I told my doctor about incontinent desires, diapers, and I asked her for help to get surgery.

[Ferix]

13 hours ago, toddwr250r said:

Anxiously awaiting an update here, don't leave me hanging @Ferix

I'm still here! I just haven't had anything to report.

 

My first visit with the therapist will happen on the 23rd, then I have an appointment with the surgeon on July 12th. I'll be posting updates after those appointments and if anything changes or happens.

 

[Lillemai]

This is really almost to exciting to follow, without tapping in.

I’ve been on the “path to untraining” myself for about two years now, non-stop, and I feel like I’m more myself now - more complete.
 

I’d be more than willing to take the same route as you, @Ferix, if it was only possible.

I really don’t understand how you can get plastic- and cosmetic surgery, if this kinda “psychological fulfilling surgery” isn’t available to ‘everybody’!

[Elbs]

On 6/14/2021 at 10:18 AM, Lillemai said:

I really don’t understand how you can get plastic- and cosmetic surgery, if this kinda “psychological fulfilling surgery” isn’t available to ‘everybody’!

It's because incontinence is considered a disability, and disabilities are stereotyped as a horrible tragedy that no one could ever enjoy or even be fine with.

Same reason people say they're sorry when I say I'm autistic, even though I like being autistic and I'm proud of the kind of mind I have.

[Lillemai]

On 6/18/2021 at 5:13 PM, Elbs said:

It's because incontinence is considered a disability, and disabilities are stereotyped as a horrible tragedy that no one could ever enjoy or even be fine with.

Well, you’re probably right. However, as stated, I would feel more like myself if I was completely incontinent - and I wouldn’t want people to feel sorry for me. You can only explain that you’re living the best life you can live, and that you’re both happy and proud of being diapered all the time - it makes you more you and differentiates you from everybody else.

[Ferix]

I had my first meeting with my therapist last Wednesday. Everything went great! He is on board to engage with surgery being a treatment option, which is dependent on me finding a surgeon willing to do the surgery; all of this effort will mean nothing if I can't find a surgeon to help.

 

Our appointment was done over a video call. From what I could tell, my therapist was around 35 to 40 years old, reddish brown hair and facial hair, and similar stocky build to me. He was friendly and easy to communicate with.

 

I started off the appointment by giving him my story. I told him everything: I told him about my incontinent desires, my belief that it is BIID body integrity identity disorder, that I've been using diapers to cope, I've worn diapers 24/7 for the past 4 years, and I've gone to extreme measures by using catheters and stents to simulate incontinence temporarily resulting in multiple UTIs. I also told him about major positives that have come from my passion for diapers: such as finding a large community in my area that supports me, I met my husband because of my cloth diapers, and that I started a business crafting cloth diapers.

 

I emphasized that these desires have been with me all my life, and with time, has only increased in intensity. I talked in detail how wearing diapers has not been enough and the desires have been so strong, it has caused me to take risks by using stents. I made sure he understood that the stents were homemade. 

 

I told him what draws me to stents is that when I'm using them, it's the only time I feel like my true self.

 

I told him that I understood that the measures I'm taking by using stents is extreme and that from the outside, it looks crazy. I told him I wanted help and I wanted to stop. I want the desires to stop and I want to stop putting myself at risk from using stents.

 

He was definitely interested about the stents. He was concerned it was always harmful but I explained that I have been using them for a decade and it was only on occasion that I would get an infection but most of the time I would wear it for a day or two before it got uncomfortable. When I had it in it was the only times I felt like my true self. It wouldn't matter where I wore it, the drive to be incontinent was strong so I wore it to vacations, to family events, and to work just so I could be myself.

 

He wondered what prompted me to use them each time. I explained that when feelings of incontinence dysphoria become so intense, I turn to use the stents to relieve that pressure so that I could live and feel like myself.

 

He said it sounded like I was using the stent to balance my intense desires. I found that was an interesting point because I never thought of the stent as a tool I was using to balance my emotional stress, even though that is exactly what I was doing.

 

I talked to him about my experience with my first psychiatrist. I told him I thought it was important to go over what happened because it's going to be an issue with every doctor I face.

 

The thing that my previous psychiatrist stated was she believed I would regret that decision a year or 10 years down the road. She also said she first must do no harm.

 

I told him I don't believe there is any amount of therapy that could take these desires away. How long should I try therapy? A year? 10 years? If there's a duty to do no harm, how much harm are we preventing if we do therapy that may never fully addresses my incontinence dysphoria?

 

I've been living with incontinence dysphoria for 35 years. It's driven me to use stents and put myself at risk over the last decade. I can't imagine living several more decades trying to achieve incontinence I know is going to be difficult if not impossible to achieve by myself.

 

I told him about how there are others that have gotten this surgery. One of whom had the surgery recently and told me about a revelation I never thought of having: He says it's over. The desires, they are gone. It's been months since he's had the surgery and he says it's the best thing. It blows me away to think about that and to imagine feeling like I don't have to pursue the never ending chase to become incontinent because I'm finally, truly, incontinent.

 

He talked a bit about how this was an unusual situation. He says this is never been done before that he's heard of but it sounds a lot like it could be paralleled with transgender surgery. In those cases he would help the patient prepare and accept the change with surgery, or if the patient wants, help being talked out of it. He says it sounds like I won't need guidance like that as it I've done a lot of the preparation on my own already.

 

He said it sounded like I'm pretty prepared for surgery. He said he didn't think trying to talk me out of it was productive nor what I was looking for. He says he's on board for whatever treatment option becomes available and will help me address the desires in other ways in the meantime.

 

The appointment overall took a long time. It was scheduled for an hour but we went over an extra 20 minutes. I assume it's a good thing because we are having a friendly conversation and he seemed really interested about me and my situation. At the end I had to remind him to tell me what he thinks I should work on between now and our next appointment since I wasn't sure when our appointment was going to end!

 

Currently, he wants me to work on being mindful about my incontinent desires: he wants me to recognize that they're there, except that I can't do anything about them, but don't let my desires take my focus. During the times that I have intense incontinent desires, he wants me to do activities that will pull my attention away from those desires.

 

So far I have not been able to be mindful of my incontinent desires. It's hard not to think about it because I can feel my bladder every time I pee. Almost every time I pee I am reminded that I am not incontinent.

 

One of my most frustrating problems is being woken up by the urge to urinate. Most nights I have to pee two to three times, each time results in frustration and anguish from my desires to be incontinent and disappointment that I can't pee while I sleep. It's difficult to do an activity to distract myself from my incontinence desires at these times when the activity I should be doing is sleeping.

 

Overall, I think the appointment went great. It seems like I didn't have to try at all to convince the psychiatrist to engage with surgery; He was willing to offer help whether I get the surgery or not.

 

So, it's down to the very last major step: I need a surgeon. On July 12th, I have my first visit with the surgeon. What's exciting is that this surgeon works for a university hospital, which is also the region's largest trauma hospital. People from all over the world get flown in to be treated at this hospital. I know from my research about the surgery, this hospital literally wrote the paper on sphincterotomies. Add to that, my urologist says the surgeon he referred me to does sphincterotomies multiple times a year. I can only hope that I am successful is convincing this surgeon to help.

 

On a side note: I linked this thread in reddit's sub r/abdl. The community there was vehemently against me getting surgery, claiming that me and my doctors were crazy and that I was making this story up. What's worse is I tried to engage with people and they would engage under the guise of concern while not listening to the points I make and would make judgements and assumptions against me, specifically to try to repel me away from the r/abdl community, as said as much in another thread here.

 

It's interesting to see how much it upsets the community to have someone like me try to get surgery to become incontinent. They choose not to listen to my reasons and conclude that everything I say is wrong and that I'm simply crazy (I'm not saying I'm not crazy, I'm just not that crazy).

 

So, if you're like me, and you find yourself getting surgery to become incontinent because of your incontinent desires, then be careful about the audience you tell it to, they may have a negative reaction and not understand.

[oznl]

Well that was interesting!  At least this guy wasn’t judgmental although I suspect finding a surgeon willing to go out on this limb (bad BIID pun) might be the bigger challenge.

I followed your Reddit (or should that be Rabid) link.

I’ve always been a bit puzzled by the degree of hostility displayed by many in the ABDL community towards the overt seeking of incontinence.  Yes.  It’s a very strange and very rare thing but it’s also not exactly about to tear at the moral fabric of civilization and visually, it’s going to be less confronting than some of the body hacks I’ve seen walking around.  Furthermore, we of all people you would think would have learned some tolerance to strange things. 

I’ve never professed to be actively seeking incontinence (although it’s blindingly obvious that I’ve been sitting around waving goodbye to it for the want of action for years now) but I’ve still had my share of unsolicited admonitions and warnings.  Claiming agency of somebody else’s body bothers me in principle. 

[sparklezBear]

1 hour ago, Ferix said:

On a side note: I linked this thread in reddit's sub r/abdl. The community there was vehemently against me getting surgery, claiming that me and my doctors were crazy and that I was making this story up. What's worse is I tried to engage with people and they would engage under the guise of concern while not listening to the points I make and would make judgements and assumptions against me, specifically to try to repel me away from the r/abdl community, as said as much in another thread here.

Yes, I was watching this exchange, and tried to engage with one or two of the individuals that would rather judge than listen and let others be. It did seem to be born out of some form of attempted stewardship over others who might read the content, but they miss the point and continued judgements without trying to understand. They didn't seem to understand that invalidating people simply pushes them away. Anyone else with incontinent desires won't pay any attention to their opinions.

I thought about engaging with some individuals further, but it seemed that it would be fruitless. On the face of it they acknowledged my counterpoints, but continued to judge and hold themselves as more sane than you. I guess there are all types of people in the ADBL space, including bygones and bigots.

 

1 hour ago, Ferix said:

One of my most frustrating problems is being woken up by the urge to urinate. Most nights I have to pee two to three times, each time results in frustration and anguish from my desires to be incontinent and disappointment that I can't pee while I sleep. It's difficult to do an activity to distract myself from my incontinence desires at these times when the activity I should be doing is sleeping.

To me, this is one of the most fascinating and saddest parts of your 4 year 24/7 expedition. Last year when I began my diapered life in earnest, I was able to start bed-wetting without waking only months after beginning to wear at night only. It took effort, but I found it totally possible, seeming to be mostly psychological. Perhaps you've mentioned in the past, but have you ever approached a hypnotist or tried other psychotherapies to overcome this? 

I too desire to be incontinent, although I'm not sure my desires are as intense as yours. I will cope just fine if I were never to reach incontinence, however that's not likely to be the case. At somewhere near 4-months of 24/7, I'm on the cusp of (and may have already started) wetting without realising. Like my bed-wetting, it seems to be primarily psychological. I'm about to write an update for my own thread covering this too.

Best of luck for the future :). 

[Ferix]

3 hours ago, oznl said:

I followed your Reddit (or should that be Rabid) link.

I’ve always been a bit puzzled by the degree of hostility displayed by many in the ABDL community towards the overt seeking of incontinence.  Yes.  It’s a very strange and very rare thing but it’s also not exactly about to tear at the moral fabric of civilization and visually, it’s going to be less confronting than some of the body hacks I’ve seen walking around.  Furthermore, we of all people you would think would have learned some tolerance to strange things. 

I’ve never professed to be actively seeking incontinence (although it’s blindingly obvious that I’ve been sitting around waving goodbye to it for the want of action for years now) but I’ve still had my share of unsolicited admonitions and warnings.  Claiming agency of somebody else’s body bothers me in principle. 

+

2 hours ago, sparklezBear said:

Yes, I was watching this exchange, and tried to engage with one or two of the individuals that would rather judge than listen and let others be. It did seem to be born out of some form of attempted stewardship over others who might read the content, but they miss the point and continued judgements without trying to understand. They didn't seem to understand that invalidating people simply pushes them away. Anyone else with incontinent desires won't pay any attention to their opinions.

I thought about engaging with some individuals further, but it seemed that it would be fruitless. On the face of it they acknowledged my counterpoints, but continued to judge and hold themselves as more sane than you. I guess there are all types of people in the ADBL space, including bygones and bigots.

 

It seems so ironic that r/abdl casts judgment and struggles to be inclusive with someone who seeks incontinence when the abdl community itself is so harshly judged by the general public.

2 hours ago, sparklezBear said:

Perhaps you've mentioned in the past, but have you ever approached a hypnotist or tried other psychotherapies to overcome this? 

Hypnotism, which I've tried for other things with a professional, not this, did not work on me. I cannot make the mental jump to accept the suggestions as more than words I'm being told. I see it as an elaborate form of positive reinforcement which could help a little, but I would not experience any physical affect.

The way I feel right now, and for as long as I can recall, is that treatment needs to be permanent incontinence. Anything less would not fully address the issue.

I think bedwetting just doesn't happen with some people. I'm one of those people. I've had it happen 3 times in my 4 and a half years of untraining and it usually meant I had a lot of alcohol or was sleep deprived.

I appreciate the well wishes and I wish you the best of luck on your journey.

 

[bobbyc]

The reddit army is very predictable and I would just avoid them...unless you're interested in showing off your "stash" or inquiring about how to "fluff" a diaper.  Same thing, day-in day-out and they will be offended by any individual thinking.  Dissenters will be downvoted!

As much as I feel I am in the same shoes as you I think I would just get worn out about explaining myself and my desires to various people who are probably hearing these things for the first time in their lives.   For that I have a lot of respect for you.

One thing that comes to mind when I'm reading your story;  someone else in these forums reported as having had the surgery but has had to have it repeated at least once (maybe more than once) as it was not successful and they still didn't have their desired outcome.  This single story is what makes me less enthusiastic about this procedure.  You say you have a friend who had the procedure with success?  Can you share any details?  Was it successful after the first time?  Were there complications?

Anyway, thank you for sharing your story.  As I read it I realize the same things get my down about my lack of progress, etc.  

[Ferix]

54 minutes ago, bobbyc said:

One thing that comes to mind when I'm reading your story;  someone else in these forums reported as having had the surgery but has had to have it repeated at least once (maybe more than once) as it was not successful and they still didn't have their desired outcome.  This single story is what makes me less enthusiastic about this procedure.  You say you have a friend who had the procedure with success?  Can you share any details?  Was it successful after the first time?  Were there complications?

Regarding the other people I've talked to about the surgery, I won't go into all their details because it's not my story to tell. You are right though that basically all of them did not have a successful surgery the first time. Two had to go back to get surgery again until they were fully incontinent. One is still working to get another surgery.

 

The problem that everyone had is that in surgery, they did not remove enough of the sphincter muscle and it eventually healed back together. The person I talk to who had surgery this year actually had his third surgery. It wasn't until the third surgery that they basically removed as much of the sphincter muscles as they possibly could. What happened was they went through a progression of surgeries: The first one they took out a small "U" shaped wedge; for the second one they took out a "W" shaped wedge; on the final surgery they removed as much of the sphincter muscles as they possibly could.

 

After the third surgery they found themselves leaking freely. They have not spoke to any side effects, in fact they are better after the third surgery than first two. One of the things their urologist was concerned about was a bacterial growth inside the bladder, which they found after the first and second surgeries but they found no bacterial growth after the third surgery.

 

With this knowledge I hope to explain to the surgeon my concerns about regrowth so that we can make the surgery one and done. I'm going to ask the surgeon to remove as much of the sphincter muscles as possible and as they are comfortable with. It's their knowledge and expertise that I'm relying on to make the surgery successful so I really don't know what's going to happen until I talk with the surgeon. All I can do is hope that they are on board with what I want.

[Therin]

You have an amazing story, Ferix.  While the pursuit of incontinence seems counter to my (and others' based on that Reddit post) perception of "the norm", I firmly believe in personal autonomy.  It's your body!  You've eloquently and thoroughly explained your position and I'm rooting for you!

[cathdiap]

@Ferix what kind of incontinence do you expect after surgery?

Given the fact that they only remove or damage the outer sphincter I guess you will only wet whenever your inner sphincter gives way (which is not under our control anyway). So then you would be wetting large amounts at once and not leaking all the time. Am I correct?

[Ferix]

55 minutes ago, cathdiap said:

@Ferix what kind of incontinence do you expect after surgery?

Given the fact that they only remove or damage the outer sphincter I guess you will only wet whenever your inner sphincter gives way (which is not under our control anyway). So then you would be wetting large amounts at once and not leaking all the time. Am I correct?

It's a discussion I intend to have with the surgeon next week. I'm hoping they will remove as much as they can out of both sphincters. If that's the case, I will drip and dribble; it will be like my bladder has an open drain can't hold much at all. This is what they ended up doing on the third surgery for the person I mentioned above; they cut out most of both sphincters. This is what I want.

 

If they are only willing/able to remove the outer, voluntary sphincter, I will likely have urge incontinence and void automatically whenever my bladder reaches a certain pressure. This would result in larger wettings but I imagine over time as my bladder shrinks, wettings will get smaller and more frequent. 

 

I will also rely on their experience and knowledge to see if they have any other ideas that may achieve permanent incontinence.

 

This will all be dependent on if the surgeon is willing to help. I'm hoping they do!

 

18 hours ago, Therin said:

You have an amazing story, Ferix.  While the pursuit of incontinence seems counter to my (and others' based on that Reddit post) perception of "the norm", I firmly believe in personal autonomy.  It's your body!  You've eloquently and thoroughly explained your position and I'm rooting for you!

Thank you!

[cathdiap]

1 hour ago, Ferix said:

t's a discussion I intend to have with the surgeon next week. I'm hoping they will remove as much as they can out of both sphincters. If that's the case, I will drip and dribble; it will be like my bladder has an open drain can't hold much at all. This is what they ended up doing on the third surgery for the person I mentioned above; they cut out most of both sphincters. This is what I want.

Makes sense to me. This type of incontinence allows you to wear and use your diapers longer. Less surprise leaks. Also dribbling all the time makes you feel more helpless. 

Is there any risk the surgery will make you impotent? 

[Ferix]

3 hours ago, cathdiap said:

Makes sense to me. This type of incontinence allows you to wear and use your diapers longer. Less surprise leaks. Also dribbling all the time makes you feel more helpless. 

Is there any risk the surgery will make you impotent? 

From what I've heard: performance feels and functions normal except a constant leakage of urine. I wont mind and my husband wont mind either.

 

It's something I'll ask about with the doctor.

[cathdiap]

On 6/29/2021 at 6:27 AM, Ferix said:

So, it's down to the very last major step: I need a surgeon. On July 12th, I have my first visit with the surgeon.

How did it go Ferix?

[interlude]

I'm intrigued. To echo everyone else, sounds like you are approaching this very professionally.

In terms is "regretting it" though, it had me pondering. Paradoxically, I feel as though an authentic aspect of incontinence is the desire, and perhaps effort, to become continent. I suppose your eventual subtype of incontinence will be total and virtually untreatable? So perhaps in that case you wouldn't have to consider the paradox. 

[Ferix]

I had my meeting with the surgeon. The short story is, they did not agree to do the surgery.

 

The appointment was done over video call. From the beginning of the call the doctor appeared, through their body language and the tone of their voice,  adamantly opposed to the idea of surgery. She started off the appointment by saying she had read the notes from my urologist. I told her I had read the notes too, and from what I read he accurately described why I was coming to talk to her. I added that I wanted the opportunity to explain myself. She was very stern and short when she said, "yes, please."

 

I told her everything, about the diapers, about the incontinent desires, about everything. I told her I believed what I had was BIID, body Integrity identity disorder, and that I had feelings of incontinence dysphoria in similar ways that is experienced by those with transgender dysphoria.

 

She immediately stopped me and explained that what I was searching for is not like transgender dysphoria and what I was doing was causing a dysfunction not fixing the problem. Her explanation was a bit more elaborate but overall she had a tone that was firm and ultimately she said she was not agreeing to do the surgery. She said there were crazy people that come into the hospital all the time asking for surgeries but said she didn't believe I was crazy. She can't just do surgeries because people ask for them.
 

I told her about my progress and talking with my doctor, urologist, psychiatrists, therapists and they all support me pursuing surgery... except for the one psychiatrist. I even told her my experience with the psychiatrist who did not agree to help and why I believed the her arguments, that I may regret the decision or her duty to do no harm, could still be followed if you consider that without surgery, I have to live the rest of my life with these insatiable desires. I told her I understood that the decision to do the surgery would be completely up to her and none of my doctors that are working with me tell her to do the surgery. but I felt like she was the best person I could talk to about getting the surgery.

 

She immediately took the offense, saying that she does not support surgery. I explained to her that I didn't mean it like that, I meant that her experience and knowledge is greater than most anyone about the sphincterotomy surgery and I valued her opinion and insight. It seemed like it was difficult to give her a compliment without her snapping back.

 

At this point and the phone call I realize there was no way I could convince her to do the surgery. There was no real point in arguing what she believed was a problem that could not be fixed by surgery.  I even told her, "it sounds like I can't convince you to do the surgery option. I am not looking for surgery as the only solution. I wanted to discuss any other possible option that you might think could cause incontinence."

 

She snapped back saying what I'm asking for isn't the type of incontinence babies have and started to explain how incontinence in babies work. I stopped her before she got too far and I had to explain to her that I understood it's different than incontinence experienced by babies. What I was looking for was something that gave the sensation I had an open drain in my bladder and I would passively urinate. This means I need both sphincters to not have control. I explained that my ideal solution would be the removal of both of my urinary sphincters. 
 

She said she recommends wearing catheters 24/7. She says she has a lot of patients who are incontinent and have catheters in for a month at a time before they're changed. I told her that wasn't an option because of how limiting in mobility they are and how painful they can get, especially with irritation around the penis during movement and exercise.
 

It really felt like she wanted this phone call to end before it even started; She took a hostile and guarded position from the get-go. I had to pry more information out of her because I wanted to know more and she wasn't willing to think any deeper about it.
 

I asked, "with any surgery, don't you have to cause harm to fix the problem?"
 

This is where it gets even more interesting and where the entire conversation up to this point is now essentially moot.
 

She said if she removed both sphincters, it would cause me worse problems in the long run. She said over time the muscles in my bladder would atrophy and eventually it would not generate enough pressure to push urine through the prostate. This would result in a urine backup that would go into my kidneys and could potentially cause life-threatening problems. She said there is no way to get the type of incontinence I'm looking for safely without also removing the prostate.

 

I said that's fair and I appreciate that insight. I definitely want to keep my prostate.

 

I asked her if it was possible that Botox could cause permanent incontinence.  She said yes but she believes that there would be the same problem with retention from the prostate.

 

I asked her if it was possible to wear catheters for a long periods of time, like several months or years, that would eventually result in permanent incontinence. Like I have it in for a long time and I pull it out one day and I don't have any control. She said no.

 

I laid it out as plainly as I possibly could and I asked, "so there's no possible way to cause incontinence without a detriment to the health"

 

She snapped back, "there's no doctor on Earth that would do the surgery and remove your prostate"

 

I said back emphasizing, "I said detriment to health... removing the prostate would be a detriment."

 

She said no. 

 

At this point I really couldn't think of anything else to ask so I thanked her for her time and ended the call.

 

It took me some time to process this call. I had a lot to think about. My biggest concern was her concern: that doing the surgery would cause more significant problems due to urine retention from the prostate. I definitely would not want to put in my life at risk if doing the surgery was that big of a deal. 

 

I have my doubts. From the beginning she wanted to give me the least amount of help she could and because of that I want a second opinion. I'm not a hundred percent sure she could give me clean answers without them being skewed by her personal bias. Would a surgeon who was more sympathetic to my story have the same answers as the one I talked to?

 

What I'd like to know more about is: How likely will it be that I would develop urine retention from my prostate if I underwent surgery or Botox? There has to be lots of patients to get incontinence, how many of them deal with prostate urine retention? If I did get to the point where I had urine retention from my prostate, what kind of treatments are available and how risky are they?

 

It also make wonder, what about all of those who have achieve some form of incontinence through un-training; are they at risk of having prostate retention as well?

 

I did find it interesting that she suggested I wear catheters 24/7 (though, I doubt she'd actually give me a prescription for that). It does seem to fall in line with what the emergency room doctor recommended I do after I got a UTI from a stent. The emergency room doctor recommended I use stents instead of surgery and that I make my stents out of stainless steel. I think the best bet for me if I wanted to do a home version of incontinence is to redevelop my stent design so that I could craft it out of stainless steel. I have all the measurements and specifications I need to make one that would work perfectly and I want to make sure it can be done safely as possible. The stent could potentially be safer than surgery, could work with any male anatomy, and is significantly more comfortable than a catheter.

 

The reason I mention the stents is because when I return to my urologist to talk about what had happened with surgeon, I can also ask him about my stent design and see if he has recommendations on the design and how to use it as safely as possible.

 

I'm going to take a short break before I make my next appointment with the urologist.  At the same time this has been going on, I've been dealing with a herniated disc in my neck that I'm finally getting over with. I really want to take the time I have, now that I am better, to focus on growing my business. I just hired an assistant and I'm looking to ramp up my production so I really need to figure out what I need to do to bring my business to the next level.

 

In the meantime, I'm going to slowly work on figuring out how to make a stent out of stainless steel. I have a couple leads on friends who can help teach me but I really need someone with experience who I can ask questions and who can show me what I need to do. If worse comes to worse, I'll try to train myself with YouTube videos.

 

That was a lot to go over and that's all I can think of for the time being. There was a lot more back and forth between the points I described in this post but what's written here is the gist of what was discussed. It's unfortunate that I wasn't able to get her to agree to the surgery but at the same time I'm okay with not getting the surgery if it puts my health at risk.

 

[oznl]

A disappointing, but not I suspect for you, an altogether unsurprising outcome.

In my limited experience with these professionals, social skills are not a necessary survival trait for surgeons and often get discarded.

Her commentary about prostate obstruction causing back up and possible kidney damage was truly insightful though (assuming it IS a thing and not merely some clinical FUD raised to defend a non-clinical judgmental position).  I would have thought the referring urologist would have called that?  If that is so, I would expect that many of us would have already experienced this?

I know that I’ve had incomplete voiding for many, many months and I do wonder about “fall out” from that.  So far, so good.

I think I remember reading somewhere that the internal sphincter is not under conscious control.  Would it strictly be necessary to disable it?  Of course if that were so and your surgeon not predisposed to reject your request I imagine it would have been suggested.

I guess more may be revealed with your next urologist consultation.  You'll at least have things to talk about now.

[BaronBrook]

There are a number of stainless steel stents out there. I'd suggest buying one instead of building one.

[Ferix]

23 minutes ago, BaronBrook said:

There are a number of stainless steel stents out there. I'd suggest buying one instead of building one.

I have only heard rumors but have never found a place that makes them.

 

I'll definitely ask my urologist if there's a device that he could obtain for me when I see him next.

[cathdiap]

Maybe you should visit the surgeon that helped the guy you mentioned before. You wrote that he became incontinent.after three surgeries. Apparently that surgeon had no objections whatsoever to perform the procedure. Also, maybe the guy who is now incontinent could inform you about his experience with urine retention.

 

[rick50]

There is a medical paper you can find online where doctors took a group of elderly males who were reliant on long term urethral catheters due to chronic urine retention and were suffering the usual UTI's. They fitted them with Memokath urethral stents that were extra long so they passed through the bladder sphincters and prostate. After treatment the patients were totally incontinent and their bladders drained freely into diapers.

[Ferix]

4 minutes ago, rick50 said:

There is a medical paper you can find online where doctors took a group of elderly males who were reliant on long term urethral catheters due to chronic urine retention and were suffering the usual UTI's. They fitted them with Memokath urethral stents that were extra long so they passed through the bladder sphincters and prostate. After treatment the patients were totally incontinent and their bladders drained freely into diapers.

I've done a bit of research on that. From what I've discovered there is a high probability that tissue can grow around the mesh stent. There's a potential that I would need surgery for it to be removed. Placing it also requires a procedure.

 

A stainless steel stent I make would need none of that and could be done at home.

[rick50]

5 minutes ago, Ferix said:

I've done a bit of research on that. From what I've discovered there is a high probability that tissue can grow around the mesh stent. There's a potential that I would need surgery for it to be removed. Placing it also requires a procedure.

 

A stainless steel stent I make would need none of that and could be done at home.

Yes, I guess there is that risk