Pc Building Assistance

[Bettypooh]

I am wanting to build a new PC before this old one dies :rolleyes" Now before I get to the hardware I've got, I want to share my goals: First I need to do this as cheaply as possible Please don't suggest high-end components I can't afford unless there is no alternative. Second is that I don't need the hottest performance If it's on the cheaper end of choices and worth the extra cost sell me on it-I'm listening. Third is that since I don't do vid's (beyond watching youtube), I don't deal with large files, and I don't store a lot on here I don't need huge amounts of anything All I want is to end up with an easy-to set up very reliable stable system I can websurf and email from using either XP Home or Windows7 for the OS. That's all I'm ever going to do with this PC so any extra performance or cost isn't necessary.

Here's what I've got:

(1) nforce4 ultra Motherboard w/ Driver CD (new in box and bare)

(1) ASUS P4S800 Motherboard w/ Intel Pentium4 CPU and huge fan-heatsink I was told by the donor that this MB may be bad.

(2) Sticks Elixir 256MB DDR 400 RAM

(1) Radeon 9800 PRO 128M Vid Card w/ driver SD

(1) Mega MX ATX 400W-DF Power supply I was told this may be bad too. I can check the outputs when I get started.

(1) Case- looks neat, has big fan on the side, dunno who made it

Leftovers from the Dell P4 I'm using now for Sound, USB, Monitor, cables, etc

I haven't built a PC since the Pentuim1/ AMD486 days and those were simple. I don't really know what I have here; I don't even know what plugs in where other than the daughterboards and the RAM All I know is that a friend who was a gamer gave it to me and said that it was pretty hot stuff speed-wise, and another friend confirmed that. So how about it- can anyone give me advice of what I need do to make a decent PC for my purposes out of all this? The leftovers will be up for sale or trade so I can afford to do this build. Thanks in advance!

Bettypooh

[~Skitty~]

mobo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131398 priced with cpu.

cpu: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103871

gpu: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102869

ram: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820134637

power supply: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341017

HD and case combo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.493014

cd: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136180

Subtotal: $478.92

a decent computer if you ask me.

you may have different taste in the case though xD

[~Skitty~]

http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-580/pd?oc=ddpdyb9&model_id=inspiron-580

this is also not too terrible. and you would get customer service with it as well.

just not sure how grimy dell has gotten since i last bought from them o.o

[lil_baby_wet_n_squishy]

Stay away from old P4s.. they have issues with overheating and running extremely hot. You should be able to pick up a Pentium D really cheap and it will work better. Also don't do less then 1GB of ram you really wan't at least 2GB. Windows 7 will run on lower specs then XP.

[belinda_sue_fox]

mobo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131398 priced with cpu.

cpu: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103871

gpu: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102869

ram: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820134637

power supply: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341017

HD and case combo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.493014

cd: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136180

Subtotal: $478.92

a decent computer if you ask me.

you may have different taste in the case though xD

Discreet video card and 600 watt PSU ....err why?? No need and will make the cost of running over a few years more than the odd dollar or two.

But yea go AMD. Reasons the onboard video that AMD boards have is good enough for what she does. AMD give better value at what she wants at the price she wants to pay.

Go with old case, HDD and optical drives then just buy MB, CPU and memory.

[Bettypooh]

Thanks for the replies so far

I would like to add that while $478.92 is probably a good deal, I'm a long way from there cash-wise The Athlon II X4 HD sounds great. I'm running a P4 now and it does what I need well but more speed is always nice I'd like to know more about the Pentium D and how it compares to the Athlon II X4. If these are common CPU's I may be able to get a used one from the local shop- a good idea or no? The price of the Athlon is about 2/3 of my total budget- I've got maybe $150 to play with right now which is why I'll be reusing the off-board stuff I have now. I can get used RAM locally (tested and guaranteed) for about half price so that's my plan there. The ASUS mobo only has 3 RAM slots versus the nforce having 4, so should I build the nforce or the ASUS mobo? No options there- it has to be one or the other since I've got them already. I do need a new HD- the old one I'm using is high mileage and the main reason I'm getting ready to build. I don't use much space and I would definitely want new for reliability reasons. Suggestions there are welcome too.

I also have an old CDRW drive from the 98SE era- is it compatible with the P4 Dell I'm on now? When I'm done with my build I want to rebuild this one and give it to my niece or sister. Sorry for all the questions, I'm just very lost with today's PC's and way too poor to make any mistakes!

Bettypooh

[belinda_sue_fox]

To be honest the stuff that your hoping to use is from an era of wood and stone. You will be transporting your $150 in a sinking ship.

You will be better off buying an Athlon II x2 and 785G or such MB and memory, which will eat pretty much all the $150(no idea on US prices and deals exactly ). Will get you a fair few years of use for what you require of it.

As to buying a used/pre built PC is a good idea depends if you have a version of windows to install. Savings there come mainly on higher end parts.

People give old Pc's away to get rid. The case, HDDs, optical drives etc are all useable in newer systems.

[Pudding]

I might suggest..

This

+

This

+

This

Which would total $159.99 + $39.99 + $39.99 = $239.97.

Altho this may be a smidgen over your desired budget, you'd be getting components that are all new, with warranty and without buying into the potential issues of someone else. If you could squeeze up the extra $90 or so it would make your life so much easier; especially considering as a barebones this machine would only require you to install the HDD and RAM and you'd be good-to-go!

This would net you a proper Dual Core CPU machine @ 1.66Ghz* with 2GB of RAM (plus a space SODIMM slot for future upgrade to 4GB) and a 120GB HDD.

The positives of this build are very evident in the pricing and the very very low power consumption which will lead to lower power bills, extended component lifespan and less heat put out into the room the computer is in, during summer. You also get card readers, on board sound, a competent on-board video solution (albeit only with VGA and lacking HDMI or DVI) and eSATA. There's also a slot whereby you might add wifi (link) for $27.94.

The negatives? Well, in addition to the aforementioned VGA output only, you're getting a machine that may not be that much faster than your P4. However, the inclusion of SSE3/SSSE3 and the presence of proper dual core will be very notable, and of course this is all at a greatly reduced power bill. Next is the fact that any current HDD's you have will need to be connected externally; via USB or eSATA (I've had experiences with one of these, and they work quite well). And finally is the lack of an optical drive. This can also be mitigated with an external solution, tho with less and less need for such devices it may not even be something you find yourself needing ~ Windows 7 can be entirely installed from a USB thumb-drive, nowadays.

This machine will happily run Windows 7/Vista/XP [take your pick] and could be tweaked to suit.

Puddin's Potential Suggestions for Modification (PPSM!)

Swapping out the foundation for this one, which includes a better GPU and has a HDMI port would wind up costing you ~$30 more. Doubling the RAM to 4GB would cost you an additional $39.99. And substituting the 120GB HDD for a 500GB model would cost a mere $20 more.

So while the base machine specced originally would cost $297.97 and provide:

1.66Ghz Dual Core CPU

2GB RAM

120GB HDD

Intel GMA 3150 (VGA Output Only)

A revised build using the second option, with a bigger HDD would cost $347.97 and provide:

1.66Ghz Dual Core CPU

2GB RAM

500GB HDD

ATI Radeon HD 4330 (VGA + HDMI Output)

Some things to consider, anyway ♥

*Although 1.66Ghz may seem like it's less fast than the P4 you have right now, the actual Ghz speed is most definitely not comparable across different CPU types.

[Repaid1]

I know we talked about it, but to me with your budget I'd either use your source for the cheaper parts or buy used. I know my Laptops are nice and both run windows 7, Have multi layer burners, 3 gig Mem (max for win 7 x86) and a nice 250 gig HD's, both run a single core processor and are very quick in the web department. That being said the "house computer" is a old P4 at 2ghz 768Meg mem and dual 40 gig HD's. It can cruise the web and do everything you would want. We have had it running non-stop (phone's system) for 3 years with no problems and it's gotta be over 10 years old.

I think at this point your just trying to get a more stable system, for a year or so to save up for the next upgraded computer for the next few years? I still vote Craigs list. While many of the higher end systems on there might be on the shady side, the Pentium 4's or the older dual cores are just being revamped by others with probably a bit more financial freedom shall we say. As such the market for them isn't all that grand and they are quite dirt cheap. A whole P4 or dual core can be had with all accessories for under a hundred.

These are tried and true systems, and personally i have way to many horror stories from new computer owners and their warranties. They are actually the folks that keep my side business running. I would get a wiped clean system and carry on and wait till you can afford the newer stuff like the i5 series in a year or so. Tax time is around the corner, that's when I generally revamp my stuff. so anyway here's what $100-150 can buy in my neck of the woods On Craigs list.

For sale is an Intel Dual Processor Server which of course can be utilized as a powerful desktop. The processors are both hyperthreaded and run at 2.8 ghz each. The memory is 2 GB ECC DDR ram. It is equipped with a DVD burner, a 200 GB hard drive, and an add on video card (Nvidia FX5200 256 MB). Can install fresh copy of XP or and/or and Ubuntu variant desired, Link to full specs: http://www.superware...495BX/ps/371658

Not to shabby of a "upgrade" I might just replace the home computer with it

[ArtemisEnterri]

http://www.dell.com/...id=inspiron-580

this is also not too terrible. and you would get customer service with it as well.

just not sure how grimy dell has gotten since i last bought from them o.o

Ugg, Dell? Personally, I won't buy any "name brand" computer unless it's a laptop (since those are next to impossible to hand build).

For the money you pay for their name you wind up with stuff (mainly preloaded software) that you either don't need or will never use while owning the machine. Same goes for other "box" deals: Compaq, Gateway, etc. And stay miles away from eMachines, they are the worst of the worst...

Stay away from old P4s.. they have issues with overheating and running extremely hot. You should be able to pick up a Pentium D really cheap and it will work better. Also don't do less then 1GB of ram you really wan't at least 2GB. Windows 7 will run on lower specs then XP.

Pentium D? Are you serious? Did you know that the only difference between a P3 & a Celeron or between a P4 and a Pentium D is that the Celeron/D FAILED certain diagnostics and had features bypassed? They are made on the same friggin' dies, in the same damn batches...

If you want a CPU that's gonna last, not have heat problems, and be a good price, AMD is the only way to go. You can get the same (or better) speed from an AMD chip for LESS money.

Look here for side-by-side benchmark comparisons: http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-10442_7-6389077-1.html

[Bettypooh]

BUMP

OK I'm learning more now The PC store I do business with will buy the stuff I have for resale I have no idea what it's worth or what they will offer so would it be best to sell that and add it to my PC piggy bank instead of trying to use it? Or maybe I could upgrade what I've already got with some top-notch RAM and a new HD instead, then slowly aquire a new PS, CPU, and mobo as I can afford it? Really all I'm worried about right now is losing the HD The slowness and glitches are likely from an OS full of years of crap which I could get cleaned up with some of the $$$. Wishing my old IT friend was still around here to score goodies from the back room for me again

Bettypooh

[Repaid1]

Ugg, Dell? Personally, I won't buy any "name brand" computer unless it's a laptop (since those are next to impossible to hand build).

For the money you pay for their name you wind up with stuff (mainly preloaded software) that you either don't need or will never use while owning the machine. Same goes for other "box" deals: Compaq, Gateway, etc. And stay miles away from eMachines, they are the worst of the worst...

Whooaa there. My wife and Myself both own Acer Laptops the company that sells under the Emachine name. They are the second largest Manufacture of PC's who just last year passed DELL. I have several friends who bought their PC's at Walmart or whereever that sell Emachines that they have and they love them.

The only problem I have ever delt with over the years is viruses. The whole thing with Emachines I think is the price. You can buy Their systems for easily half price of a leading competitor, and as such the "newb" to the computer market turns towards them. That's where the problem starts. I for one give them a high rating as compared to others such as dell and compaq and toshiba, who's systems are highly proprietary and way over priced.

I would happily put my laptop a blazing $298 dollar Walmart special against any of the competitors $700 dollar model. As I said, Windows 7, Multiburner, 3 gig mem, 250HD. 15.4 display all out of the box. I recently upgraded mine to a dual core for $50 so I got a pretty decent "Lappy" that I've been very happy with for over 2 years. My laptop is on at least 8 hours a day and has been for most of that time. The only thing that has been replaced is the Burner, which would no longer burn at 8 speed because I snapped one of the centering bezel things...and that was after burning over 1000 DVD's. So I for one would happily buy another Acer/Emachine. And I have owned them all! So there..

/End Hijack

[ArtemisEnterri]

Whooaa there. My wife and Myself both own Acer Laptops the company that sells under the Emachine name. They are the second largest Manufacture of PC's who just last year passed DELL. I have several friends who bought their PC's at Walmart or whereever that sell Emachines that they have and they love them.

The only problem I have ever delt with over the years is viruses. The whole thing with Emachines I think is the price. You can buy Their systems for easily half price of a leading competitor, and as such the "newb" to the computer market turns towards them. That's where the problem starts. I for one give them a high rating as compared to others such as dell and compaq and toshiba, who's systems are highly proprietary and way over priced.

I would happily put my laptop a blazing $298 dollar Walmart special against any of the competitors $700 dollar model. As I said, Windows 7, Multiburner, 3 gig mem, 250HD. 15.4 display all out of the box. I recently upgraded mine to a dual core for $50 so I got a pretty decent "Lappy" that I've been very happy with for over 2 years. My laptop is on at least 8 hours a day and has been for most of that time. The only thing that has been replaced is the Burner, which would no longer burn at 8 speed because I snapped one of the centering bezel things...and that was after burning over 1000 DVD's. So I for one would happily buy another Acer/Emachine. And I have owned them all! So there..

/End Hijack

Whoa there yerself dude. I was referring to the eMachine TOWER systems.

I'd buy an Acer/Dell/HP/Compaq laptop depending on the price and specs (and if I had the cash), but I won't ever buy a tower with the eMachines name.

[Repaid1]

My Friends PC's I was referring to are towers well if you wanna call them a tower. And Like I said no problems at all for over 6 years. So to each their own. Every bicycle has two wheels but they all aren't Schwinn, I'm perfectly happy riding the Huffy

[Bettypooh]

My Friends PC's I was referring to are towers well if you wanna call them a tower. And Like I said no problems at all for over 6 years. So to each their own. Every bicycle has two wheels but they all aren't Schwinn, I'm perfectly happy riding the Huffy

If you park it near me I'm going to steal your handlebar tassels and put them on mine

I'm still thinking this over. Part of this is that I want something that can be upgraded some in a couple years. My P4 w/ XP home happened only because the Compac P2 w/ME which I had built died (HD and maybe mobo) It wasn't hot enough to run a newer OS on since it was maxxed out already, thus it wasn't worth fixing I don't want to have to start from scratch again because of a similar thing- I want a PC that will last past one more OS generation What I have will barely run WIN7 so there's not much point in big spending on it. I had hoped the parts which had been given me were better but alas- beggar's get what's handed them I'd figured a newish PS & mobo (keep), a decent CPU (keep or upgrade later), a smallish HD (upgrade later) could form the basis of a "keeper PC" but it seems not....

Bettypooh

[Repaid1]

Is there a possibility of Changing the CPU in your existing machine..and tossing in about 2 gig of memory?

[DailyDi]

Just a note that I'm not ignoring the thread. If you were building new I could help, mix and match I am no good with! Best of luck to you!

[BabyDavey]

Whoa there yerself dude. I was referring to the eMachine TOWER systems.

I'd buy an Acer/Dell/HP/Compaq laptop depending on the price and specs (and if I had the cash), but I won't ever buy a tower with the eMachines name.

Years ago I worked for a local PC shop. I was a tech turned sales. We did all the custom built systems. When customers would come in with a quote or specs for an HP or Dell, we could never compete with the price. We would always play the quality component and local service angle. At the time, Dell and HP you had to send away to a service centre for repair, unless you wanted to pay for premium service. Long story short, none of us technical people in the store liked the brand name PC's. The image was unreliable, unupgradeable and just plain not worth the money. Fast forward a couple of years (still a few years ago) the company I worked for bought into rights for a national franchise. Through this franchise, we had access to HP, IBM, etc. Most of the sales people shied away from them, thinking they were the crap that we always were taught to think they were. Being a tech-turned-sales, I grabbed an HP system off of the shelf, took it out back and opened it up. Guess what - the system had an ASUS motherboard (same brand we always promoted for the custom builds), and all standard components inside the case (no proprietary bits). I threw away my old views, ate crow and started selling them. Yeah, I wasn't getting the margins that I used to get, but I was selling more because the price was better.

Now, a couple of observations about brands versus custom builds based on my experiences:

1.) Brand names tend to test all their components to ensure full compatibility - you don't usually have to worry about random screw ups and such because of hardware incompatibilities. Really, though, this isn't much of a problem anymore, but it still exists when the builder cheaps out on a power supply or RAM. Don't underestimate the importance of a good power supply. I've had some really weird inconsistent problems that you would more likely associate with RAM or heat, but turned out to be power issues.

2.) Brand names usually offer a 1 stop shop for downloading drivers and hardware information (in the case of an OS reinstall, etc...)

3.) Custom builds give you a large variety of parts to mix and match - if you're a heavy gamer, you've got a big pool of parts to choose from. Not to say that you can't do this with a brand, because most of them use the same types of components, but when you're buying something and immediately taking out something and replacing it with something better, it just doesn't seem worth it.

These days, I have noticed that the small form-factor PC's that HP and Dell are selling are less adaptable than their mini/mid/tower brothers and sisters are. Things like power supplies seem to be non standard, though the connectors are the same, just the size and shape are different.

With all this in mind, and if you don't mind a used PC, the company I work for sometimes buys pc's and laptops (mostly laptops for our field techs that are well-known for beating the hell out of them) from this place: http://www.offleasesystems.com/. We've had good luck with them, in fact I've got an off-lease laptop that my wife bought me a few years ago that I still use. It's working hard as a home server (Windows Home Server plug: Awsome!)

[ArtemisEnterri]

If you park it near me I'm going to steal your handlebar tassels and put them on mine

I'm still thinking this over. Part of this is that I want something that can be upgraded some in a couple years. My P4 w/ XP home happened only because the Compac P2 w/ME which I had built died (HD and maybe mobo) It wasn't hot enough to run a newer OS on since it was maxxed out already, thus it wasn't worth fixing I don't want to have to start from scratch again because of a similar thing- I want a PC that will last past one more OS generation What I have will barely run WIN7 so there's not much point in big spending on it. I had hoped the parts which had been given me were better but alas- beggar's get what's handed them I'd figured a newish PS & mobo (keep), a decent CPU (keep or upgrade later), a smallish HD (upgrade later) could form the basis of a "keeper PC" but it seems not....

Bettypooh

Not to turn this into a "Windows vs. Linux" thread, but if you want a machine that lasts beyond one generation of an OS, the ONLY way to do that is to use Linux. Microshaft (the name I and a few friends use for MS) DELIBERATELY makes each new version require MORE hardware than the previous versions. With Linux, even an ancient 486 can still be used for web browsing. And with Linux there is absolutely NO PRICE for the OS or upgrades, MS will NEVER give a new version without a price tag.

And people, please don't start the usual "it won't run ...." complaints. I have been running different Linux versions (both distribution-wise and release version wise) since the late 1990s, and with the WINE and Cedega software packages, almost ANY (nearly 95%) Windows app will run on a Linux machine, and for many Windows apps, there are free Open Source alternatives/clones (Sun's OpenOffice, GIMP, etc). Don't listen to the people who say "you need to be a techie to run Linux" because Linux is not the old command-line only OS it once was (anyone remember DOS??? - that was command-line only and people didn't whine then), Linux has a full point-and-click windows-like desktop (actually there are multiple choices of desktop, called "window managers": GNOME, KDE, fluxbox, whitebox, blackbox, etc.) that make Linux not much different from Windows anymore. And as far as drivers are concerned, if your hardware has existed for at least a year (or the manufacturer recognizes Linux as a viable OS), then drivers exist for that device.

I CHALLENGE anyone to download and burn a "live" cd/dvd image, burn it to a disc, and reboot your machine using that disc. You can "try before you buy", something you can NEVER do with Windows. Those "live" discs are a ready-to-run Linux OS (it's read-only, so any changes you make are lost when you reboot...), it won't touch your existing hard-drive (so no repartioning or formatting until you CHOOSE to install the OS permanently) - you can even UNPLUG your HD and use only your CD/DVD drive (I used a "live" dvd to run a laptop with a dead HD for weeks).

/end soapbox

[Bettypooh]

.... if you want a machine that lasts beyond one generation of an OS, the ONLY way to do that is to use Linux....

I plan to go to Linux later on I just don't have time to learn it right now I do think you can go 'one more round" with MS- the machine I'm on began as XP and it will run W7- passing Vista on the way I just don't want to get stuck at W7 withy my next PC then have to do this again in a few years

DD, thanks for the thoughts If I could do better I would; oh well!

BabyDavy, I'll check that out I'm looking for a tower so it shouldn't be hard to find one not too beat-up.

Bettypooh

[ArtemisEnterri]

I plan to go to Linux later on I just don't have time to learn it right now I do think you can go 'one more round" with MS- the machine I'm on began as XP and it will run W7- passing Vista on the way I just don't want to get stuck at W7 withy my next PC then have to do this again in a few years

DD, thanks for the thoughts If I could do better I would; oh well!

BabyDavy, I'll check that out I'm looking for a tower so it shouldn't be hard to find one not too beat-up.

Bettypooh

Umm, did you read the rest of my post? You don't need to "learn" Linux. It's not like going from English to French or German... Linux has a point-and-click interface just like Windows does...

[Bettypooh]

Umm, did you read the rest of my post? You don't need to "learn" Linux. It's not like going from English to French or German... Linux has a point-and-click interface just like Windows does...

Yes I read all of your post Please realize that for me and computers any change takes me time to learn Just going from ME to XP took me over a month just to get the basics down, and I still don't know half of it Is Ubuntu still a good bet for a beginner level?

Thanks

Bettypooh

[belinda_sue_fox]

Pentium D? Are you serious? Did you know that the only difference between a P3 & a Celeron or between a P4 and a Pentium D is that the Celeron/D FAILED certain diagnostics and had features bypassed? They are made on the same friggin' dies, in the same damn batches...

Same core but not the same, the celerons had lower cache(cache is expensive) it wasn't on there, it wasn't just binning

[ArtemisEnterri]

Yes I read all of your post Please realize that for me and computers any change takes me time to learn Just going from ME to XP took me over a month just to get the basics down, and I still don't know half of it Is Ubuntu still a good bet for a beginner level?

Thanks

Bettypooh

Sorry if I came across as snarky. There are literally hundreds of different distributions (or "distro's" as the Linux world calls them), each with anywhere from 1 to 20 release numbers. They all use the same central core (called the "kernel" - like a seed kernel), the only real difference between one distro and another is what "branding" they use and which packages they include by default.

As I said, the absolute best way to try Linux while leaving your Windows drive intact is to try the "live" disc, all you lose is some time doing the download and burn. Ubuntu is one, there's also Fedora (the free version of Red Hat), openSuSE (the free version of Novell's SuSE), Mandriva (formerly known as Mandrake), Slackware, and many others. I would suggest skipping the FreeBSD, Debian, or Gentoo based distributions for now, they are more involved (if you REALLY have time to burn and want to learn Linux in excruciating detail, there's one called LFS, Linux From Scratch, where you personally compile every package from the very beginning, no installer...).

Same core but not the same, the celerons had lower cache(cache is expensive) it wasn't on there, it wasn't just binning

Belinda, that information was reported by the website Tom's Hardware a few years ago. They are a major site for news and reports relating to PC hardware, peripherals, accessories, etc and other personal electronics.

[ArtemisEnterri]

::Wonders if this thread is dead?::