Ferix

This is far from what I am doing. I am trying to be as honest as possible. Since you don't elaborate on what I'm lying about, I definitely want to point out that I'm not lying about how awesome my diapers are. They truly are amazing in absorbency, leak resistance, and to top it off they look fantastic. I'd be happy to go into further detail about any point I make. No I haven't but I looked it up. This article suggest, as many others do, that elimination communication is a method for parents to go diaper free with their babies. Furthermore, parents learn to anticipate when a baby needs to eliminate by timing, signals, cueing, and intuition. I don't see how any of this relates to untraining, especially when the article talks about elimination communication happening between infants and parents in unindustrialized countries that don't have access to diapers, and it's only a recent emergent movement in industrialized countries with access to diapers because of parents who don't want to use diapers. Huh? I think you may have missed the part where I linked a google search for autonomic voiding. There were many articles that the search came up with that went over autonomic voiding and the reasons why, including neurogenic bladder from trauma and congenital defect. Are you able to link us to some counter points that support your claim that autonomic voiding refers to babies? I'm not telling you what to do. I'm just curious as to how you were able to form your opinion because you say a lot of things that don't add up to anything substantive or informative and comes off confusing and disjointed; You wield lots of big words but you don't connect the dots. If you want people to take what you say seriously, you're not doing yourself any favors by the way your going about things so far. So how does vasopressin affect urine and bowel control? Can you do an ELI5 and provide sources? I'm not finding anything that is suggesting what you are suggesting. This seems like another assertion without evidence. Therefore, I can say you are absolutely wrong about this. Others have speculated that you don't work in the medical field but in some other professional field, I wouldn't dare suggest you work in any field as I would not want to disparage those that work in that field by associating them with someone of your intellect. For the amount of laughing and name calling from you, and the fact that you're the only one who can understand what you are saying, the only one in this thread that has conditioned behaviors to act like a baby seems to be you.

You're welcome to have your opinion about other people but most people don't just call other people names. Why not be polite instead? My data is my experiences and testimony. I don't speak to anything confirmed without data to back it up. This is why I said my bladder is hypersensitive. It's unknown without measuring my bladder size that my bladder has shrank. I do wet with more frequency and smaller amounts than I ever have before. I can only partially get behind this. There's truth to conditioning your behavior in a way that causes a user to reflexively use diapers after years of untraining. Something I find problematic with this statement is you imply autonomic voiding for infants is because of training. How do you know that's how babies and children void? From my understanding with taking human anatomy and physiology courses, the human brain is still developing neuropathways and that babies don't understand the signals that cause urine and bowel control. This causes their body to have autonomic voiding to prevent damage. This means that they do not train to use their diapers, they just do. This is the same thing that happens to people with neurogenic bladder (either from injury or defect), the body voids to protect itself from injury from an overfilled waste system. Autonomic voiding is not just limited to babies. How or why is this important? This just does not track. Vasopressin regulates fluids in the body, it has nothing to do with urine or bowel control. This is an assertion without any evidence behind it. What makes you think that removing the associated discomfort/disturbance of a wet cold diaper while asleep be the cause of people not being able to untrain? My diapers are very warm and comfy when they are wet, especially when in bed. I often wake up, pee, enjoy the warmth, and fall back asleep. If we go by your logic, I feel like I would have started to wet in my sleep by now. Using a diaper as a baby doesn't mean you know how to use a diaper. It really feels like you have a fixation on the baby aspect of autonomous voiding. Being a baby is not a prerequisite to autonomic voiding. A simple google search of autonomic voiding has no mention of baby bladders and many many mentions of bladder dysfunction and neurogenic bladder. As far as it's concerned, when people talk about autonomic bladders, they are not talking about babies. I do trust my diapers. I make the best damn cloth diapers on the planet and they are extremely leak resistant--more so than any diaper on the market. I pee on my side, stomach, and on my back while in bed with no leaks. How can you prove that someone took away my trust for diapers when I have such good diapers that I trust. This seems like another assertion without evidence. This is all just speculation and more of a Gish gallop of subjects. What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. I suggest that this whole last section is irrelevant to untraining. In the end, it seems that the only thing you speak of that has merit boils down to untrianing will make it easier to use your diapers. Everything else seems like a reach.

After 6 years of untriaining, I'm very certain that my bladder is hypersensitive to any amount of fluid being in there. It's impossible to say it's shrank without it being measured, but it certainly feels like it. I spent the first few years of my untraining focusing on keeping my bladder empty; I trained myself to wet at the slightest urge, pee in any position or situation, practicing reverse kegals, and I even trained myself how to pee when I don't feel the urge. After 3 years, I didn't feel like I lost bladder control but I definitely had intense urges. At around 5 years was when I started noticing that once an urge hit, I was already peeing without any mental thought on what was happening down there. I notice this most when I'm focused on something else and I find myself mid-pee. I don't really pee in my sleep because my body usually wakes me up to the urge, I think this is more due to me being a light sleeper from 15 years of working as an EMT and needing to wake up and respond at a moment's notice. It doesn't take long after I wake up to the urge to pee that my bladder will contract and I'll start to pee uncontrollably. If I wake up with the urge to pee and try to stand up, I'm peeing almost immediately after I stand up. There's really only been a couple times where I peed in my sleep. It's unfortunate that @babykeiff has resorted to name calling. There's no need to call anyone "pityful", "ignorant", "a fool", and "stupid". It seems like @Hannah YMS was trying to engage in a reasonable conversation while being polite and articulate about it. What you say does not line up with my experience or the experience of others that talk about their untraining in the incontinence desires sub-forum. If you really do feel like what you have to say has merit, then can you explain how you got to your reasoning without resorting to name calling?

No one has ever asked about my diapers, even when I wore 24/7 while working on an ambulance (I did that for 3 years before leaving that job). I did have nosey patients ask about my sexuality, my response was always, "it's none of your business". I planned that if anyone asks about my diapers, it would be the same response. I don't see how I owe anyone any more of an explanation than that.

Hey, thanks for asking. I'm still making awesome diapers while my skill and quality keep improving. I have quite the long queue of clients who will be waiting months for commissions. I'm really appreciative of all the support I get in the community and I've met some really great people because of my business. Currently my business is a 1 man art studio, so production is slow and prices are high. Admittedly, I know my products aren't obtainable by everyone. I've discussed with manufacturers about getting my products produced but there are several factors that just don't make it right for me at this time. At some point I'd like to grow my business more than it is but I'm currently enjoying where I am at as I continue to develop my skills. There's a lot I've learned about running a business and about making high quality products which I make sure I understand and can implement; I've been taking things at my pace to make sure I master each aspect of my business before I take on a new challenge. Overall, I love what I do and have no regrets. My clients, and myself, get to enjoy the best cloth diapers ever built. Follow me on twitter and you'll see my latest builds. Commissions are taken through my website www.waddlebutt.fun \

Hey! Since I started focusing on my business, the interest in making the stent went away. I go over it in detail here. Moreover, my control has weakened to the point where I need diapers in most cases. I've been 24/7 since 2017 and for the first few years I was very vigilant about staying relaxed and not denying an urge, so much so that with time, using my diapers became like a reflex. For a long time however, I still felt like I had a level of control that I could will to kick in and defeat the need for a diaper. This is no longer the case as it seems the years of actively using my diapers weakened the muscles so that now if I feel the urge to pee, I have seconds before it comes out uncontrollably or I'm already going. Once the stream starts, I can only slow it to a trickle if I really try. One thing I still have trouble with is wetting in my sleep. It's mostly because I'm a light sleeper and the urge always seems to wake me, especially since it seems to be harder for the body to release the pee when laying down which makes for stronger urges. However, I had one night last week where I woke up in the middle peeing and I couldn't stop it. I'm hoping that this is a sign of the progression of my incontinence but this was also the first time in years since I last wet in my sleep. Both times I was extra tired from being up for an extended amount of time, the previous time I had also been drinking alcohol. Admittedly, I'd get surgery for dual ic if it were a bit more accessible or if someone magically gifted it to me. I hear rumors it's possible out of the country for a price but I have come to accept my current level of incontinence and it's not worth the hassle or cost to further pursue surgery when I have other life priorities to weigh against getting surgery. Looking back from where I started to where I'm at now, it has been nice noticing the slow decline of my control with the realization that I really can't go without diapers now. It's empowering to know I achieved this state of self by my own actions. It just sucks that untraining takes forever and it's clear I still have some distance to go.

I tried holey Foley on a few occasions and went right back to stents because of the discomfort. I appreciate your input. I'm confident in my decision to stop all together. I'm not looking for suggestions or convincing on how to make things safer. I trust my own experience and judgement, as it's something we all do when it comes to using stents and catheters.

Thanks. You're right on the cranberry pills and that they can help prevent an infection. It's been a few years since I last dabbled with stents that I mentioning I used cranberry pills as a precaution was something I forgot to add. I usually took pills about an hour before stent insertion as well as I drank a lot of water before and during stent use to keep things clean. Even still, cranberry pills are a weak countermeasure against UTIs because if the viral load is too high, it wont be enough to stop an infection. I had gotten my infections while using cranberry pills. My experience was mostly good with stents, it was just the few times that weren't good was enough for me. Preload on cranberry pills and water were things added to my list of steps I needed to do to make stents work properly and safely. It's nice that I no longer have to consider or worry about any of those steps. Catheters were pretty uncomfortable for me too. It limited my mobility and the longest I could wear them was for a day at a time. There were a few times I slept with them but that made sleeping miserable and I usually couldn't make it through the night without taking it out.

I want to talk about my experience with stents and why I don't use them anymore. If you are new to the forum or haven’t heard of stents, they are basically a tube placed in the urethra that allow unrestricted passage of urine past the sphincter muscles. There are a lot of other threads in this forum that discuss stents in further detail. I have been a long time user of stents with many successful uses of stents over the span of 15 years. It first started out with catheters and then quickly went to stents as I found them more comfortable and I loved that I could feel urine passing without control. I was obsessed with my stents. I loved the feeling of having no control and the feeling of my bladder having an open drain into my diaper. It was the best. I was fine with the risk for more than a decade but as careful as I was, I still made mistakes and needed to be seen by a doctor. The risk I felt wasn't that high because a UTI is something people can get quite regularly and it's pretty easily treated if caught early enough, which I could recognize within hours of it starting. I even had amoxicillin on hand in the event that I did get an infection. However, with all the care and precautions I took I still got a UTI and the amoxicillin wasn't strong enough to fight off the infection. I went to the ER the day I started having a UTI. They gave me stronger medication which took care of the UTI within a day and there was no harm done. This was a turning point though. I had enough with the risk of infection because it wasn't the first time I had seen the doctor for this. I understand that there are people that never have issues with using catheters or stents but I have been unable to figure out what I'm doing wrong as I have had issues with using both. I decided to stop, even though there were parts of me that felt like I could learn how to do it better or that the risk wasn't that bad since I could treat any problems quickly. It just wasn't worth the risk. Honestly, it's been a big relief. Stents took up a ton of my bandwidth as I spent a ton of time researching, developing, crafting, and using stents. Now that I've taken a step back from it all, it's nice not to have the stress of needing to use stents or the constant worry of the risks I put myself through. It's also helped me accept my current level of (in)continence as I have noticed changes to my control. I’ve been 24/7 since 2017 and my control has noticeably worsened to the point where I do need diapers and I try to keep my perspective optimistic as I look forward to experiencing my control worsen with time.

I keep things really cheap with wearing 24/7. I do a few things that save me a lot of money: 1 - I wear cloth at night and sometimes during the day. The upfront cost of cloth diapers can be a lot but it saves money in the long run. I wear cloth about 60% of the time. 2 - I buy cheap diapers from thrift stores for $3-4 a bag. They may be thin and don't hold much but to make them work so much better, I double them; I cut slits in the inner layer so it seeps into the outer layer. Depending on the brand, this can make the cheap diapers just as effective as premium disposables. 3 - I save my premium disposable diapers for weekends or special occasions. By doing this I only have to spend 30 cents a day most days for diapers. It's only when I start wearing the premium disposables that it cost a lot more.

My plan is to take my whetstone and pass it across like I would a knife and make a couple flat spots. All that needs to be done is the circumference to be reduced. Since it's close, as I can pass a 9 mm sound, I wouldn't need to remove much. I haven't decided if I wanted to or not yet.

Sorry to scare you with outrageous sizes. The metal bumps used in my stent are from sounds. I'd avoid doing any research on urethral sounds if you have a tendency to scare easily since sounds can go upwards of 17 mm. Fr size numbers increases every 0.33 mm and the sizing numbers go up quickly; big numbers can seem scary. I originally purchased the metal bumps from sounds on eBay, which sold out after I purchased mine, but I found more could be purchased on Etsy: https://www.etsy.com/listing/984626861/silicone-catheter-urethral-sound-hollow I see what your saying and it may be an issue. There's other ways that the retrieval line could be done, my first thought was to go with the simplest, test it out short term, then remove and make any adjustments accordingly. However, I'm not in a position to test out the stent design as it is and I'm not sure I want to move forward with it. I'm still mulling over if I want to grind down the bumps a touch or not since these particular bumps aren't made in any other sizes. I'm bit timid about taking the risk of doing stents again as it's been a couple years since doing catheter and stent play last, which I had done for over a decade and it was quite addicting, felt amazing, but also gave me a few UTIs. Perhaps this was the diaper gods saying not to mess with stents again.

The bumps on my stent are 10 mm. I have sounds that I've used to stretch my meatus. The sounds that would work are at 9 mm but could not use 10 mm. One of the sounds is 9 mm at one end and 10 mm at the other and I can't push it past the part of the sound that expands from 9 mm to 10 mm. It seems that I am right on the cusp of the bump on my sound being too big to pass the meatus. This is not true for my anatomy. My meatus is pretty tight and the rest of my urethra is not. I know this because when I used my vinyl stent that went up to 11 mm, it was so tight pushing through the meatus that the bump of the vinyl stent would compress slightly to squeeze past the meatus but once it was through the meatus, it had no problem passing through the rest of the urethra. Pulling the stent out after using it revealed that the 11 mm bump on the vinyl sound was no longer compressed and for some reason could pass through the meatus; so it had difficulty going in but not coming out.

unfortunately, the metal bumps are too big to pass through my meatus. I'm still contemplating if it's worth trying to grind down the bumps a touch to make it work or not.

Capcon is totally worth it. I would have gone but this year was way too short notice and we already had vacation plans.

I hope you get better soon. Diapers are definitely a great comfort when sick. I put on extra thick diapers when I had covid over a month ago which, even if it didn't physically help, mentally helped a lot. I find it interesting that there's a lot of people who got CapCon-VID. It's all over Twitter and I personally know many people who went and they all got it too. Unfortunately, situations like these are just something we gotta live with now.

This is really interesting insight. I've tried making stents with bends multiple times. No matter the shape or degree of bends, the stent seemed to come out on its own or slip inward. I may try using bends again if my current design is uncomfortable. I have yet to test out my current stent design: I ordered some braided fishing line to use as retrieval which should arrive later this week. My current stent design is based on an earlier stent design of mine; It had bumps formed into the material and the bumps would prevent the stent from passing through the internal sphincter. That stent was pretty comfortable and I had it in for 10 days at one point. The bend in the stent was formed from wearing it for long periods, it was originally straight like the catheter above. What was nice about the old stent design is that it didn't extend beyond the bend of the urethra so it was completely internal. I'm hoping to get a similar experience with my current stent design.

I tested the stent with a monofilament fishing line and had some curling with the retrieval line setup as how I described in my first diagram. I changed up how I fed the line through the holes and now there's even less curling. Both ways did not seem to cause enough curling for concern but it's better to have the least amount of curling. The cutting feeling I was referring to was the line snagging on the tip of the penis, monofilament fishing line was not very forgiving if shifted around it seemed. It's stainless steel screwed into a silicone tubing (as originally stated). The grip of the screws into the silicone tubing are in my opinion greater than is needed to prevent it from coming apart. This is proven by my testing, you'll just have to take my word for it. Additionally, I'm wrapping the retrieval line around the proximal end so that the retrieval line is fed through every part as a fail safe for if it does come apart. The stent will stay in place because the bumps are 10 mm in diameter and the silicone tubing is 6 mm in diameter. This will work similar to how a catheter balloon works by preventing the ends from passing through the internal sphincter muscle. I've used a similar method successfully with a different stent design. I tested this warning out since your message by boiling the stent in water for 10 minutes and had no difference in fit with the silicone tubing and the metal ends; the grip is still just as strong.

They are parts taken from urethral sounds that I purchased off of eBay. The vendor is out of stock, plus it took them 6 months and 2 tries to send me some successfully.

Thanks for the warning. This is something I can test before I insert the stent. If the retrieval line in the diagram curls the end of the stent, I can easily rework the retrieval line so that it doesn't curl the end.

Hey @GrumpyMonk, thanks for the reply That all makes sense and seems abundantly safe. I've also heard that 70% alcohol works better than 99%. I'll add that to my process. I was considering this step as an extra precaution as the heat gun gets temperatures hotter than an autoclave, so I figured it would dry and sterilize at the same time. However, it seems like the heat gun is overkill plus risky if you're able to do without. My other thought was to air dry in the oven, similar to what a heat autoclave would do. I can accept that a zipper bag and paper towel would work since the stent should be sterile at that point and it works for you. Braided fishing line sounds great. I'll have to try that and find one without any dye. The steel cap screws aren't sharp but it takes a lot of friction to apply and remove them, probably more than needed to slip off. Even then, I plan on feeding the retrieval line through the end cap and through a couple holes I punch in the silicone so that the whole stent is pulled back by pulling on the retrieval line. Here's a diagram that illustrates how I plan on doing that: That all makes sense. My method has been similar except I've been using sterile alcohol prep pads. I use surgilube to lubricate as it's waterbased, sterile, and bacteriostatic. Thanks so much for your input and I welcome any more.

Alright, so I'm preparing to make another attempt at stent play. I haven't had the best luck at doing it safely and I want to double check with all those who regularly are successful at using stents on the following: How do clean your stents? For my current stent, I plan on washing with soap and water first, then placing the stent in boiling water for 5 minutes, then removing it and air drying with a heat gun. What do you use for a retrieval line? I've used fishing line but I don't like how rigid it is or how it can "dig in" if the end gets snagged. I've also used floss and liked that better comfort wise. Both methods resulted in successful stent sessions as well as sessions that ended in UTIs. How do you prepare yourself? I'll wash myself with soap and water and wipe all areas I'm handling while I handle the stent with alcohol. My current stent design has 2 stainless steel ends and a silicone tube. Here's my current stent design: I have yet attached a retrieval line but I plan on doing so once I'm able to gather as much information as I can and make an informed decision.

I have made modified foley catheters and I've made several different designs, one of which was doing something similar to what you've done by cutting it and plugging the hole so the balloon stays inflated. I found this method unreliable as I would experience the balloon deflating and the setup was tricky. I am currently building up the courage to try another design that involves stainless steel parts and silicone tubing. I hope to be trying out this design soon. I've heard rumors similar to this. Maybe they are true, maybe not. I'd certainly be up for surgery if it were possible to do it safely. With the surgeon I spoke to, they warned that if both sphincter muscles were removed, the prostate would eventually need to be removed as well due to the prostate swelling and causing urine blockage; that's not something I'm interested in doing and could put my heath at risk. A long time ago I would have wished that If I could turn the urge off, I would. It's not something that's been easy to accept about myself but when I did, it was the best thing I ever did for me. Embracing who I am has been liberating and puts me at peace, the associated costs of products are inconsequential.

Where did I take offense? I speak from experience and will respond with what I know. My experience includes working 15 years as an EMT and 5 of those years working in the mental health court that was responsible for admitting patients against their will. I have sat through hundreds of court cases so I know a lot about the legal thresholds that are required that must be breached to hold someone against their will in a mental hospital. The person must show that they are: a danger to themselves; a danger to others; gravely disabled. You can see a more detailed explanation here. Please explain how I breach those thresholds and how it is that none of the 7 doctors I have talked to about this specifically made an attempt to commit me involuntarily. I'm sorry you lost a significant other. You're not really providing any information other than an ominous warning without any information backing your statement up. No it's not. It may seem easy to put someone on a 72 hour hold if they show that they are a danger to self, others, or gravely disabled, but that requires a mental health professional or a police officer and it usually involves some sort of crisis that calls the authorities there. Anything longer requires a court order. I have not breached any of the thresholds. What's your point? Why call me a friend with such condescending tone? You're wrong: There are legal standards. I literally worked in one of the largest psychiatric court in the USA for 5 years. I know the thresholds as stated above. You'd be surprised that there are quite a few people with severe mental health disorders living their lives not in involuntary confinement. This is true for long term involuntary treatments. They would have to prove that the legal threshold to hold someone against their will is met. Have I met those? This is another ominous warning without any supportive evidence. I don't mean any disrespect, but you have not demonstrated any knowledge that is based on evidence. Thank you. Okay? You have not informed me of the risks, you've only given vague ominous warnings. Lets say I want to warn you about the risks of riding a bike. It would not be very effective or convincing if I simply said: "I lost a loved one who was riding a bike. You may cause permanent injury to yourself if you ride a bike, friend" without explaining why those things happen or what can be done to make riding a bike safer. This sort of warning would not show that I am knowledgeable about riding bikes or the risks, in similar ways that you have not informed me the risks of my actions.

Yeah, I've made more than a hundred cloth diapers as it's what I do for a living. Good call on making the zorb removable. I find that they are pretty dense in material and having it sewn into a cloth diaper that may already have several layers of fabric would make it difficult to rinse and wash out any urine. I've done a bit of work with zorb, 3 different types (1, 2, and 3), and I'm not a huge fan of it as it is at least double the cost depending on which kind you get compared to terry cloth. I was also surprised to find that the zorb fabric itself is often made of multiple layers of fabrics with different weaves, which is basically the same as if I took a layer of terry cloth and sandwiched it between two flat weave fabrics like birdseye and the results are just as absorbent. I consider zorb not very cost effective but it can be a time saver depending on your use. It seems like you found a good system that works for you and you should be proud of what you make. It's quite rewarding making your own things and experimenting around with different materials (and making mistakes) is just a part of the process.