What's The Big Deal?

[enfant]

I think I'll just try this one more time, and then give it up as a bad job if I can't get the point across.

Diapers are an item commonly associated with babies. That's just reality; most people think of diapers as one of the defining characteristics of a baby.

It's totally cool with me if you're not into regression, and just have a fetish for diapers. Really--no one here has a problem with that. Lots of people are the same way--I was myself at one time--and no one's trying to force you to be anything else.

But it's perfectly understandable for outsiders--people who aren't in the know--to make an assumption that a diaper fetish has something to do with regression, since wearing diapers is, in fact, an infantile thing to do. No, it's not a correct assumption in all cases, but it's an understandable one.

Here's the nub: The fact that this really seems to bother you--that you just seem to hate the idea of anyone ever misidentifying you as an AB, and you basically want us all to quit acting so weird so we won't taint the public's impression of diaper fetishists as a whole--conveys, much more strongly than words, that you think being an AB is something to be ashamed of.

And when you say that, people are going to be annoyed at you for it. Because I for one am not ashamed. I used to be, but now I quite like myself, and I never want to go back.

You want to educate people that there's more to diapers than regression? Go ahead. I'll even help, if you don't insult me. Just get rid of the 'tude, and stop using words like "DESPISE", and we'll get along fine. I actually quite like your posts most of the time; I only get ticked off when you use language that puts people down for their fetishes. You do that often. And I wish you'd stop.

[diaprbayb]

Ok then. You aren't a baby-because I have a dl fetish-and I say you are just like me. From now on, you will just have to put up with it or ignore me.

Putting up with it dosen't mean I can't comment on it. Ok, you're a DL, I'm a DL. I'm also a sissy. together they make up AB (for me). so now on with the show.

[Topguy]

I think I'll just try this one more time, and then give it up as a bad job if I can't get the point across.

Diapers are an item commonly associated with babies. That's just reality; most people think of diapers as one of the defining characteristics of a baby.

It's totally cool with me if you're not into regression, and just have a fetish for diapers. Really--no one here has a problem with that. Lots of people are the same way--I was myself at one time--and no one's trying to force you to be anything else.

But it's perfectly understandable for outsiders--people who aren't in the know--to make an assumption that a diaper fetish has something to do with regression, since wearing diapers is, in fact, an infantile thing to do. No, it's not a correct assumption in all cases, but it's an understandable one.

Here's the nub: The fact that this really seems to bother you--that you just seem to hate the idea of anyone ever misidentifying you as an AB, and you basically want us all to quit acting so weird so we won't taint the public's impression of diaper fetishists as a whole--conveys, much more strongly than words, that you think being an AB is something to be ashamed of.

And when you say that, people are going to be annoyed at you for it. Because I for one am not ashamed. I used to be, but now I quite like myself, and I never want to go back.

You want to educate people that there's more to diapers than regression? Go ahead. I'll even help, if you don't insult me. Just get rid of the 'tude, and stop using words like "DESPISE", and we'll get along fine. I actually quite like your posts most of the time; I only get ticked off when you use language that puts people down for their fetishes. You do that often. And I wish you'd stop.

This is a bit of a hot topic for me, and I get worked up over it. I'm sorry if I came across as rude-I tend to have a passionate nature. And I DO tend to escalte my bluntness and means of communication if I feel that my point is getting blown off as not having any personal validity.

I REALLY can understand what people get out of what they do. It just doesn't do the same thing for me.

I'm not trying to be devisive here. I'm trying to get people NOT to take each other for granted-in a well meant but rather misguided attempt to make us "cohesive"

My point all along is to like what we have in common-but respect the differences as meaningful to those who are.

Respect comes from realizing that another person can understand and even admire you-without being YOU.....

And that they CAN be different, and not be a threat.

Does that make any sense?

[lynniehyde]

"We might fight amongst each other, but I'll promise you this: We'll burn this b*tch, get us pissed. . " It's like living and dying in LA.

"I like feeling special and 'one of a kind'. Introspectively, I sometimes think I made the decision to be an AB purely because I'd lost that feeling of 'special' I had throughout much of my childhood."

I think you've touched on something, Tris. Believe me, the last thing I would ever want to see, would be a lot of other "heidilynns" running wild in the streets. I wouldn't be so "special", no more, would I? . I do enjoy my unique status in the community and I don't give a care what the naysayers say.

"Illegitimi non carborundum".

Cuddles,

--heidilynn

[BitterGrey]

The arguing probably will not go away until we accept two things: While we have a lot in common, we are not all the same.

1. This isn't a community of ABs and DLs, but of AB/DLs. There is a continuum between AB and DL.

2. While there isn't a black and white division, the two ends of the continuum are not the same. Sometimes they are differentiated by roleplay, often not an interest for DLs. Sometimes they are differentiated by sexuality, often not an interest for ABs. (By the way, the phrase "infantilism fetish" is technically wrong, since the APA groups infantilism and fetishism in different sections.)

You are unique, but not alone.

~BitterGrey

[Guest Baby Peter]

Not to bash anyone, but maybe a point to think about .... we are all adults, but with these kind of conversations we look more like a bunch of babies.

I agree with bittergrey... While we have a lot in common, we are not all the same.

If you're a DL, be happy.. enjoy it, treasure it. Don't get bothered if someone calls u a AB, just say you aint, or say nothing cause you know better.... but cant see any reason to get overly upset about it and oversensative "cause you aint a baby!!!" ...

If you're an AB... i wonder if any (diaper wearing) AB can honestly say (s)he aint a DL aswell -doubt u wear m and not like m, though might be wrong in that *laughs*- so thats easily solved.

end point being, we are all people, all adults ... lets act as adults and accept eachother and not flame or (heavily) argument unneeded over a rather 'simple' matter.

Might be easy to talk for me since im exploring the AB world myself, but in the end the topic title is quite correct... whats the big deal?

*doesnt see the huge issue that some have with it*

just my thoughts on it.

[langtab]

If you're an AB... i wonder if any (diaper wearing) AB can honestly say (s)he aint a DL aswell -doubt u wear m and not like m, though might be wrong in that *laughs*- so thats easily solved.

Well I can say from my own experience that for a long time I considered myself AB but believed I did not like diapers. Even now diapers are help for issues at night but I do not see them as integral to my AB side. I much more prefer a blankie to a diaper.

After saying that, I do not see the point in this debate about AB vs DL. I think we all recognize the differences. Why do we need to debate all the little bits in between the two? I think something to think about for everyone who is on either "side" of this debate is that we all came here voluntarily. We all found this site through some sort of common thread while browsing the web.

[Rawr]

"We need to organize!"

Er... organise what, exactly?

I've never really seen a 'big deal' or divide between ABs, DLs, AB/DLs, or even Babyfur/Diaperfurs... I think everyone's getting on pretty well, no?

[paradox]

Here is a great idea, lets have no distinction between anything! So we are just all fetish inthusiasts! We are no diffrent from people who like to kill dogs to get off yay! I think distinction is due when there is a distinction. Between Dl and ab there is quite a big distinction. Yes the fetish is related to childhood, all fetishes are developed from childhood due to how fetishes form, it is odd for one to form later in life. So therefore all fetishes are the same? I'm no scientist but that sounds just a little wrong to me. We are not two seperate groups vying for power here. We are just not completely the same. I got nothing against a full fledged ab It aint me though. It would kinda be like a transgender wanting to be called a girl when someone else is calling him/her a boy. It is slightly offensive when your mistaken for something your not.

[Topguy]

Right let's make no distinction at all, and just let people call us all pedophiles. It's a fetish vaguely connected to diapers by some, right?

[babylin]

The arguing probably will not go away until we accept: You are unique, but not alone.

~BitterGrey

There is a traditional Korean saying: "I'm sorry for seeing things like a frog in a well".

what we have here is a behavioral phenomena that has not been coded into conventional language. We use AB or DL as if they were spectral points when in fact they are but concepts, constructs from words that do not describe or define reality. Currently the APA seems to be doing the defining (& what gives them the right, anyway?). Our language maps like to use opposites.. Either -- or. It is or it isn't. Some call this Aristotilian Logic. But this form of language logic just does not fit our infantilist reality.

Let's just accept us as we is and let the definitions (adult type word games) leave us alone. I don't have to be an AB or a DL to enjoy what I am. I AM.

HAPPINESS IS WEARING A COTTON DIAPER

[Eric D]

...I've always preferred the term "infantilist" because it includes the whole spectrum of people who engage in infantile behaviors for fun (and, yes, wearing and using a diaper is an infantile behavior, even if you aren't sucking your thumb at the same time). We're all infantilists. Some of us wear diapers full-time, some wear part-time, some don't wear at all; some wear other babyish or childish clothes and some don't; some use baby bottles and some don't; some talk baby talk and engage in role-play and some don't... there are lots and lots of variations, but we're all on the same spectrum, and there are far more things that unite us than divide us....

Just while reading the whole thread again to see new "development" I stumbled across this one post, which I seem to have missed the first time around...

Well that leaves me quite a bit "stunned"... I consider this, to say so, utter rubbish.

No, by all means, I am not an Infantilist, by any means of the word, the definition or what else.

My desire for diapers, is in no way related to wanting to regress back to childhood or revive things from back then.

Heck, yes I started to notice I like diapers at a young age. but that is past... I live in the "now" and my reason for wearing diapers is mainly because of a purely sexual thing and because I like the feeling a lot.

Exactly this type of "small scale, put them all in the same bag" thinking is what I find rather upseting.

Especially the sentence: "And using a diaper is infantile behaviour"... I guess it's time to say "sorry" to many incontinent people out there, who might even have come to like diapers, at least some of them, by needing to wear them for medical reasons. What the f* is infantile about WEARING a diaper??? after all Diapers are made for ADULTS as well.

and not all diapers feature the word "BABY" on it's front or prints with toys and what not.

I for one would NEVER want to wear such a diaper... I find it odd... it doesn't please me.

You may wonder why I vehemently try to get that said... and please don't bring in the childish shite like "if you're against it so vehemently than it must be especially true that you have just troubles accepting it"... it's bollocks.

well why? simple: because repeating my childhood, or regressing back into a childhood I may never had is NOT MY DEAL. is not my fantasy, not even my innermost (and I know myself quite well) wish. For me wearing ADULT DIAPERS is a FETISH thing, is SEXUALLY RELATED and is as well a convenience/comfort factor (I sometimes wear a diaper in situations where it's very practical too.)

Now why would someone still label me an infantilist, is quite beyond me.

And I believe it are exactly statements like this which actually create a RIFT in a community, as most people don't like to be labelled especially with a term they not only find misfitting, but very much "wrong".

So stop putting the "Infantile / baby" label on everyone, stop pushing this agenda and you might find unity across a broad community brought together for the fact that one of it's few commons is the fact that participants wear diapers for other than purely physical - medical reasons. But for me, this is as much "common" ground with the AB or "infantilists" I will ever share... Bring in any sort of "childhood" or "baby" behaviour and try to put that on me and I'm "gone".

[special lil kitty]

I'm an adult baby, but its far from a sexual thing for me. In fact the idea of sex in a baby head space sounds and feels very very creepy to me. I dont mind that other people do it - its just not me. I can understand DL and the sexual association - its like any other fetish. I'm not very sexual at all myself and tend to prefer cuddles and hugs and bottles and paci and warm blankets. When I am sexual for some reason I tend more toward being the Dom - both wicked and cold and due to incontinence - in diapers.

Dominatrix in diapers - still strikes me as a funny thought though but life has shown me - anything can happen. I've also been caught pretending to be a transvestite... heh.

[Manchesterlad]

Geat Troll post. The orginal post sounds like your tying to start a arguement that isnt realy there.

[Guest]

Im confused to what i am, i feel so cute warm snuggly innocent and special and loved if i am wearing my onsies footed sleepsuits booties bibs baby harness etc i genuinely feel safe and secure when i have my teddy and puff my dragon with me, i enjoy sucking my dummy and love having a bottle of milk and often dream of being pushed around in a silver cross pram, well it doesnt have to be a silver cross but it must be a proper pram and not a silly buggy/pushchair) and i would love to be tucked up in a cot with lullaby light show thing lulling me to sleep and to be held and rocked in a loving womans arms

But theres also a side of me that does feel a bit naughty with my nappies like if i move and fell my squishy warm wet nappy between my legs or i hear it crinkle i do get a bit excited so what am i, a AB with a tiny bit of DL or am i just a baby that likes his nappy nice n squishy!

[maly]

Well for what its worth heres my two cents;

Babies wear nappies

A/Bs wear nappies

D/Ls wear nappies

End of!

Mal

[lynniehyde]

Well for what its worth heres my two cents;

Babies wear nappies

A/Bs wear nappies

D/Ls wear nappies

End of!

Mal

Hear, hear. Couldn't have said it better myself. This is how the un-informed masses perceive us. Like it or not, until they are better informed, we're all Bozos on this bus.

Cuddles,

--heidilynn

PS: Two cents ain't what it was worth two years ago. Don't you mean a farthing's worth?

[maly]

Hear, hear. Couldn't have said it better myself. This is how the un-informed masses perceive us. Like it or not, until they are better informed, we're all Bozos on this bus.

Cuddles,

--heidilynn

PS: Two cents ain't what it was worth two years ago. Don't you mean a farthing's worth?

lol what can i say, im just an old fashioned kind of a bozo

mal

[FretaBWet]

The way I see it is the title of this thread describes it perfectly, Whats the big deal? What IS the big deal. AB vs DL what difference does it make? If members identifying as DL want a space for themselves what difference does it make to everyone else? Those identifying as Sissies have a forum where they can discuss those aspects they find important. Does that threaten anyone. Think of this from the other perspective. AB's might tire of DL's just constantly discussing the fetish aspect of diapers just as DL's might tire of the baby talk. Instead of trying to force the Rebels to stay in the Union why not just be peaceful neighbors that can visit each other and be friends. It is not disrespectful for DL's to want a space, it's disrespectful to try to make them be included in someone else's space against their will. The fighting about it is the logical result of that. Yes, we're all on the diaper bus together but why feel threatened when the DL's want to ride in the back and play amongst themselves? As for the AB's if that's upsetting than you're lucky your AB, that's what your pacifier is for.

"Birds of a feather flock together" but they don't get uptight about it.

[Mean Mommy]

Whenever I get confused about DLs vehemently denying the infantile aspect to what they do, I like to compare them to cross-dressers: Male cross-dressers, since there isn't really such a thing as a female cross-dresser anymore.

So a good example of a cross-dresser is a dude who likes to wear women's panties. Like a silky thong or something. If pressed he will declare that he does not want to be a woman, he is a man, he likes being a man and also likes wearing lacy panties.

I can respect this. There is a huge difference between a cross-dresser and a transsexual. Why shouldn't a man enjoy lacy panties? Because society forbids it. But that doesn't mean men shouldn't be able to indulge that side of themselves, just like when women wear pants and combat boots.

So an adult likes to wear diapers. S/he is still an adult, and comfortable and content being an adult who likes to indulge in the joys of wearing a diaper. Suspecting a person of wanting to be a child when he or she wears diapers is the same as suspecting a man of wanting to be a woman when he wears a lacy thong. It's assuming a lot. It's going too far and it's disrespectful.

I think I can understand the frustration. If a cross-dresser gets lumped in with transsexuals I'm sure he would stand up and say "I'm a man dammit! And wearing a lacy thong makes me no less the man I was born to be! These lacy panties do not negate who I am!" Likewise, a DL may proclaim "I'm a fully grown adult dammit! I have no interest in regressing! I am happy with my adulthood and my kink does not negate who I've grown to be!"

So DLs deserve their space and respect. If they don't get it, I'm sure their frustration will become divisive and harsh the feel-good vibe of this scene.

[lynniehyde]

Whenever I get confused about DLs vehemently denying the infantile aspect to what they do, I like to compare them to cross-dressers: Male cross-dressers, since there isn't really such a thing as a female cross-dresser anymore.

So a good example of a cross-dresser is a dude who likes to wear women's panties. Like a silky thong or something. If pressed he will declare that he does not want to be a woman, he is a man, he likes being a man and also likes wearing lacy panties.

I can respect this. There is a huge difference between a cross-dresser and a transsexual. Why shouldn't a man enjoy lacy panties? Because society forbids it. But that doesn't mean men shouldn't be able to indulge that side of themselves, just like when women wear pants and combat boots.

So an adult likes to wear diapers. S/he is still an adult, and comfortable and content being an adult who likes to indulge in the joys of wearing a diaper. Suspecting a person of wanting to be a child when he or she wears diapers is the same as suspecting a man of wanting to be a woman when he wears a lacy thong. It's assuming a lot. It's going too far and it's disrespectful.

I think I can understand the frustration. If a cross-dresser gets lumped in with transsexuals I'm sure he would stand up and say "I'm a man dammit! And wearing a lacy thong makes me no less the man I was born to be! These lacy panties do not negate who I am!" Likewise, a DL may proclaim "I'm a fully grown adult dammit! I have no interest in regressing! I am happy with my adulthood and my kink does not negate who I've grown to be!"

So DLs deserve their space and respect. If they don't get it, I'm sure their frustration will become divisive and harsh the feel-good vibe of this scene.

I don't know who came up with the acronym "AB/DL", but I do know it does a disservice to both ABs and DLs alike. There is clearly a difference between the two. Unfortunately, until the general public is better informed, we are all perceived as babies. To all the DLs out there who don't like being lumped with us ABs: Get over it. The only way for John Q to learn more about us, is through the media and those brave enough in the "scene" to expose themselves as either AB or DL. Whether it's through personal relationships, out and about public exposure, or actively seeking out media attention. Even the mental health professionals are playing catch-up here.

Cuddles,

--heidilynn

[FretaBWet]

Whenever I get confused about DLs vehemently denying the infantile aspect to what they do, I like to compare them to cross-dressers: Male cross-dressers, since there isn't really such a thing as a female cross-dresser anymore.

So a good example of a cross-dresser is a dude who likes to wear women's panties. Like a silky thong or something. If pressed he will declare that he does not want to be a woman, he is a man, he likes being a man and also likes wearing lacy panties.

I can respect this. There is a huge difference between a cross-dresser and a transsexual. Why shouldn't a man enjoy lacy panties? Because society forbids it. But that doesn't mean men shouldn't be able to indulge that side of themselves, just like when women wear pants and combat boots.

So an adult likes to wear diapers. S/he is still an adult, and comfortable and content being an adult who likes to indulge in the joys of wearing a diaper. Suspecting a person of wanting to be a child when he or she wears diapers is the same as suspecting a man of wanting to be a woman when he wears a lacy thong. It's assuming a lot. It's going too far and it's disrespectful.

I think I can understand the frustration. If a cross-dresser gets lumped in with transsexuals I'm sure he would stand up and say "I'm a man dammit! And wearing a lacy thong makes me no less the man I was born to be! These lacy panties do not negate who I am!" Likewise, a DL may proclaim "I'm a fully grown adult dammit! I have no interest in regressing! I am happy with my adulthood and my kink does not negate who I've grown to be!"

So DLs deserve their space and respect. If they don't get it, I'm sure their frustration will become divisive and harsh the feel-good vibe of this scene.

Excellent post Mean Mommy, The analogy is accurate and precise. Would you like me plain or with maple syrup?

[jenniebear]

well said Mean Mommy........

and freta........plain or with maple syrup......

[Mean Mommy]

always with maple syrup

i have a sweet tooth

[Saschadzg]

But his dream and his impact on all of us, cannot be discredited.

Without his (DPF) pioneer work, I would not be the person I am know.

Babygirl Kvetinka