What happens if you don't toilet train a child

[Mikes Mike]

What happens if you don't toilet train a child

[Alex Bridges]

They figure it out anyway.

All you really do when potty training a child is teach them where to go when they need to. They develop the ability to hold it and release it on their own. You just accelerate the process by helping them make a faster mental connection between the feeling of needing to go and actually doing something about it, and you incentivize them to go to the potty instead of in their pants.

If you did none of that, they’d still figure it out, just a little bit slower. Most kids begin to know when they’re wet or dirty around 18-20 months and start to dislike the sensation around 2 to 2.5 years old. It’s a normal part of neurological and physical development as they start to understand and gain control of their body.

[rusty pins]

I don't think the issue is as much about what the kids will or won't learn on their own if not potty trained.  I can't fathom any parent not toilet training their child, however I know some are very lazy.  In the area where I live there are a lot of welfare people who can but won't work, have many kids, are obese and abusive.  Lots of crime as well.  I often notice 4 and 5 year old (and older) in diapers being yelled at and dragged around by these brood sows.  That is nothing but child abuse and I know some foster parents who have had a tough time trying to turn kids around.  Personally, some of these people need to lose their parental rights and some have.

If a kid is not trained because of lazy parents who just don't care (and some get more money from the state for having more and more kids), the kids need to be placed in foster homes where they will be properly cared for.  If someone doesn't even toilet train their kid, think of what other abuses they do as well.  How long does the kid stay in a wet or dirty diaper because the parents are too lazy to change the diaper? Do they get fed a proper meal?  When they yell at the kid constantly, slap them around you know the kid isn't getting any love or nurturing.  There are members here who have been in that very same abusive situation and have talked about it in their forum posts.

If a person decides not to potty train their kid because they are AB or DL and like wearing diapers themselves, then they are also abusers in the worst way.  I've read from some of these people on forum posts in the past.  They seem to think it's up to the 4 or 5 year old to decide if he or she wants to learn to use the potty or just wear diapers instead.  NEWS FLASH!  You are the parent!  At 4, 5 and 6 years old a kid is not mentally developed enough to be able to make some decisions for themselves.  It's not like letting them choose the green ball or the yellow ball when picking out a toy.  There are reasons why laws are in place so kids can't drive a car until they are 16 or drink until they are 21.  They are not mature enough to make those decisions.  I saw on Judge Judy last week where a 13 year old stole the car keys at 4am while the person who was supposed to be watching him was sleeping.  The kid made it less than 2 blocks before crashing the car.  Many years ago a 7 year old girl wanted to be the youngest to fly a plane across country.  Very liberal parents who let the kid do anything she wanted.  The kid, her dad and flight instructor took off in weather that even airline pilots said they wouldn't fly in and were all killed.  Parents are parents for a reason.  To train their kids for the road of life ahead and make sure they have the knowledge and skills needed to be successful.  How well they choose to do so may be seen years down the road if the kid has a good job and family or is a drug addict or ends up homeless or in jail.

No, anyone who doesn't attempt to toilet train their kid should have the kids taken away as I believe it's abuse.  You also can't leave that decision to the child to make, weather they want to stay in diapers or not.  If you don't want to be a proper parent, have your tubes tied or get a vasectomy!

[oznl]

As others have said, they figure it out for themselves eventually but it happens a lot later than it needs to, is rough on the kid and speaks volumes of the parent(s).

I watched aghast from a distance as a friend’s (now ex) wife did this with her son.  Third birthday rolled around, nothing happening, then the fourth birthday sails past and he’s still getting around in a permanently soggy disposable and all the time the mother occasionally bleats “he’s not ready!”. 

Finally, weeks away from school starting, age 5, the kid more or less decided himself to stop going in his diaper because he didn’t want to wear it to school (smarter than his mother)! It seemed that training wasn’t necessary at this point for this kid, he was perfectly continent, he just hadn’t bothered because there was no pressure to.

This was more about a parent who was massively over-indulgent to her only child and completely missed the bus in terms of understanding her obligation to equip her child with life skills instead of just showering it with praise and treats.

Another insight into this came just the other day from a colleague at work whose daughter is a teacher teaching in a school in a lower socioeconomic area.  His daughter was horrified that she’s been allocated a “prep” class for kids when school comes back end of January next year.  I asked why this was a problem and he told me that kids these days turned up at this school lacking the most basic abilities and there’s usually a couple in every class who are either still in nappies or even worse, who aren’t but are not toilet trained anyway and the teacher has to deal with it (eww…).  Apparently, those kids have a pretty miserable time at school from their peers because of the nappies and accidents but at least the parents were spared the inconvenience of potty training.

It seems we have bred a welfare-dependant underclass that just regards absolutely everything in life to be provided for free, by the government including it seems, toilet training their offspring…

[Cruiser 03]

As others have said, they figure it out for themselves eventually but it happens a lot later than it needs to, is rough on the kid and speaks volumes of the parent(s).

I watched aghast from a distance as a friend’s (now ex) wife did this with her son.  Third birthday rolled around, nothing happening, then the fourth birthday sails past and he’s still getting around in a permanently soggy disposable and all the time the mother occasionally bleats “he’s not ready!”. 

Finally, weeks away from school starting, age 5, the kid more or less decided himself to stop going in his diaper because he didn’t want to wear it to school (smarter than his mother)! It seemed that training wasn’t necessary at this point for this kid, he was perfectly continent, he just hadn’t bothered because there was no pressure to.

This was more about a parent who was massively over-indulgent to her only child and completely missed the bus in terms of understanding her obligation to equip her child with life skills instead of just showering it with praise and treats.

Another insight into this came just the other day from a colleague at work whose daughter is a teacher teaching in a school in a lower socioeconomic area.  His daughter was horrified that she’s been allocated a “prep” class for kids when school comes back end of January next year.  I asked why this was a problem and he told me that kids these days turned up at this school lacking the most basic abilities and there’s usually a couple in every class who are either still in nappies or even worse, who aren’t but are not toilet trained anyway and the teacher has to deal with it (eww…).  Apparently, those kids have a pretty miserable time at school from their peers because of the nappies and accidents but at least the parents were spared the inconvenience of potty training.

It seems we have bred a welfare-dependant underclass that just regards absolutely everything in life to be provided for free, by the government including it seems, toilet training their offspring…

Generation "entitled"

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

[iluvmydiapers]

I know of a young woman who as a young child decided she wanted to wear diapers after being potty trained, she missed the attention she got and her younger sister was getting, so her mother let her go back to wearing diapers. 

She wore diapers up until her first day of school, only gave them up because she would have to wear diapers to school. 

She is now a young mother herself and has no desires to wear diapers but is not above letting any of her children wear diapers if they so desire. 

[babykeiff]

Sorry for the length...

Personally I abhore mistreatment of any person in all forms, and not teaching a child for any reasons (be it personal and/or belief) is ABUSE.

Apart from moral reasons, mental damage to the child, child abuse etc., if a child is not trained not to use diapers, the child will continue to use diapers.

This was proven in an experiment with quints in Russia in the 1950's. The five were separated from birth, and each were raised using a different methodology. One child was not taught about a toilet etc and was kept in diapers until the child was about 9/10 years old when the experiment was cancelled.

A baby, when born, is aware of its need to void as this is a different set of sensations than it had in the womb. Despite what some AB/DLs wish, a baby is NOT incontinent. It is fully aware of a need, may not understand the need or how to handle same, does not have the co-ordination to go to a toilet (if it was even aware of such a device) but seeks assistance. As a result, prior to voiding, it fusses and cries for attention. In the modern world, we diaper the baby from birth, and teach it, via praise and encouragement, to void on/in whatever it is wearing. The baby / child, due to not knowing any different, complies and learns to void without fussing, and will eventually void without problems. This gets to such a state, that the baby/child will void while asleep and/or awake.  The baby/child also does not have the ability to get to a bathroom / somewhere to void. It hasn't got the strength and/or knowledge to associate that wetting / soiling will make it uncomfortable (cause & effect = causality loop).

As a child gets older, the child will learn, via causality, when it needs to void, when it is wet / messy, and how it affects its own comfort BUT, without anyone telling it differently, it will continue to use diapers forever. To the child, the use of diapers is normal, and part of its earliest memories. However, after it voids, will seek the attention. It has learnt, from experience, that someone will give it attention following this feeling of a full / wet diaper. As the child gets older, since it learns from copying those around it, it notices that its mother / father, after some key facial movements / body movements, the mother / father hides in a different room and the facial movements have changed to relief. This, the baby copies in its own world, by hiding behind furniture etc when it feels it needs to poop, and then going to another - mother / father / career and informing same of the poop. This is attention seeking behaviour, not as some people confuse it as the child being aware of its need to poop early enough to be able to hold its for long enough so it can make it to a bathroom. Observe a toddler focused on playing with a top / television program... it will wet / fill its diaper without changing its focus, being totally unaware of its needs until the act of pooping occurs as a surprise to the toddler. The toddler normally giggles at the shock (if it notices), but then goes back to focus on the toy / T.V. with no care to the state of its diaper. It is not until later, when the bulk of the diaper is preventing the child from doing something and/or the poop starts to cause a rash / discomfort, is the child aware of the poop and the need to address it. A baby/child in a high-chair during a meal when it needs to poop will not stop what it is doing.... it will continue to eat / drink and in between breaths, will push the poop into its diaper. To the baby  / child, this is as normal as breathing etc... and what it has been trained to do (from birth by its parents) - to ignore the need of its bladder / bowels and let them empty as and when needed. Yes, the baby / child is aware of its need, but it is secondary to what it wants to do - ie eat / drink.

A child will toilet train itself given the correct circumstances... which are no diaper / training pants / underwear that enforce the cold uncomfortable feeling that they are wet / messy... but it is the adult / career that has to trigger this, not the child, and ONLY when the child is ready - ie can identify its needs prior to the event. Most parents can tell, by the action of their child, when the child is going to wet / mess its diaper. Due to the comfort level of disposable diapers (thin feel, highly absorbent, dry to touch even when wet etc)  as apposed to cloth diapers, the causality loop (the cold & wet feel after wetting a diaper) does not exist. Even training diapers / pull-ups do not cause that cold-wet feeling. To create that 'response' diaper manufactures have added in some 'Potty Training' diapers a wet feel liner. The predominant usage of disposable diapers, add to this, pull-up (diapers), the baby / child is being taught that it is the normal behaviour to wet and mess when then need to go when and wherever they are in whatever they are wearing. The age of a cloth diaper wearer to become toilet trained (day AND night) was between 18 - 28 months. The current age range of disposable diaper wearers are 3-5 years of age (daytime) with some needing nighttime diapers up to ages 12-15. see causality loop

The larger problem is the ability to learn. The longer a child is using diapers, the harder it is to train the associated nerves to work as an early warning system as to avoid the reflex action of voiding rather than holding until it reaches a toilet. Also, since the child is not holding, the bladder / bowels will not stretch to cope with longer times away from a bathroom / overnight. Thirdly, the autonomic response of eating causes waste to enter the bowels. Most diaper dependent people fill their diapers whilst eating / shortly after same due to this. Drinking tends to trigger the bladder to release also. Night-time control is dependent on the production of vaspressin, which due to same being a cost to the body that is offset by the sleep gained, this autonomic process does not develop as it is not needed. We , as humans, constantly adapt to what is required. If bladder / bowel control is not required (due to being constantly in diapers), bladder/bowel control will NOT be developed.

So, in simple terms, if a child is never trained to use a toilet, it will use what it knows, the diapers.

If the diapers are disposable, the child will learn later in life the causality loop - ie when it wets, it will feel cold and wet etc. The pull-up diaper types makes it even more difficult for the child to distinguish between pull-up diapers and underwear. Cloth diapers do teach the causality loop earlier, but without the child being told a different way - ie to use the toilet, due to not knowing any better, it will continue to use the diapers.

Others here have stated that a child WILL self learn to use a toilet. This is a common mistake since a child will self teach many items - however, it has been taught to use diapers from birth. As a result, will not expend time to re-learn what it already (in its mind) knows. This is one of the many reasons why toilet training a child is difficult on both... and also a trigger to the AB/DL lifestyle.... many AB/DL's prefer the stability of pre-toilet training (revert to original behaviour prior to formation of memories), and person dependent, may seek an earlier time in their life to re-live due to attempting to suppress those later memories... i.e. self regress to 6 month old due to perceived conflict when they were 7+ months old (ages only as example). Some AB/DLs prefer to regress to during toilet training, where the mistakes of wet / messy training pants was rewarded with being lovingly cleaned and cared for while being placed back into diapers. = attention seeking with no blame for mistakes... something that as we have grown, the level of blame and associated cost etc has grown for each little problem.

In my humble opinion, not toilet training a child does not create the perfect AB/DL and is little to no advantage to the child. The best/ideal AB/DL (if there is one) is a person who was toilet trained (at a normal age) and grew up in a relatively normal environment but has the intelligence to rebel against normal / stereotypes and freely choose to regress. There are numerous different triggers that create an AB/DL. Not toilet training a child is definitely not one of them and is damaging to the child.

We go back to the tenancy of this, and most AB/DL groups / forums / sites etc... THIS IS NOT FOR CHILDREN IN ANY FORM. Please people, stop including under 18 year olds in your thoughts and/or actions. ABDL 'play' is OK for YOU, the above 18 year old to act / behave, and be treated as any age demographic you freely choose, by another that freely chooses to treat you as such... but NOT for you / another to force another into a situation for your / anothers selfish gain in any form.

FREEDOM exists for all equally... and we all must fight to ensure that equality. Freedom is not the ability to do/not do as you wish, but to do / not do as you should where it does not affect the freedoms of another.

[rusty pins]

8 hours ago, babykeiff said:

We go back to the tenancy of this, and most AB/DL groups / forums / sites etc... THIS IS NOT FOR CHILDREN IN ANY FORM. Please people, stop including under 18 year olds in your thoughts and/or actions. ABDL 'play' is OK for YOU, the above 18 year old to act / behave, and be treated as any age demographic you freely choose, by another that freely chooses to treat you as such... but NOT for you / another to force another into a situation for your / anothers selfish gain in any form.

FREEDOM exists for all equally... and we all must fight to ensure that equality. Freedom is not the ability to do/not do as you wish, but to do / not do as you should where it does not affect the freedoms of another.

Hear Hear!  Very well said and thank you!

[carsfan]

Found this video while looking for things unrelated and thought of this topic. I found the way the mum talks about the process and various bribes and failed attempts to be quite surprising. This kid might have tough a go in school if/when this video is ever seen. He sounded quite ok with wearing a wet diaper all day during school as the  mum makes reference to him grasping the social stigma of his situation and deciding to mess his diapers only when at home. I feel sorry for this boy.

   

 

[babykeiff]

carsfan / all,

this child that is referred to in the video was using diapers / underwear by reflex - since that is what he was taught to do from birth. Even though he was aware that his peers / parents etc. didn't use diapers, by encasing his genital area in underwear / diapers / pullups etc., his body did not inform him of his need to void before voiding. It was not until he went commando - so as he voided, he got the instant feedback of wet legs etc. - did his mind start to adjust to not reflex voiding.

His situation is very similar to many babies / children today - due to the design of disposable diapers etc. These are so absorbent, the child is unaware it has voided. Even if it knows that it has voided, there is no indication to him/her that this is an issue. What the child feels is a little more bulk / squishiness - a different emotion. As a result, the child forgets/ignores that it has voided. This cycle repeats forever until something breaks it. It was parental intervention coupled with the child noticing that it didn't confirm to the rest of the pack - its peers etc. - coupled with the fact that he was getting changed instead of doing what it wanted* that broke the cycle in this child.

* Humans are inherently competitive and fine tune this during childhood. Missing out in an action that they are focused on makes them perceive that somehow they failed in that action / reaching the goal of gaining a milestone. If another, even from a genuine point, assists them, the person also sees this as failure by direction of their competition. Most people here that have children know the response that they get from their child if the child is disturbed – they basically let you know – screaming, crying, tantrums etc.

Bladder / bowel awareness is learnt very early in child development – usually 4-6 weeks old. We teach our offspring to void in their clothes. This is reinforced by praise and attention. Add to this, the super absorbent diapers etc., and the baby learns very early to void when and wherever in needs to. Due to the attention training (inbuilt need to socialize), the child knows that it will get attention after a wet / messy diaper, so it creates that situation for that feedback. In reality, we are the ones that are getting trained. This is usually between birth and 6-9 months old (the time the child learns not wake up during the night) Eventually, due to our sleep time training of the child – thicker more absorbent diapers that do not wake the child due to leaks etc., the child learns to ignore the wet / soiled diaper – which equates to not informing you of the diaper – the baby actually is not really aware of the diaper – it has adapted / learnt to ignore same. If, during a change, you let your baby ‘free’ it will run trying to experience the new feelings of nothing between its legs.

The best way to toilet train a child, the same way that was used on most, is to create the scenario that facilitates same:-

no diapers / underwear

loose pants – so that the child can pull them up / down AND so that any wetness will have instant feedback as cold legs etc.

constant reminders - the child gets very focused on what it is doing and will not notice when it is wetting / messing.

This can really occur at any age, but usually is best when the child is around 18-24 months and in a secure environment – i.e. relaxed and comfortable in the home (not after a change in his environment, i.e. new ‘big boy bed’ / loss of pacifier / loss of plushie etc. / new house / new addition or removal to-from the family). The child usually adapts within 2-3 days.

 

[Shotgun Diplomat]

On 12/15/2019 at 6:09 AM, rusty pins said:

No, anyone who doesn't attempt to toilet train their kid should have the kids taken away as I believe it's abuse.

This. In ALL of the ways. 

[Diaperboy1437]

I laught at this because my mom has a daycare and theirs a kid who’s already 3 who doesn’t use the toilet at all and he doesn’t make them smell good either in fact they smell like rat honestly but the point here when he goes in the diaper my mom gets him in trouble saying only babies use a diaper you know the typical stuff but every time I hear that I’m just in my head like yes I wanna be a baby wanting to go back into diapers lol