BrownBobby

Invites are going out again now - it's the downside of having a private link and having a busy work schedule. Alright - I think I'm caught up on who most recently requested. If anyone has any issues, please reach out - I'll try my best to resolve them as quickly as I can.

I'd love to find the original thread for this in whatever 4chan derivative it ended up happening in. I have some questions for our author here about his "testing." So...yes, this could theoretically work, with a huge, massive pile of caveats. I do not recommend anybody actually do this method. But let's talk about what I think is going on here. You have two muscles to "defeat" for incontience - the autonomic bladder neck/internal sphincter, and the consciously controlled external sphincter. Finding a medication to target the bladder neck is trivial - honestly, I recommend most people just stick with Tamsulosin/Flomax if they're looking for something. Easy to get generically, minimal list of side effects, and decades of use for this purpose, so it's widely understood by the medical community. However, Tamsulosin and similar meds won't make you incontient. It just makes it a little easier to pee. From my research, there was no medication that could reliably disable the external sphincter. This makes sense when you think about it - what medication could you take that would relax/disable *only* that muscle and not others like your arms or legs that have similar biological makeup? The one suggested here is interesting, but I'm skeptical how much it's actually doing here - I suspect the required doses to be effective would have significant side effects. This leads to my conclusion - I suspect these drugs are mostly placebo in helping people who were already diaper training to finally relax and let go. Placebo doesn't mean worthless - I've found there is a necessary part of training where someone feels like they can surrender their need to control themselves. But if there was a possibility to run a larger study under medical supervision...I'd definitely be interested in seeing the results.

Alright - getting to sending out invites now. Thank you for people's patience here - it's appreciated.

I've sent you a message - I help run a Telegram group for this. We don't publish a public link to keep a flood of nay-sayers and spam accounts from joining. Feel free to respond to my message and I'll send you a link.

This can happen, as I'm sure the doctor mentioned - a revision might be necessary, especially if the original procedure didn't heal in the fully open position (by dumb luck or a catheter issue). My first procedure didn't take either - I suspect partially because my catheter had to be removed early due to recurring blockages. I think this is a fair thing to highlight with this surgery as well - it by far isn't a guarantee it will work, especially the first time. It comes with a whole list of risks that any major surgical procedure does, but especially one that involves the urinary tract. You're basically inflicting a lifetime of trauma on those muscles artificially, and hoping it's enough to make them incompetent at holding anything anymore. I'm comfortable where I ended up - maybe not a full time dribbler, but confident I couldn't go any length of time without a diaper unless I wanted to risk very embarrassing accidents. To anyone reading this and considering surgery - I'd recommend trying out other things first - full-time diaper usage, hypnosis, catheters, etc. - if only because it helps in the event the surgery doesn't take. Knowing how to cath myself has made things much easier, and having used hypnosis to help accept these life changes has been very reassuring and validating. Here's hoping it is just swelling, @Reddy - but if it isn't, there's still plenty of options, including Round 2.

I personally have found it invaluable to do so - a diaper makes a lot easier, even if it's not draining into it. Heck, even makes recovering from surgery easier. The nurses in my stricture removal were impressed I had planned to wear a "brief" out - they're used to having to talk people into it over whatever "mesh underwear with pads" would count as.

Oh, yes. The first time (stateside, only removing part of the external sphincter) my catheter blocked up twice. The first time needed an ER visit to fix. The second time, the doctor just told me to remove the catheter early since it was so close to when it was supposed to come out anyway. The next time (in Mexico, like @Reddy), it threatened it a few times but never got there. I did start retaining urine, but was able to eventually get the clots to pass with time. Still scary when it happens - especially when you swear it must mean you still can hold it just fine. You know, until you can't. The most recent time (local doctor, literally right now, to fix the stricture that developed), the catheter started blocking before I could even be discharged from the hospital. They fixed it, but it'd keep blocking up for the next two days. At this point, I'm rather skilled in flushing and clearing catheters, so I've been keeping things operational. Still not fun, though. I haven't had to wear caths for additional length any of the times, but there's a reason I keep a stock of indwelling and Foley caths on hand - makes it much easier in case it's needed. I've only really needed it a handful of times for getting the stricture to play nicely. Since starting treatment locally for it, I haven't needed to intervene on my own. After finishing this last surgery, I will have to cath weekly just to make sure the stricture stays stretched out - the side effect of making sure those bladder muscles get used to being stretched is just a nice bonus.

So...yes, they make this, but you have to be careful. The tissues making that 26fr hard to insert can be stretched, but tearing them can lead to problems including strictures (and from my experience, 0/10 do not recommend strictures). Best for now to slowly work up to it - get a 22fr and 24fr in comfortably for a few days at a time, then see if a 26fr goes in without pain.

Problems after surgery that I've also seen in both my surgeries happening in the US? Wow, imagine that! (I don't have to - I've been to the local ER for the same issue for much, much less involved procedures. It's an easily predictable and treatable complication. But that isn't NEARLY as snarky, is it?) It's *almost* like those were known issues that Reddy mentioned he was aware of. You know, almost like a competent adult individual making a decision while knowing the very real risks involved! Imagine that! I'm so glad @Reddy has been willing to share so much - it's *exactly* reactions like this that led to me not bothering to mention what i was doing to others when I had my procedure. I'm beyond amazed most peoples' reactions have fallen somewhere between "concerned yet curious" to "supportive yet intrigued." This procedure is a serious matter. It has VERY real risks. I've said the entire time (well, I did until multiple threads were deleted because of "helpful" comments like this) that this is something most people probably shouldn't pursue. And I'd love nothing more than to have a fully above-board option for this. In the meanwhile, we work with the options we have - and I'm glad to hear @Reddy's doing alright. It's never fun to see complications, even expected and predictable ones. But for anyone reading this and thinking about doing it themselves - this is part of the package deal. It's not like the stories. It's a serious procedure, with serious risks. And yet, I do believe there are several people out there who would still benefit from it.

No, I don't constantly dribble. Part of that was developing a stricture, but part of it is just as someone said earlier in the thread - there's so many things that affect your ability to hold it. All a surgery like this does is get rid of a lot of the consciously-controlled ones. Case in point, if I have to mess, I'll start holding urine, just because the pelvic floor is trying to hold things in. But...the moment I do anything to relax my pelvic floor, it comes out. Messing, laughing, even getting distracted for too long...and, as a fun benefit, it's become very uncomfortable to hold back from messing for any length of time. I do rather enjoy that as an unintended side effect - I *can* control when I mess, as long as I'm willing to pay the price...:-p

Rmemeber...having the ability to do something with those muscles, and having that "something" be something of value is two very, very different things. In my case, I can squeeze and try to hold it...and if I'm really lucky and do it before i start peeing, I might buy three to five seconds before it all comes out anyway. If it's mid-stream? No point in trying - it's just going to make a mess of things.

This is a common side effect of the antibiotic you're taking, combined with the (hopefully) extra fluids and earlier fasting. In short, don't worry too much about it.

Simple answer on why you don't get "everything": bleeding. You need to make sure what you did cut can fully heal without causing blood loss, strictures, or worse. Three weeks is enough time for the first round to heal well enough to make a second procedure safe.

Gods I wish. For what it's worth, the price does seem to be steadily ticking down operation over operation, but that's fair from a guaranteed trend.

If you genuinely want the answers to the questions, I'm willing to assume good faith and give them - but again, I'm noticing you actually haven't addressed any of the points about this being self-harm despite extensive medical and professional evaluation... I try to be as open about this as I can. I've mentioned it several times on this forum. Many of those mentions are deleted because some person comes into the thread meaning to "preach to the lost" and convince everyone that they're hurting themselves and/or somehow mocking those who didn't choose to be incontient. They usually refuse to take any suggestions that, perhaps, what they're saying isn't actually contributing to the conversation and get a mod involved. The result is deletion of anything remotely related to it. I'm amazed these threads have stayed up so far. It's partially why I stay away from many of them - why post my story again if someone is going to come in, decide that they're going to be the hero saving people from themselves, and get it deleted? (And before you jump to the conclusion, no, it's not because of some argumentative tone I've taken - most of the time, it's the person coming into the thread to try to "save people" that ends up flying off the handle and ironically giving the mods a reason to delete it.) This is partially why your stance is aggravating. You're right to be concerned that there is danger here. Again, it's not whether or not you say it. It's how much, how insistently, and how inflexibly you hold to it. My analogy above isn't as hyperbolic as you think. For many in this forum, and especially those who are so deeply into this subject that international surgery is even a consideration, they've already tried a laundry list of other methods. They've done years of research into the effects and what might result. In fact, our person getting the surgery is one of them, from my talks with him. Your warnings are like telling a professional race car driver to make sure to slow down for the turns, and when he still takes them quickly, saying it's "still self harm that he'd even consider going that quickly around it" because of how dangerous it is. Which is why I get aggravated about this topic. I don't need validation about my decision. I'm beyond happy with it. My biggest regret, by far, is that I hadn't had it done sooner. I can't imagine how much better my own life would have been had I had this opportunity earlier. I would have avoided so much (actual instead of perceived) self-harm if I could have had this outlet. Heck, even knowing the outlet existed would have been incredibly helpful to my mental health. In causing incontience, I am an expert. I've guided over a dozen people to various levels of potty untraining, from weakened bladders to full on diaper dependency. I've done more looking through scientific literature on this topic than anyone I've met (though I suspect there are others just as submerged into it as I, for the same reasons). There's a reason I stay mostly in this forum - it's the one most aligned to my interests. There's also a reason I usually end up being one of the argumentative ones when one of those "nay-sayers" cross over from helpful to unhelpful to irritating - this matters to me, deeply. And if I have learned one thing through ten years of pursuing this goal actively...I'm far, far FAR from alone in having a deep-seated, ingrained desire to be incontinent that I can't deal with any way but to actually *be* incontinent, as the years of addressing it has shown. I haven't been hiding. I've been speaking where I can. Then someone like you comes in, insistently nay-says until the thread gets nuked, walks away satisfied that they were definitely the good guy, and usually comes back to the next thread to do it again. Ironically, it's your concern that keeps you from having the chance to know, and it's far from just me that's this way. From my research, there may be more than a dozen people out there who have gotten similar operations from other doctors. They're almost impossible to actually talk to, because the moment they start speaking, someone swoops in and makes sure the conversation gets shut down because of "concern for people's safety" or "sensitivity to those who didn't have a choice." They've learned to shut up, keep their heads down, and don't bother bringing it up because best case, they'll have to explain it to someone woefully equipped mentally to understand, or worst case, they'll be beaten down by those "just making sure they don't self-harm again." Perhaps now you might see why your stance is met with frustration in this forum?