12 Dead, 58 Wounded In Colorado

[Dubious]

Time to restrict guns in the US?

From what i understand, you can just go out and buy whatever gun you want and take it home that same day?

[Bettypooh]

Zpeed, it's not quite that easy- a background check must be run to purchase a handgun and that usually takes a day or so. Many states also mandate a waiting period for handguns (though those laws may have been overturned- I'm not in the info loop on that anymore). It's not so much that such checks will be effective though they do keep known felons from buying legally, but they do reduce 'crimes of passion' where the buyer may cool down in time For that reason I cannot fault them but since the government keeps the background check data for some time (which is illegal) these background checks are actually a back-door approach to gun registration and for that reason I will no longer buy a gun publicly. If you want to buy privately then you can often find what you want with no checks and no hassles- legal or not Laws that regulate objects cannot possibly work, for no object does anything unless first manipulated by a human

Horndog, many in our society do now live in fear, and they let that fear destroy their quality of life A reasonable fear helps keep you safe, but an unreasonable one limits what you allow yourself to do. I have a fear of flying in big planes bur I'm OK with small ones. That is statistically wrong but there it is, and I have flown on jetliners many times- I didn't let my fear stop me But I will not fly on an airline anymore because of the TSA- I fear my government even more than I do the airplanes Since I don't need to fly that doesn't matter. In the 80's when the IRA was very active in bombings in England, I learned something from the stoic British who have seen much violence and many wars at levels we have never seen in the US. They generally did not let those threats change how they lived their lives because they knew that to do that was to hand the win to the bad guys by default I'm sure it was there in the back of the minds of many, but they lived their lives normally anyway because there was no better option

We cannot justify making big changes because of the actions of one or a few nutcases- they will be so determined that they will find a way to do the harm they intend. I can make a gun, bomb, incendiary device, poison gas, or anything else like that with information, materials, and tools that are easy to find and access legally, even without going online The difference between the nutcases and us is that we'd never ever do something like this even though we could With humans you can't always know what their future actions will be. If you check history you will find that in the beginning of his rise to power Hitler was seen as a very sensible deep-thinking reformer based on what was then known about him- it was only later on when clear warning signs showed up. You cannot defend against the unknown nor can anyone else do that for you. Life is just like that and all we can do is accept it and go on living as best we can. And that is what we should do here.

Keep going to the movies and enjoy them anyway. If fate decides it's your time while you're watching that DVD at home because you quit going to the movies a bus may blow up on your street, a plane may blow up and fall on you, a stray bullet may come through your window etc. You cannot avoid all danger and things like this are so rare that you'd have to be really unlucky to see it happen up close and personal. If this teaches us anything, let that lesson be to care about one another more than we usually do. It is the only thing in our power which might change someone else, possibly preventing them from going off the deep end and doing something thus nutso. If not that at least you will then be able to see any visible warning signs sooner since you're closer to them now and perhaps prevent bad things from happening with that knowledge.

My heart is with the victims of this tragedy and with all the other victims of this world's insanity.

Bettypooh

[lilJester]

I've always found it funny that i have to wait a few weeks for a handgun, but if i want that rifle well I can have it gift wrapped right then and there. Yeah totally makes sense

[Diapered Jason]

Do you see Babyfergstar, you can't go anywhere without learning the shooters name unfortunately. By the way, I have not heard any of the victims' names from anybody. I actually had to search for them. Here is a link to them if anyone is curious.

http://www.thewrap.c...d-coroner-48721

So far though, there has been an argument on gun control as well as much speculation on the exact motivation (fixing the problem is not important, we need to find someone to blame), and there have been messages of spite towards the shooter and belligerence in general. All of this reporting for profit in the media is of course unethical in my opinion and I think it is shameful here as well.

Never forget, the more coverage an incident like this occurs, the more likely it will happen again, because nobodies will see it as an opportunity to become famous. There was a similar pattern in Japan, where a person jumped off a mountain to commit suicide. Well, this suicide was famous, because it was reported everywhere and everyone talked about the person who did it. Sure enough, more people started doing the same thing to achieve the same recognition that they could never achieve. Usually it would be adolescents, but anyone can get stuck in this trap. The same pattern seems to happen with shooting massacres, like Columbine, Virginia tech, and this one. Heck, if you search for Virginia Tech, Google will first guess Virginia Tech shooting. The second guess is Virginia Tech massacre. This is why I believe mass media coverage that goes on for extended periods of time is not only unethical, it is damaging. Whether it be tv or online, it is the same. I think it should not be covered.

[Horndog]

Of all people, Jason Alexander sums it up best about gun control.

[BabyFergstar]

Okay, Diapered Jason, your argument makes more sense now than simply saying the whole thing is irrelevant. While I do not know the details of every life or death, I do not believe, and refuse to believe, that any human life or death is irrelevant. At least dislike of the media is something that I can understand, if not agree with. Media is really a double edged sword - while there are plenty of negatives in the media, it also brings us all closer together and has aided in education. I am truly saddened by what has transpired in Aurora, CO, and I truly feel for the victims and survivors even if I didn't know them. I also wish the media would report more good news than bad for the sake of ratings, but I'm glad I know what I know. I feel that condemning the media for making a profit from reporting the news is as silly as blaming the medical field for making money off the bandages that were used on the wounded.

Anyway, for everybody else and the issue of gun control - I don't think any current gun laws should change. That will probably not happen, but it is my two cents. Let anybody who wants to legally own and carry a gun do so. I don't think it would make the world any safer or dangerous. Having the world's largest nuclear arsenal obviously doesn't make our country immune to foreign terrorist attacks after all. Something to think about.

[square_duck]

I had a thought earlier that this is just so random, and how this guy was so prepared and well equipt, it made me wonder about all the 'anti gun' crap out there and the fact tha we have a liberal/socialist anti-most everything American nutcase in the Whitehouse....I was wondering...what if this guy pulled this stunt and was paid to do it by the left wing anti gun people in order to bolster their whole argument against guns and private gun ownership etc. What if this whole thing, and other 'apparently random" shootings are actually co-ordinated by the anti gun liberals who want what ever stupid thing is on thier pathetic adjenda.....if you can't tell that I don't like liberals, your right Specifically PREGRSSIVE (socialist) liberals....Y*U*C*K.. I view these people as just deranged and as dangerous or more so to our society than most anyone with a gun....So you see the whole 'conspericy' thing going on here.

Things happen for a reason....and I feel the reason is here is to try and continue to undermine one of our basic rights and privileges! Just because someone else can't or wont learn how to %$#@! shoot!

"If you outlaw guns then only outlaws will have guns" and I said this as have a couple of others, and that is: A gun is an inanimate object, not a living thing. It cannot commit a crime or harm anyone else by itself. It needs to have a sentient being who is a thinking and functioning being, to pick it up..consciously load it and consciously take of the safety.... and point the now loaded and armed weapon at someone (or something...preferably) and consciously apply pressure to the trigger to make the thing fire the loaded projectile"

Essentially, Guns don't kill people...PEOPLE kill people. It's very simple, people control, not gun control.

But the people arguing for 'gun control' are the ones who want people control secretly...a society of puppets and sheep

I'm sorry this happened, I'm sory for the needless losses and injuries. Why it happened will come out somehow someway, through investigation and interrogation etc. But I still wonder, in the back of my mind, if there is something more to this...and how much he was paid, as others I am sure were.

Thats just me, but as I said, things happen for a reason, and I have a feeling this isn't everything that it 'seems' to be.

[BabyFergstar]

Classy.

[babyally]

Square Duck, im a pretty cynical guy but i'd hate to be as paranoid as you. Even if this guy acted for money in the interest of the evil left (those people who tend to focus a utilitarian philosophy rather than one of aggressive self advancement) and the problem is with the people of America and not the access to firearms, its much easier to regulate supply of weapons than to monitor every madman in the US (think of the necessary surveillance and restriction of civil liberties that approach would require). I have to question the empathy and even sanity of any American who defends their out dated "right to bear arms". Exactly how many shootings will it take before you accept that maybe your population as a whole is not mature enough to own the ability to end lives easily as soon as they hit a pothole in their journey through life. I don't expect this to be a popular view as Americans do take their illusion of freedom very seriously but times have changed since the declaration of independence. I understand why it was put in the constitution, you had a lot of people to fight, domestically, so arming everyone just makes conscription easier but I find it so depressing that when no foreign aggressors presented themselves the American will to kill people never dissipated. The US prosecutes extremely aggressive foreign policy for its own interests (arguable the right of any state but hardly an enlightened progressive one) but this doesn't quite satisfy the blood lust, does it. Just a shame that when faced with no one to kill in self defense Americans are happy to settle for killing each other. Shame he didn't watch the film a bit before unloading, the guy in that cinema and many other itchy fingers like him really have never entertained Batman's ideal that its best to settle your grievances without killing people as a first/only resort.

[BabyFergstar]

I don't believe in carrying a gun myself, but I don't want to impede the right of another to do so. Why? Because I don't want my right to free speech, or my right to freedom of religion, or my right to peaceably assemble to be impeded. They are already impeded by some as it is. If the right to bear arms were not in a government document that protects other freedoms I do enjoy, I wouldn't care, but when you give up one freedom, another can not be far behind. And it is sad that Americans kill each other.

[Diapered Jason]

I had a thought earlier that this is just so random, and how this guy was so prepared and well equipt, it made me wonder about all the 'anti gun' crap out there and the fact tha we have a liberal/socialist anti-most everything American nutcase in the Whitehouse....I was wondering...what if this guy pulled this stunt and was paid to do it by the left wing anti gun people in order to bolster their whole argument against guns and private gun ownership etc. What if this whole thing, and other 'apparently random" shootings are actually co-ordinated by the anti gun liberals who want what ever stupid thing is on thier pathetic adjenda.....if you can't tell that I don't like liberals, your right Specifically PREGRSSIVE (socialist) liberals....Y*U*C*K.. I view these people as just deranged and as dangerous or more so to our society than most anyone with a gun....So you see the whole 'conspericy' thing going on here.

Things happen for a reason....and I feel the reason is here is to try and continue to undermine one of our basic rights and privileges! Just because someone else can't or wont learn how to %$#@! shoot!

This shit has got to stop. Assumptions and fear mongering are all I see there. Obama is not going to do anything about gun control laws, that is certain. I know you fear he will, but he won't. He did not do it during Gifford's shooting, he won't do it now. In fact, during his time as president, he expanded your freedoms in this area. Also, I am kind of liberal, but I honestly do not care about the gun control issue.

So, I think you should take a break and cool off. You are obviously emotionally charged at this moment and you are using only your cerebral cortex. Take a break, really think about what you said, and don't make this mistake again. You are a moderator after all.

[Horndog]

Sorry square_duck, but the kind of misinformed attitude you have toward the President and politics has led to a record amount of death threats issued toward Obama. That rhetoric invokes violence.

[freswith]

A few thoughts from this side of the pond...

How the hell did he get into a theatre carrying a sizable arsenal of weapons? What was he wearing? How did he conceal them?

If several people in the theatre were armed the result might have been a bar-room brawl with bullets going in all directions, many more casualties, and the gunman escaping in the confusion never to be found.

Does a cruel and unusual crime merit a cruel and unusual punishment?

If he was attention seeking, why not make a negative example of him: ban all photographs and limit reporting to the barest facts? (There is plenty of precedent - in the UK it would be declared "sub-judice" in order not to influence possible jurors.)

[Guest *~Andi~*]

Did anyone see his first appearance in court today, guy has ronald mcdonald red hair and its afroed... he just looks weird to me I guess. I have been reading some of the accounts of the survivors and its just unbelievable. sigh... so sad

[lilJester]

actually, saying his name is everywhere but the victims aren't is wrong. I live in misery (they just spell it wong as missouri) and our news station had the names of victims out on saturday.

[BabyFergstar]

[Repaid1]

A few thoughts from this side of the pond...

How the hell did he get into a theatre carrying a sizable arsenal of weapons? What was he wearing? How did he conceal them?

If several people in the theatre were armed the result might have been a bar-room brawl with bullets going in all directions, many more casualties, and the gunman escaping in the confusion never to be found.

Does a cruel and unusual crime merit a cruel and unusual punishment?

If he was attention seeking, why not make a negative example of him: ban all photographs and limit reporting to the barest facts? (There is plenty of precedent - in the UK it would be declared "sub-judice" in order not to influence possible jurors.)

The report I saw was that he broke in through a side emergency exit. It was midnight dark outside and the way parking is he could have easily pull almost to that door which is usually not very visible to anyone, a trench coat over all this for that kind of movie would have concealed everything. As such while the movie was in progress and during a climatic loud scene. Thus not gaining any attention as all were focused to the screen. As he was wearing body armor, all but a clean face shot wouldn't have stopped him. So anyone with a concealed carry, which in my state is illegal in the theater, would have just pissed him off and then ended up on the end of a shot in their direction.

As for the trail. I don't know why he is even given a trail, but it is what it is. Innocent until proven guilty by a jury of peers. Where they going to find peers for this wacko is beyond me. He did it, we know he did it. He isn't going to get a fair trail and we all know that. He is already guilty and no one is going to say otherwise. Mentally ill...perhaps, but he still dies in my opinion!

[lilJester]

I just HATE the fact that they say "suspect"....really? I mean jsut drop that friggin word, there is no "suspect" to this whole thing.

[ForbiddenFruit]

The most bizarre thing I heard out of this was proponents of gun ownership (not saying I oppose it in and of itself) saying that this shows why gun laws should be lax, i.e. if everyone else had a gun this would have been averted.

So...to stop people from shooting others in theaters, you freely let them bring guns into theaters?

[square_duck]

The state of Arizona has very lax gun laws and issues permits for people to carry weapons....they also have the lowest crime rate in the country. The psychology and thinking is simple, no one knows who is carrying what, and who is armed.

So no one wants to mess with anyone else because it could get them shot!

If itisn't broken, don't fix it...so if it works in Arizona....

Just saying....

[Repaid1]

Yeah the logic works from the top. We got nukes, then you got nukes. We got more nukes, so you don't fire yours.. You matched then outnumbered our nukes so we upped ours. Then we looked at the numbers. If you shot all of yours, then we would retaliate and shoot all of ours. Result no more people on earth. End result? Not worth it, no real winner, So as it stands.

If I got a gun or you think I might, would you be so quick to pull yours, providing that once you aim yours at me the other five people around you and aiming theirs at you? Logic is as logic does. Unfortunately not a lot of logic in this case. Other than knowing that where this happened they do not have Concealed Carry and maybe he was quite aware of that. Who knows? Seems only him.

[Guest *~Andi~*]

The most bizarre thing I heard out of this was proponents of gun ownership (not saying I oppose it in and of itself) saying that this shows why gun laws should be lax, i.e. if everyone else had a gun this would have been averted.

So...to stop people from shooting others in theaters, you freely let them bring guns into theaters?

ie: real life mafia wars???? I kinda see where repaid went with that one...

Did anyone read the account about the witness who said there was a guy who got up to use his cellphone right before the guy came in and shot everyone?

[Guest *~Andi~*]

tried to make it smaller with no luck... sorry

anyways...

Found this on facebook... it just pisses me off... I find this to be pathetic and i dont want to hear anybody say anything about the fact that its not racist, yea the guy deserves the death penalty in my eyes and he defintely has a mental illness cuz no one in their right mind would do something like that but no matter what color your skin is if you did something like this Id think you were a mental case too, but to make a post like this... its no wonder our world relishes in racism cuz there is such strong contribution to it from ppl like whoever made this, and if ppl who posted to it or liked it are no better. apparently its no longer about what the guy did, its now about the color of his skin and how hes looked at based on that... I think its truly sad. When I saw this pic and read some of the things posted under it, my stomach turned too. But you know the sad thing is that ppl cant view this as a senseless tragedy without turning it into a RACIAL ISSUE...

[Bettypooh]

AFAIK it was not a racial; issue, rather a nutcase issue and when things happen at that level there can be no way to expect anything conscionable from that person, including for them to nor be racially or otherwise motivated. This is a tragedy and sanity had no role in this If it had, this would not have happened.

Bettypooh

[ForbiddenFruit]

The state of Arizona has very lax gun laws and issues permits for people to carry weapons....they also have the lowest crime rate in the country. The psychology and thinking is simple, no one knows who is carrying what, and who is armed.

So no one wants to mess with anyone else because it could get them shot!

If itisn't broken, don't fix it...so if it works in Arizona....

Just saying....

You can't be serious. If you were to let everyone in with guns, it would be possible to easily co-ordinate an attack among a group. Everyone having guns doesn't remove the element of surprise. If twenty people pull a gun, what are the odds everyone's going to automatically know who pulled in the first place as opposed to shooting at someone who *looks* like they *might* be the loony? Step up security. Job done.

tried to make it smaller with no luck... sorry

anyways...

Found this on facebook... it just pisses me off... I find this to be pathetic and i dont want to hear anybody say anything about the fact that its not racist, yea the guy deserves the death penalty in my eyes and he defintely has a mental illness cuz no one in their right mind would do something like that but no matter what color your skin is if you did something like this Id think you were a mental case too, but to make a post like this... its no wonder our world relishes in racism cuz there is such strong contribution to it from ppl like whoever made this, and if ppl who posted to it or liked it are no better. apparently its no longer about what the guy did, its now about the color of his skin and how hes looked at based on that... I think its truly sad. When I saw this pic and read some of the things posted under it, my stomach turned too. But you know the sad thing is that ppl cant view this as a senseless tragedy without turning it into a RACIAL ISSUE...

This image is frigging ridiculous. I think the 'mental illlness' consensus comes from the fact he looks, sounds and moves like a man with a mental illness...plus they seem to have missed the occasions he has been referred to as a thug and an act of terrorism.