As a complete newbie to cloth washables, where would you recommend I start?

[FreeFlowin]

I feel like I am in a position that quite a few other people are in here: I would like to add a few cloth washable diapers to my stash to save money/increase longevity of my stash, but I have absolutely no idea where to start. The world of cloth diapers is so huge, and buying a single cloth dip can cost just as much as one or two packs of disposables, so to take a risk buying cloth diapers when most people know that a pack of disposables will do the same job just as well is a big ask for some.

There's also a lot of contradicting information out there. Some people claim that switching to cloth diapers eliminated all of their nighttime leaks and they've never had a wet bed since. Other people claim that cloth diapers always leak, and that you MUST have some sort of waterproof cover for them. Which leaves me asking myself, "are cloth diapers really effective or not? Is it really a viable nighttime option, or are they only effective because people supplement them with booster pads and plastic pants? If that's the case, wouldn't it be better to just use a waterproof cover over a disposable diaper?".

So I was just hoping to hear from some people in this thread who HAVE found good washable solutions for their incontinence needs, why they like them, what kind of products they use, and what their daily routine is like. As I can tell from all the reviews here, no two washable products are made equally, and some seem to have more issues than others. 

[Little BabyDoll Christine]

RUBBER PANTIES'R'US has a section of links that will introduce you to cloth diapers. It is in the icon section of my siggy

Since cloth diapers absorb the wet, they are not waterproof so a "rubber panty" is a must. This seems strange  because the throw-away has the wetproof part attached to it. In some ways, though, this is better since the panty and diaper are held up separately. Also, if you use quality items that are fitted to you well, you will not suffer  things like "diaper blowout" or some other catastrophic failure of the item. In the long run cloth, because everything is reusable is cheaper. As to the panties, RUBBER PANTIES'R'US goes into selection, sizing, fit and care in depth as well as supplying a list of places to get what you need and some reviews of the better panties

[zzyzx]

21 hours ago, FreeFlowin said:

I feel like I am in a position that quite a few other people are in here: I would like to add a few cloth washable diapers to my stash to save money/increase longevity of my stash, but I have absolutely no idea where to start. The world of cloth diapers is so huge, and buying a single cloth dip can cost just as much as one or two packs of disposables, so to take a risk buying cloth diapers when most people know that a pack of disposables will do the same job just as well is a big ask for some.

There's also a lot of contradicting information out there. Some people claim that switching to cloth diapers eliminated all of their nighttime leaks and they've never had a wet bed since. Other people claim that cloth diapers always leak, and that you MUST have some sort of waterproof cover for them. Which leaves me asking myself, "are cloth diapers really effective or not? Is it really a viable nighttime option, or are they only effective because people supplement them with booster pads and plastic pants? If that's the case, wouldn't it be better to just use a waterproof cover over a disposable diaper?".

So I was just hoping to hear from some people in this thread who HAVE found good washable solutions for their incontinence needs, why they like them, what kind of products they use, and what their daily routine is like. As I can tell from all the reviews here, no two washable products are made equally, and some seem to have more issues than others. 

@FreeFlowin:

When I first started I tried some very thick cloth diapers so I could use one that handled my large night time volume when it hit.  The disadvantages of this include drying time and how things wear (ie wear out) over time, I don't have a good way to add a layer due to too thick to really use two.

Instead I've switched to using the four layer purity adult diaper from Adult Cloth Diaper.com  ( https://www.adultclothdiaper.com/Adult-Flat-Diapers-Gauze-Purity ).  Only decision is what size.  For me, I am good with the smaller of the two sizes (36x36).  I tend to buy 2 dozen at a time and they last for years.  I rotate through my stock.  The last two times I bought, these appeared to be the most economical for me.  And it looks like these specific diapers are the diaper on sale this month (till Aug. 3) on their site, so a good time to buy.  While it is a good time to stock up, I typically recommend buying a minimal sample first to try out.  I happen to use two of these at a time for the day, and add a third for night time.  Part of this is due to my higher volume that I can wet in one round.  These diapers I've found feel right to me, are good on wicking and fold, double and triple up for handling what I need. 

And you will need to find some protective pants to go with this, and either diaper pins, bongos or snapies.  I've tried the bongos and snapies one point in the past (for a trip, to reduce metal going through security), and I personally prefer good diaper pins.  I am hit and miss on finding good diaper pins.  Some times I find the metal is too soft.  Some times, I find they are good.  As a result, I tend to buy diaper pins in a larger bulk order (say 20 or more at a time) to save on shipping costs and get quantity discounts. 

The key to leak prevention is good protective pants to fully cover the diapers and properly fit you while wearing the level of protection you need.

For the protective pants, one I use is the Leak Master PUL pull on pants ( https://www.adultclothdiaper.com/Leakmaster-PUL-Pants ).  I'm not 100% satisfied with this due to the cut being a bit too close for what I'd like.  Unfortunately, this cut is typical of a lot of the Gary Ware manufactured pants sold by a lot of the locations selling protective pants.  For the length of time these pants last, I consider them a good value.  I would just like to see them cut a bit taller at the waste and more consistent in the leg elastics for size (some I get are better sized for me then others).  And these don't work as good as the old VI Products (VIP) or Comco plastic pants did for me (however the Comco and VIP pants wore out about twice as fast, but were economical to use).  I miss both VIP and Comco, which closed shop several years ago.

In any case, finding the right protective pants will be a challenge that over time you will find what works for you.  I still try to catch when folks have sales to give a product a try.  Most vinyl pants these days I consider too thin (based on what used to be available).  And As I've said, most of the Gary products are cut a bit weird for me.....  I haven't gotten down to placing an order with someone like Angel Fluff that will allow me to size down the leg elastics and make it a higher waste with a quantity (12?) order, as those mods negatively impact the economics of the equation....  And my current solution is generally "good enough", but not as perfect as what I had from VIP or Comco.

I still use a bed pad under me at night.  As, my volume at times can be more than what I wear will contain, but not normally.  Another issue is to make sure the diapers are properly tucked into the protective pants.  When they stick out, this is were I will typically get something wet unintentionally.  This is where finding good protective pants that properly fit you comes in.  And as I said, I haven't found the "best" fit since VIP and Comco shut down....  Its close, but not at the near 100% I had.  (If I over saturated in the VIP or Comco vinyl pants I could get to the shower before I leaked.  A lot less likely with the PUL pants I now use due to how they are cut and "fit" me.

[ValentinesStuff]

First all diapers will leak if soaked beyond their capacity.

 

Most cloth diapers need rubber/plastic pants. Getting a good fit from them is important to minimizing leaks. "All-in-one" diapers theoretically don't need plastic pants, but I have never used or tried them.

 

Cloth diapers come in a range of styles and fabrics. How complex using them, depends upon the style.

 

"Flatfold," are simply a rectangle of cloth, usually one or two layers. These require some folding and shaping to fit your body, and pins to hold them on.

"Prefold" are rectangular with more layers in the center section and fewer on the sides (242) is common. These can require a bit folding to get the length or fit right. Again pins are needed.

"Contour" are hourglass shaped for a better fit. I believe pins are still needed.

"Fitted" look a lot like disposable diapers, and often include either Velcro or snaps to close them. These are also often "All-in-one" which include a waterproof barrier. 

There are also pull-on/training pants. Which have an elastic waist and are worn like big people underwear.

 

Always be sure to check to see if you need plastic pants.

 

On nice thing is that it is easy to add more layers for absorbency or bulk.

[Little BabyDoll Christine]

I avoid PUL, they have a reputation for being a bit leaky. What happens is that the material is gas-permeable This leats some of the things that are vapor at body temperatutre through. This vapor then cools down away from close proximity to the body and liquifies on your clothing and the outside of the panty. Urine is a complex substance some of which is a vapor at body temperature but condenses when it is a bit away from the body. Rubber or plastic does not allow that to happen

[zzyzx]

55 minutes ago, Little BabyDoll Christine said:

I avoid PUL, they have a reputation for being a bit leaky. What happens is that the material is gas-permeable This leats some of the things that are vapor at body temperatutre through. This vapor then cools down away from close proximity to the body and liquifies on your clothing and the outside of the panty. Urine is a complex substance some of which is a vapor at body temperature but condenses when it is a bit away from the body. Rubber or plastic does not allow that to happen

This is a very good explanation of PUL and other "water resistant" materials that go back to what I believe started as Gortex.  Based on where I live, these types of of material tend to work in a lot of situations for me.  However it is not perfect on this point of evaporation through the material that then condenses on the other side.  I've found these types of material to not be as good when visiting some areas with weather is different than what my normal is.  I think part of the problem is how warm (temperature) is just outside the material.  If it is too warm, the evaporation can support getting liquid through the material easier, instead of condensing on the inside of the pant.

I'd like to find thicker vinyl or other plastic (or coated nylon) base pants at a "reasonable" price like VIP and Comco used to do.  Rubber is good for protection, but tends to be more expensive in this day and age, and I've had issues finding good sources that have good elastics (or proper fit for seal) at the waste and leg closures that hold up over time, as the thicker rubber will stay in good shape but the seal at the legs and / or waste will give out way too soon.  I'm still trying (at a low frequency) some rubber pants I picked up from Protex when they has a good sale on them.

I dislike materials that are so thin that all they need to do is snag on something and you end up with a ripe or hole.

[Little BabyDoll Christine]

GoreTex is fine for water or other simple materials but there are things you do not want to get out of your diaper and onto your clothes. There has never been a good baby panty made of woven material. And that goes back to  nineteen thirty-nine with "Softex"

If you are looking for thick material, go to RUBBER PANTIES'R'US > REVIEWS check out the 7 mil pull on or snap on or the "Tuffy" 8 mil

[FreeFlowin]

Thank you all so much for the info you have all posted so far! This really helps break things down for me.  

One thing I didn't specify in my main post though was why I am seeking a cloth option (besides just saving costs).... which may help out with recommendations

To make a long story short, I just dove into an experiment a couple days ago; I'll basically be wearing diapers as much as possible for the entire month, and treating myself as though I have complete bladder control loss (and some bowel control loss too). I'll be focusing on relaxing my pelvic floor at all times (which I've become kinda good at), and will only consider taking them off in emergency situations or close encounters with family, otherwise its 24/7.

I never took the time to try to go this long before, but that was mostly because of living circumstances, and because I didn't think my partner would be cool with it, given how they reacted when I first introduced this to them years ago. To my surprise, they were incredibly supportive of the above idea when I brought it up! I've had many talks with them about this over the years, and they've become more understanding each and every time, so I felt that now was finally the time to bring up going 24/7, and they were actually encouraging me to start! 

The only thing is... they really don't like the crinkle all that much. During the daytime, under clothes, the crinkle is no problem, and they never hear it unless the room is whisper-quiet. At night times though, its way more noticable, so just as a consideraton to them, I was hoping to find some cloth diapers, specifically for nightime use, as I thought that would be a way reduce the noise, appear less "diapery", and maybe even protect a bit better.

My quick thoughts on everything so far:

- Prefolds: Not interested at all
- All In Ones: I LOVE the idea of them, but people's experiences with them here seem overwhelmingly negative...
- As far as plastic pants, volume reduction would be just as important as leak protection to me
- Pocket diapers are something I'd try, even if only as a waterproof cover over a disposable at night (I heard you can use them that way?)
- I would actually appreciate velcro, as it seems like snaps dont allow for too much adjustability (3 or 4 different settings maybe)

[zzyzx]

17 hours ago, FreeFlowin said:

- Prefolds: Not interested at all
- All In Ones: I LOVE the idea of them, but people's experiences with them here seem overwhelmingly negative...
- As far as plastic pants, volume reduction would be just as important as leak protection to me
- Pocket diapers are something I'd try, even if only as a waterproof cover over a disposable at night (I heard you can use them that way?)
- I would actually appreciate velcro, as it seems like snaps dont allow for too much adjustability (3 or 4 different settings maybe)

@FreeFlowin

- Non-prefolds:  See my previous link to Purity at adult cloth diaper .com.

- All In Ones: The reason most are negative to this is the water proof cover WILL wear out significantly before the rest of the system is worn out, defeating the purpose of the system.

- Plastic pants: Don't know that volume reduction and leak protection are compatible.  Maybe @oznl can comment on that.

- Pocket diapers:  Warning: I expect "pocket diapers" being used as just a cover for regular diapers are probably cut wrong to properly cover regular (cloth) diapers.

- Velcro vs snaps: I'm in agreement here.  Snaps are not a good choice unless they are placed / manufactured exactly for your body, and even then as cloth diapers tend to stretch with use (i.e. as they get damp or wet), don't provide needed re-positioning to tighten.  At least velcro has a chance to re-attach tighter after the cloth stretches. 

And maybe @BabyJune can comment about using a layer of zorb for adding capacity (over adding additional traditional cloth diapers for more absorbancy).

[oznl]

4 hours ago, zzyzx said:

 

- Plastic pants: Don't know that volume reduction and leak protection are compatible.  Maybe @oznl can comment on that.

 

I'm going to assume that where @FreeFlowin says "volume", I can assume "bulk" since that's the term we'd generally use in diaper/nappy vernacular.

If I've got that assumption wrong you can probably stop reading now ?

Cloth diapers are bulky.  I won't wear cloth to work although I'll wear them out to the shops etc.

My opinion aligns with @zzyzx in so far as the objectives of leak protection and bulk reduction are kind of running in different directions.

For leak protection, it's all about coverage.  I'm not afraid of voluminous plastic pants.  The key thing is that the elastics don't ride up to expose wet cloth diaper beneath.  The only "volume" in plastic pants is trapped air anyway.  Trying to use plastic pants to slim down cloth diapers would necessitate that those plastic pants are tight and tight = small = prone to exposing wet diaper.

If I'm out and about in cloth, I'll just wear some women's "shapewear"  pants over the top of my cloth diaper and plastic pants to lower visual bulk.  I don't need too much compression.  Too much will reduce diaper capacity by compressing the diaper itself.  I just need enough to make sure I don't get too saggy (a thing when cloth diapers are wet) and that the diaper is held up snug against me which both reduces the visible outline and makes the diaper work a bit better by reducing the opportunity for pee to escape it.

Most of the other points I'd make have already been made by other responders:  I'm fairly negative about all-in-ones (just use plastic pants), I find layered products easier to launder and dry.  I am however a bit wary about velcro as it never seems to last for me but loses its grip (no matter how carefully I try to keep it lint free).

On 7/30/2022 at 5:48 PM, FreeFlowin said:

There's also a lot of contradicting information out there. Some people claim that switching to cloth diapers eliminated all of their nighttime leaks and they've never had a wet bed since. Other people claim that cloth diapers always leak, and that you MUST have some sort of waterproof cover for them. Which leaves me asking myself, "are cloth diapers really effective or not? Is it really a viable nighttime option, or are they only effective because people supplement them with booster pads and plastic pants? If that's the case, wouldn't it be better to just use a waterproof cover over a disposable diaper?".
 

I don't think those first two comments are contradictory.  ANY cloth product will need some kind of waterproof over-pant be that plastic/rubber/vinyl/PUL pants (and I agree with @Little BabyDoll Christine that PUL over cloth isn't such a great combo and for the same reasons).  All-in-one products just have that waterproof over-pant bonded to the underlying diaper during construction whereupon it wears out quicker than the diaper it is attached to making the whole shebang inefficient from a lifecycle perspective.

For me, cloth is awesome for leak protection at night because I side sleep.  Cloth is excellent at wicking and most cloth diapers have good protection at the hips which is usually absent in disposables.

A compromise in bed (that I use during the week) is disposables covered by cloth-lined plastic pants to catch the inevitable minor leaks.

 

[Little BabyDoll Christine]

Some persons are a bit apprehensive about snap-on rubber panties., fearing that they may leak. If they are well made, then the shap openings are a bit forward-facking so that if you sleep on your side, the opeining is not there. Also, you can put pull-on panties over them. Many DPF'ers used to reccommend rubber over plastic, which is what I am in. This is especiall good if you are going to change into another diaper since the wet panties will also be changed and the ones you change out of can be rinsed and dried. I have been in the same diaper for so lnog that the innermost panty did leak and the second pair held it in

[Alyeskabird]

Cloth is a very diferent experence than disposables.  

Cloth diapers need bulk for absorbancy. One of the mistakes new to cloth people tend to make is that they do not diaper enough. If you are used to disposables, the bulk you need to be properly diapered up might be hard to get right. It also depends on how heavy a wetter you are. I tend to use two full sized prefold night diapers for overnight. Physical volume size is closer to wearing like 4 megamax diapers at once.  As I said a common issue new people make is they under diaper, the best plastic pants in the world will not stop leaks if your diaper is so over soaked that you are basicly swimming in it.

Under diapering is also the problem with most all in ones. It is not that they are useless, its that most of them are designed around being thinner and more concealable, they do not have the bulk to be absorbant enough to keep up. Still, they are fine if you are able to keep track and change regularily, and the built in waterproofing also tends to fail long before the diaper itself fails.

Plastic, and/or rubber pants are allso quite needed with cloth diapers. Sadly from my experence, most of the places selling plastic pants now really are not up for making good usable pants anymore. Oh sure, they look pretty, but, they are too small to actualy be useable. The waistline is far too low, and they are made too small to fit over bulky cloth diapers.  Cloth diapers, at lest overnight, are bulky. PUL is actualy a good material, I like it myself, though it is not as good as plastic or rubber. Part of the problem is that they make most of the plastic pants to fit over thin disposable diapers. They do not have the volume to properly cover a cloth diaper. ALso they tend to be too short, not coming up high enough up the waist to cover the top of the diaper, and the atempts to get a close fit they use mostly, tends to result in leaks around the leg holes as well, eather for falure to properly cover the diaper, or even just not having enough space between the legs to hold the bulk of a cloth diaper between the legs, thus generating gaps when you move around.  I will be honest with this, part of the issue with too small plastic pants is that they are made more for the plastic and rubber fetishists, rather than for use over a diaper. Its sorta like trying to use a pair of 'sexy' underware over your diaper, rather than a diaper cover.

I know some of this is basicly rehashing what others have said, but, a lot of this is a very real issue that new people have with cloth. Specialy thoes that have been coming from wearing disposables. 

There are also a lot of other helpfull tricks with cloth, such as using several thinner diapers, than one really thick one, things like that. Thinner diapers are easyer and quicker to wash and dry.

[Little BabyDoll Christine]

Read my RUBBER PANTIES'R'US, link in the siggy. It explains in detail about how they are used with cloth diapers such as how to select, care, some history and reviews of specific kinds. There is also a brief introduction to cloth diapers. It will get you where you need to go