A Bad Day For America

[sarah_ab]

soooo if you dont want the government tell us waht to do, well then i guess abortion should be made legal.. otherwise.. ohhh look out theres teh government telling us what to do!

and isn't communist democrat a bit of an oxymoron?

[redneck diaper boy]

Black people in America have been brainwashed by extreme liberals. It was a conspiracy that started in the 1960's by President Johnson. Johnson even boasted about his motive. "I'll have those Niggers voting for Democrats for the next 200 years". This was the motive in creating the American welfare state. (the great society) The whole thing is sinister. The more people that the politicians make dependant on government, the broader their power base becomes.

For people of color, progressive liberalism has been a great failure. They kill each other off at a rate that the old Ku Klux Klan could only dream of. Poverty and un-employment is commonplace. Most minority children are born out of wedlock. You can thank the progressives and the welfare state for it.

Socialism only works until the government runs out of other people's money.

Pay attemtion to the Congressional Budget Office when they talk about cost. They have always guessed low. (at least 3 times low!)

Isn't it funny that everyone in that photo is white? Makes you think. Makes you think.

[BigBoy]

Black people in America have been brainwashed by extreme liberals. It was a conspiracy that started in the 1960's by President Johnson. Johnson even boasted about his motive. "I'll have those Niggers voting for Democrats for the next 200 years". This was the motive in creating the American welfare state. (the great society) The whole thing is sinister. The more people that the politicians make dependant on government, the broader their power base becomes.

For people of color, progressive liberalism has been a great failure. They kill each other off at a rate that the old Ku Klux Klan could only dream of. Poverty and un-employment is commonplace. Most minority children are born out of wedlock. You can thank the progressives and the welfare state for it.

Socialism only works until the government runs out of other people's money.

Pay attemtion to the Congressional Budget Office when they talk about cost. They have always guessed low. (at least 3 times low!)

Do you even actually know any liberals or do you think liberals are the boogieman?

Liberals are not evil. We are people who have a different set of solutions for the same problems we all face. The GOP had DC on lock for most of this decade. We still have a lot of the same problems. The Democrats are taking a crack at it now. I just want the problems to be solved, or at least get better.

When you demonize your opposition it makes it easier to do horrible things to them. I am a Unitarian Universalist. A year or two ago a guy goes into a UU church and kills a couple people. I can't remember if others were shot. The guy was a big right wing pundit fan, O'Rielly, Rush, etc... It wasn't my congregation, but it makes me eye visitors. It sucks to think I have to worry about being shot in my own church. The far left does the same thing, it demonizes the right. They tend to be more annoying than dangerous, but still demonizing is still demonizing.

Liberals are not evil. Conservatives are not evil. We just have different solutions.

[redneck diaper boy]

Do you even actually know any liberals or do you think liberals are the boogieman?

Yes I know liberal and I do believe ther are evil. We now have a President who wants to destroy the fabric of America on purpose! Anyone with half a brain knows that we can't spend ourselves out of a recession. Obama is copying the Hitler model. National Socialism doesn't work. As for the mortgage problem, it was caused by liberals. The government, under pressure organizations like ACORN, pressured banks to make loans to people who would not qualify for such loans. No down payment along with the 80-20 style loans cause predatory borrowing. It can take years to forclose on a property. In the mean time mortgage payments are not being made and people still get to live in these homes. After eviction, these people often destroy property. They take HVAC equipment, kitchen cabinets, and appliances. The banks were left holding the bag!

Liberals are not evil. We are people who have a different set of solutions for the same problems we all face. The GOP had DC on lock for most of this decade. We still have a lot of the same problems. The Democrats are taking a crack at it now. I just want the problems to be solved, or at least get better.

I remember the last president that ran under the platform of "change". We got change all right. Jimy Carter gave us double digit un-employment, double digit inflation and double digit interest rates. The change Obama advocates has already been tried and in every case it has been a total failure. Communism has never worked anywhere.

When you demonize your opposition it makes it easier to do horrible things to them. I am a Unitarian Universalist. A year or two ago a guy goes into a UU church and kills a couple people. I can't remember if others were shot. The guy was a big right wing pundit fan, O'Rielly, Rush, etc... It wasn't my congregation, but it makes me eye visitors. It sucks to think I have to worry about being shot in my own church. The far left does the same thing, it demonizes the right. They tend to be more annoying than dangerous, but still demonizing is still demonizing.

Ah you are refering to Tiller the baby killer and a Godless church. (Correct me if I am wrong) First of all, I would much rather meet my maker as the shooter than the abortionist. I would never shoot anyone but this guy did unborn babies a favor. There are no absolutes in the UU Church. Whatever you believe if it makes you feel good that is OK. I know where Tiller is now and it is a lot warmer than it is here in Florida.

There are a lot of nutballs on the face of the earth. Muslim terrorist brought down the World Trade center. Another Muslim nutball terrorized the DC area. Another Muslim terrorist shot up people on a military base a week ago and liberals are making up excuses for this idiot!

A liberals solution to everything is to take from producers and render unto non-producers. They are generous with other peoples money. That is pure evil. Killing unwanted babies is evil. Taking away the right of others is evil.

Liberals are not evil. Conservatives are not evil. We just have different solutions.

[Andy]

Right, so its survival of the fit, or the guy with the biggest gun.

You know, they got big guns over there

[BigBoy]

I am a peaceful person and I am trying not to lose my cool. Honestly about 8 years ago I sounded just like you, but on the other side.

I am a proud Unitarian Universalist. Some of the forefathers of our nation were Unitarians.

I don't believe that any one group, denomination or even religion has a monopoly on truth. We are not a godless church. We are a creedless church. We don't have to believe alike to love alike. We are all trying to find our path, but we do it together. We use a variety of religious texts.

I wasn't talking about the Tiller shooting. I was talking about the one in Knoxville. I know it might have passed under your radar because it cast your people in a bad light. Since I am a UU, it hit home with me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knoxville_Unitarian_Universalist_church_shooting

The Tiller situation is separate. Sometimes I wonder if Tiller was murdered because his name rhymed with "Baby Killer". When you demonize someone with a name like that, it makes it easier to do horrible things to that person, like murder them.

From what I have read of your post, you are looking for a scapegoat. The republicans can do no wrong, when they are caught doing wrong, it is somehow the fault of the democrats. This demonizing ACORN is seriously lame. I doubt you don't know anything about ACORN that hasn't been told to you by some Right Winger who is trying to make them look bad, truth be damned.

You did say one thing I agree with-

There are a lot of nutballs on the face of the earth.

You went on to mention some attrocities commited by Muslims. I don't think any one group, denomination or even religion has a monopoly on "nutballs". Even though I consider myself a Christian, I am the first to say Christians can be terrorist too. Extremist of any stripe can become terrorist. I think fundamentalism is fundamentalism is fundamentalism. When you let ideology override common sense, things can get dangerous. What is the difference between a islamic suicide bomber and a christian abortion clinic bomber? One. The abortion clinic bomber doesn't usually die in the bombing.

[babyfett]

[redneck diaper boy]

Republicans can do wrong. George Bush gave in to a 385 billion dollar stimulus. It was the wrong thing to do. Bush had the chance to close the Mexican border. He didn't. Bush did not communicate well. Bush also got the government involved with a Medicare prescription drug program. It was the wrong thing to do. Bush was too liberal.

No matter what anyone thinks of Bush, Obama is the worst president in my lifetime. I lived through Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton and baby Bush. No other President has apoligized for and bashed America. Now that piece of shit has put the CIA on trial in New York.

It is obvious that Obama's intent is to degrade and demean America. For that I say "Fuck You Obama"!

I don't consider an abortion clinic bomber to be a terrorist. An abortion clinic bomber is a life saver. I realize that Abortion is legal. I also state that the Supreme Court has made mistakes. The Supreme Court at one time allowed human trafficing and slavery. Killing Jews in Nazi Germany was legal but it wasn't right. Killing Nazis was illegal in Germany, in 1939 but it was the right thing to do.

Which one of our founding fathers was a UU? I am curious. From what I can read, the UU chruch was founded in 1961.

I am a peaceful person and I am trying not to lose my cool. Honestly about 8 years ago I sounded just like you, but on the other side.

I am a proud Unitarian Universalist. Some of the forefathers of our nation were Unitarians.

I don't believe that any one group, denomination or even religion has a monopoly on truth. We are not a godless church. We are a creedless church. We don't have to believe alike to love alike. We are all trying to find our path, but we do it together. We use a variety of religious texts.

I wasn't talking about the Tiller shooting. I was talking about the one in Knoxville. I know it might have passed under your radar because it cast your people in a bad light. Since I am a UU, it hit home with me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knoxville_Unitarian_Universalist_church_shooting

The Tiller situation is separate. Sometimes I wonder if Tiller was murdered because his name rhymed with "Baby Killer". When you demonize someone with a name like that, it makes it easier to do horrible things to that person, like murder them.

From what I have read of your post, you are looking for a scapegoat. The republicans can do no wrong, when they are caught doing wrong, it is somehow the fault of the democrats. This demonizing ACORN is seriously lame. I doubt you don't know anything about ACORN that hasn't been told to you by some Right Winger who is trying to make them look bad, truth be damned.

You did say one thing I agree with-

There are a lot of nutballs on the face of the earth.

You went on to mention some attrocities commited by Muslims. I don't think any one group, denomination or even religion has a monopoly on "nutballs". Even though I consider myself a Christian, I am the first to say Christians can be terrorist too. Extremist of any stripe can become terrorist. I think fundamentalism is fundamentalism is fundamentalism. When you let ideology override common sense, things can get dangerous. What is the difference between a islamic suicide bomber and a christian abortion clinic bomber? One. The abortion clinic bomber doesn't usually die in the bombing.

[redneck diaper boy]

I was in the House gallery and saw this nutball in operation. The sign is a lie. Read HR 3400

[DL88]

With out any sort of comment on my belief in this whole thread, I just have to comment on how stupidly hilarious it is that just because posters disagree with Redneck's ideology, they are actually hitting the "-" button on this stupid little popularity meters. To make it even better, they are giving each other positive numbers.

Despite the B.S. on this site (DD) about equality, it is a left leaning website that shows it's true colors constantly and consistantly by the actions and views of same people/regular members who can really be named in a list due to their posting frequency where they continually agree with themselves and each other.

People like Redneck and I just have to accept this because any of the posts we make, on this site or the majority of the internet regarding our views, are instantly skewered across a flame of intolerance and disdain toward us and our views.

I digress, find a hobby or learn to debate with out using popularity as a contest.

[loopy]

Despite the B.S. on this site (DD) about equality, it is a left leaning website that shows it's true colors constantly and consistantly by the actions and views of same people/regular members who can really be named in a list due to their posting frequency where they continually agree with themselves and each other.

Its only left leaning because well the "right" don't seem to like sexual fetishes, in other people at least. This site has a whole spectrum of people of different sexualities, different genders, different races, and different religions. To not completely hate this side of our selves and others we have to be a little on the liberal side.

And I only +1 people who I agree with... that's what its for no?

And as for the "learn to debate" It's hard to debate when neither side will change its view point.

[diamondback6881]

soooo if you dont want the government tell us waht to do, well then i guess abortion should be made legal.. otherwise.. ohhh look out theres teh government telling us what to do!

I'm confused by this statement, as abortion is already legal though it can be restricted by the states to varying degrees.

You know, they got big guns over there

Yes, I do.

[sarah_ab]

yes abortion to some degree or another is legal, however many people want it to be illegal, what i'm saying is, if you want abortion to be illegal, you cannot also want the government to stay out of your life and not tell you what to do. By making abortion illegal you are taking away a person's right to chose, meaning you are telling them they must do something. I know it is legal to varying degrees, but some states are making it legal only if the mothers life is at stake or the fetus is the product of rape or incest.

course if you want the government to stay out of your life, then i guess there should be no laws, i mean it should be ok for a person to rob you or kill you or beat you up without any consequences, because if there were consequences, then that would be a result of a government imposing law in your life.

[DL88]

Its only left leaning because well the "right" don't seem to like sexual fetishes, in other people at least. This site has a whole spectrum of people of different sexualities, different genders, different races, and different religions. To not completely hate this side of our selves and others we have to be a little on the liberal side.

So if I go by what you are saying, you must have a left leaning ideology to accept all spectrum of people and if you don't, you hate it and have a right leaning ideology.

My point and case was made when I had a "-2" rating on my post when I came back here to check up the forums for updates.

The main and most actual reason there is a less right leaning in general on the internet is because the majority of right leaning ideologues don't spend an over abundance of time on the internet in general; however, I do find it interesting that the people claiming to be "more tolerant" as you did/do (but not actually you specifically), are actually the ones who carry great intolerance for people who don't believe that in which you believe yourself. If we really wanted to look at the statistics of these forums (DD), we would consider all of the elements in this list and then some I might have forgotton:

1. Posting frequency of all active members.

2. Country of origin of all active members.

3. Personal views of all active members.

4. Overall statistics of forums activity since launch.

5. Behavior of new members from forums launch until 2008, and new members from 2008 until recent.

6. Overall statistics of daily life activity of all active members seperated into multiple catagories.

7. Statistics of active members becoming inactive in progression from launch until recent.

I think you would find things from this would arise such as new members, now, are coming from Europe instead of U.S. and that you have a group of regular members, almost all with a certain ideology, coveting these forums as their own "playground" so-to-speak. You would also, undoubtedly and disputedly, find that new thread integrity has declined as well as the overall board activity and integrity; but, everything, including entire civilizations, have times of prosperity and decline.

Lastly Loopy, as much as I hate to use it (the rating system), I will admit to using it only to equal out the numbers people have only on certain threads as it is just stupid to begin with and I feel some people abuse the system. The only time I have actually used it seriously was to negatively rate what I would consider spammers.

Those of you who know me know how I am about sources (i.e. .org .edu .gov sites), however, I thought maybe this would peak your interest just a little bit: http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.cfm?ID=1642

P.S. Sarah, I consider you smart, but what happened to a thing called a grey area? There are more colors on the greyscale spectrum than black and white.

[loopy]

I didn't mean that the right hates all people... it just seems they're more intolerant from what I've read on here, the left can be just the same (as you mentioned).

As much as I hate political labels I consider my self liberal in outlook, I believe people should be free to live their lives no matter what lifestyle choice that is (as long as it doesn't effect anyone else badly). I believe that the government is there not to rule but to ensure that the majority of people have the best life possible with out taking too much from those who already have a good life. I also believe that health care is a fundamental right that everyone should expect. I believe everyone should have their say, that way if your argument is a good one it can be considered. If its complete bull pap then it can be dismissed intelligently.

Like when the BNP (a radical right leaning fascist party) was allowed to go on Question time (a bbc political program where the public get to ask questions to MP's) A lot hated that decision, I supported it, Let the BNP speak, let them show the country just how vile they are. Sadly it turned into a witch hunt against the guy, and made everyone else look bad due to the amount of hate (he still said some pretty bad things through).

But on a forum, if you come on and start a post like this one then you can only expect one reaction really. And that's a flame war. I don't like the way redneck diaper boy has written his arguments, he just sounds like a reactionary, banging on about communist agenda's etc, just so much bile and hatred for one man/ party which the majority of his fellow country men voted in. No reasonable argument, no consideration of the facts just GOD DAMN COMMIE BASTARDS COMING HERE TAKING OUR MONEYS!

From my viewpoint, as someone from the UK, all I see of the American Right is these shouty posts on forums, where so called republicans dismiss all arguments by shouting louder. Just the same as I see on Fox news, with Bill O'reilly and Glenn Beck. No real laying down the facts, just shouting and using shock tactics too get their way.

Bleh, that was a bit of a major rant considering you gave it one sentence I just wanted to outline my position on this bit through.

I'm not sure if you include me in the playground mentality bit, am I part of this group? I've not done anything to try and get in with it if that's so. I'm not a fan the way certain people demand proof on stories and seem hell bent on driving others away. The other side of it, there's quite a few people who I enjoy chatting to regularly and they don't seem to have much to say on this subject. I think the ideology bits only come out in certain threads like this, but you can't blame people for that. Politics on the internet is never a good recipe, it always turns into a slagging match.

As for the rating system, I like it to some extent, people who have serious negativity have it for a reason, mainly because they're spammers/trolls etc. I don't like the way people seem to neg or +1 all posts by someone because of what they said in one post. I rate based on the post, not on the person. The fact that you had a -1 on this latest post even through nothing truly bad was said in it, and the fact that its well written and not just reactionary, shows that people are rating with out reading. I believe that you should only be able to rate posts upto 12 hours after they're posted.... that would stop alot of this reactive rating. Then again, is it that important to bother with?

Thanks for replying intelligently with a well reasoned post, I hope this can match it

Loopy

ps: link don't work :X