set, and they also have to follow the rules that are specific to the place where the server is housed. I understand this perfectly well and I understand some of the realities that poor Mikey has to face when he has to do upgrades, or make decisions about how to spend money, and all that stuff, even if I'm not the one who has to make the money spending decisions, I know that it is hard to make the decision.

I might also point out that if this site was not the way it is today, I would not be able to be a member, because it would cost me money to become a member, and it would also cost me a constant fee to be remaining a member. The way we do the donations now is appropriate, because Mikey doesn't expect us to donate every month, and he tells us to donate when we can. If we ended up going to a pay only site or we ended up changing the way this site operates, we would have problems because people would not be able to come back to this site, it wouldn't be the same as the site that we joined when we joined, and people would probably be upset, because the place they feel safest is being changed, if that is the way it falls. Daily diapers is like a home to many of us, it's like having An opportunity to be a member of an awesome organization, one that knows exactly what the target audience is and exactly what it is that we need. I'm sure that Mikey has things that he deals with on a daily basis, in this site is one way that he can help others, and I'm proud of what he does because there's a lot of people that have questions or concerns or they wonder if having a diaper fetish is crazy or whatever, and they need somewhere to be able to come to be able to ask those questions, even if some of them may be a little bit dark in stature, but at least they have a place to ask. If we end up changing the way that works, daily diapers itself would not be the same sight, people would not be so open, and people would not be willing to come here if we ended up having to pay for a membership. There are other sites that Mikey Operates like diapermates, That is a paid site not paying Any fees.  For those that want to pay for additional services, that is fine, because that is in the purview of the person who wishes to pay for more services. Mikey can decide what services he wishes to provide for the cost of whatever he decides is fair, but the reason why the system is set up that way is because that's the way Mikey thinks it needs to be and I'm not going to challenge that nor am I going to question it.

However, I want to point out that there are several people like myself who are low income, who do not have much money, just like Mikey sometimes runs into, and I know how hard it can be. I run four websites myself, and I will have to make decisions in 2024 on which websites I wish to maintain and which domains I wish to remove, if I cannot maintain all of them because of cost.  I know that it cost money to be able to run an awesome website like this. I also know that Mikey has ways to ask advertisers to support the site if they choose, and there is an appropriate way to do this. I have no problem with him asking For advertised revenue, by allowing people to place ads in his site in particular places, that is why each particular ad has a particular price and has a particular place that it belongs, or a particular size, or whatever it is. Those are things that mikey and an advertiser would have to work on, and they come to their own agreements, and they have to do certain things or whatever it is that they do, whatever it is, mikey and an advertiser would deal with that.

As far as donations go: there are a lot of us that spend time on this site. A lot of us that love this site, we love Mikey, and we figure that this place is almost like a family, like being in Mikey's living room. Far as I'm concerned, I have donated and will continue to donate to daily diapers because of the fact that I like what the site offers, I like what it stands for, and it means something to our community, and not only that, it is a home a place where I can feel safe, where I can discuss things that I would probably never discuss with anyone else, and that is part of the deal. Mikey makes it clear that we Can donate when we can if we can, as much as We can. he does not require us to make a donation, but he does solicit donations, and he does it in a way that is non threatening and not like Al Capone saying something like " I'm gonna make you an offer you can't refuse."  That isn't Mike's style, and he's always been nice about different stuff, but when he has to be the Meanie and put his admin hat on because somebody is being an idiot, that's what he has to do. Mikey and his staff to an awesome job, and sometimes I wish that I could give them more, but I certainly do whenever I can, because I love this place and I don't want it to go anywhere. We also have to realize that the cost to maintain a website as awesome as this has been the same for Many Goodyear, and as far as I can remember, Mikey said that the cost that he was paying to maintain his website had been constant for probably 10 or 12 years plus? Not sure exactly how close that is, but he recently Increased the amount that he raises every month to $400, because he had to and it been a long time since he had to do that!

What I will tell you is this I will donate whenever I can, whatever I can, and I love this particular site, and I've told Mikey that if he needed my help, all he would need to do was ask! I am fully aware that it does cost money to run a site as awesome as this, and there's no doubt that it does. For the last four years I have had to pay over $280 myself for four domains, plus this year I had to pay $38 plus tax on my main dot US email, which is something that I didn't have to pay for many years, until Microsoft ended up taking over for godaddy's email support. There are some of us however, that cannot afford to donate much, because we are in the same boat, as others and we may not have as much money as some other people do For those people that can't donate large amounts of money, having to make this a pay site or revamping the entire site in the way that it operates would be detrimental to those that can afford to donate, and Mikey asking for a Payment for daily diapers are incont dot org, What would be hard if you had to pay a yearly subscription fee or a subscription fee period.  This site and its sister site Provide information to the public, and and there are many sites that may not provide accurate information, or would end up making everything sound really bad, so it's always good to have a site that provides good information and not something that puts us in a negative light.

Plus advertising revenue is something of a two-edged sword. You want to be able to get people to support your site, but you also want to be able to pay your bills. Think that daily diapers the way it is set up now is better than a pay site Because we can be here so long as we are over 18, and we follow Mikey's rules, Mikey does not tell us that we cannot use his services, and services are not curtailed or somehow different for different membership levels. He also provides the ability to upgrade your account by paying him $20 a year for the BB statuses, depending on the year, and I have done that ever since I became a member here starting in 2020, because I wasn't a full member for a full year in 2019, so I didn't get the upgrade until 2020. Other than that, I've gotten the BB upgrade every single year, because although I do have full access to the appropriate space based on my membership level, giving Mikey the $20/year is my way of showing him that I love his site, I love him, and what he's trying to do. Trying to support him by giving him the $20 when I have it, and I give him donations to the fund when I have it. I'd rather spend money when I know that the site that I'm a member of is in good standing, provides good information, and is a place where I can help others. Me being able to donate to help Mikey is a good thing, but you have to realize that some people may not be able to help Mikey at all, but they still may want to be members. This is what Mikey has to be able to determine, to determine how he wants to set up his membership levels and how the site works.

When it comes to stories, we have a lot of people that write stories. This site is a lot better than the site that we don't like to mention.  That site which we don't mention, doesn't even hold a candle to that awesome people that provide stories to us, that write stories for us, that post their content for us to be able to read, most of it free of charge, but sometimes, Authors post content on Amazon, and that way they can be compensated for their works, and as a reminder, some of these awesome authors actually give us free content because they post it so we can look at it and we can read it, which also allows that particular author for example to be able to be getting some money, for example if an author writes a story and the adult section, they might post that they have books available on Amazon, so you end up going after that particular book, because they put that information here. Without them being able to post stories or anything else here, how can they get the revenue. Mikey allows that.  without an author that writes books, being able to post a story or two or maybe something on patreon, and then say here is a free sample or here's the first part of the story, and the rest of it is on patreon, which is something that is used to help the author, they wouldn't be getting as much exposure.

Additionally, there are authors that may want to write a story, but they are not professionals. I for example, just wrote a story about a dream that I had that I wish would happen to myself, and I've been a member for almost four years. I am not a professional author, and I don't claim to be one, and I don't want to be one, but it's fun to be able to read other people's stories and be able to learn from people that write. I know that there are many authors that I follow here, and I respect every single one of them, and if I'm to be blunt, if I catch any one trying to steal content from them, I would be the first to be going to their defense! I know that these people work hard and they give us the content because they want us to enjoy it, and they Sometimes give us free content, because they post here on DD that it's available, and I've bought 4 books from a particular author that I like, because she did that. Posted and told us that it was available, told us that it was free starting at a particular time, and I went and got the book. Have four of this person's books on my devices and I've read a lot of it, and without that type of word of mouth and being able to post here on daily diapers, I would not have that content and she would not be able to tell us about that content, and well if we end up having to pay for access to daily diapers, that would really twist somebody's knickers in a knot! I love daily diapers, I support daily diapers, and I know what the mission is, and I love Mikey to death, but I can't afford to be paying as if I was a professional advertiser or a professional author! that is why patreon exists and, Amazon has a program for authors that want to put their books out, I've had at least one of my teachers in elementary school post at least two books, and they're pretty good!

so while I do support the fact that it does cost money to run daily diapers or any other site, I would strongly urge that we do not make major overhaul to the entire site in the way it's managed or the way that it is raising money, because there are many of us that want to be a member here, that love the place, that want to stay here, and some of the people that I met online are like a family to me. When I was a member of Tallahassee free net back in 1993, all the way to 2017, I ended up giving them thousands and thousands and thousands of hours of support services on my own dime. I finally was able to talk to the director of that particular organization, and in recognition of my efforts, I was considered a Florida resident for purposes of membership. If you were a member that was living in Florida Georgia or Alabama at the time, the account that you made was free. Anybody else that was out of that three state area, was charged a fee of $25 a year. Of my dedication and my support, the fee was waived indefinitely, and I was considered to be a Florida resident! that was one of the best things that ever happened, and I was still a member all the way up until 2017 when it was shut down. This shows that I am very very passionate about what I'm trying to say, and I know this thing is getting long, but when you are passionate about something sometimes that happens.

So please understand, while I understand that it cost money to run sites like this, changing The whole landscape of the site because of revenue is not the answer in my opinion. There are people who do donate, and I'm very very supportive of those that do, and I understand if people don't, and I'm sure that Mikey does, because Mikey has said that himself! remember, to me this is Michael's electronic living room, so I feel like when I'm on this site, I can talk to Mike and I can talk to friends, and if I get out of line, someone's gonna give me a spanking, if they think it's necessary! ha ha ha

Respectfully,

Brian

Edited by ~Brian~
Edited to add additional information
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