Sweden has a diaper issue in schools.

[babykeiff]

8 hours ago, ValentinesStuff said:

@babykeiff Yes there are plenty of people out there that abuse the system. There are plenty of people out there that are in actual need of help too.

I know, but it is the abusers that we need to stop. It is said that the laws in a country are not wrote to rule the country but more of to set limits on those people who feel that they are above the law / decent social behaviour.

8 hours ago, ValentinesStuff said:

...

Perhaps if I had been diagnosed as a kid I would now have better in person social skills. As it is there are situations that I just don't know how to correctly deal with. It certainly isn't my parents fault, I deal well with people I know. I don't with new people.

...

Don't knock yourself, or allow others to do that based on what you percieve as social inperfections. I am more willing to do that for you if you wish. 🤪 In reality, it is your history and experience that gives you the strenght you have today, and without that, you would not be you - so thank all that try to knock you.. as what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

8 hours ago, ValentinesStuff said:

...

The idea of "standing on your own two feet" is great, except for those that need a cane, or crutches, or a walker, or a wheelchair. Some people need help, some parents need help, to be honest at some point everyone needs help.

...

'Standing on ones own feet' I was using metaphorically as being able to answer for our own actions - at least to ourselves. Yes, we all need the help of another, and the most difficult part in that is accepting that we need help and actually asking for same. However, as earlier mentioned, some abuse that goodwil for self greed. I mentioned country laws and its enforcement - in my opinion, it should be a lot stricter - where it is black/white with no grey area. Every baby is naughty as they learn where the bounderies are. As an adult that doesn't act in the best interest of others, the line should exist with actual consequences that a baby can understand.

8 hours ago, ValentinesStuff said:

...

It's funny you mention nut allergies. One of my nephews is allergic to nuts, and various other things. He's deathly allergic to peanuts. He's been rushed to the ER several times because of contact with them, and nearly died. In kindergarten or first grade his class was assigned to draw a poster of what they feared/hated. The center of his poster, was a hypodermic needle, 18" long and about 6" wide. His parents had to give some context to the teacher.

...

Due to pure maths, and that an allergy to nuts (or more like the oil within the nut) exists, and that the world is populated by 8 billion odd, it is possible that there is a person or two that is allergic to all known substances that exist. We can either 'wrap the world in cotton wool' (metaphor) OR learn tolerance and accept that everyone in the world is unique. The person that is allergic to 'x' is the only person that really should know and take relevant precautions rather than relying on the world to protect them. Your nephew, in his art work, is fully aware of his allergy, and, although the art work is different to the norm and could be shocking to those who don't know, it is how this child percieves a hypodermic needle - as his god / plushie / something that he needs to take care of himself.

Don't publize this as someone will start the Church of the Hypodermic Needle  🤪

8 hours ago, ValentinesStuff said:

...

So yes there are plenty of people out there that need help. There are also some that abuse it. Is it better to provide help to those that don't truly need it or to deny help to those that do?

That is a difficult question to answer - deny all so to not assist the system abusers, OR help all including the system abusers. There is a compomise - but to some it might seem extreme, when a system abuser is caught, put them in the same situation as a deserving person - i.e. for someone that parks in a wheelchair reserved zone, lock them in a wheelchair etc... but human rights organisations would complain. As a compromise, a more rigid enforcement of laws (even the little ones) should be enforced where if people break what would be a 'insensitivity law' there is an associated restriction of rights employed on the offender.

[ValentinesStuff]

I agree with stopping the abusers. The question is the difference between the last two. Where is the last abuser and the first that needs help?

 

I don't knock myself out over, it's just something I know I have to deal with. Like my procrastinating, which I am going to stop doing. Tomorrow.

 

I know it was a metaphor, but one easy to stretch in the context of the discussion. Alas I think I've given up on black and white, everything is a shade of grey.

 

That poster is a long time ago, and he is now married with a little one of his own.

 

Oddly enough in my 40 years of driving I have only seen the Police hassle one person for parking in a handicap spot, and that was me. My placard was run and the officer went on his way.

[spark]

19 hours ago, Kawaharu said:

I believe in the next decade and my prediction here is that potty training age will get edged up to the point where it becomes an option and those who want to stay in diapers becomes the norm in society. I would not be surprised and shock in this world where their comes a day where potty training becomes an option for people and diapering becomes the norm an accepted in society. On top of that I would not be shocked or surprised if their ever comes a day where being diapered is completely normalized and accepted in society. I can see that in the coming decade where diapers are normal and accepted.

That's an interesting observation.  AFAIK, K-2 students have always had accidents, but rarely to the level that you would consider putting them in a diaper.   20 years ago, it wasn't uncommon to put a change of clothes in a child's backpack, just in case they had an accident at school.   I don't remember it happening when I was younger, but I wasn't observant enough to notice.  I believe it's far more likely that those students would wear Pull-ups now, and most Kindergarten teachers have at least one student wearing a Pull-up or diaper to class.

There has always been this belief that a child can't start Kindergarten if they aren't fully potty trained unless they have a disability.   This has never been true, at least in the United States.   Private Schools can disqualify a student, but a public school can not.   If the child is over 6 years old and lives within the district boundaries, the school district is obligated to educate the student.

 

18 hours ago, ValentinesStuff said:

I agree with stopping the abusers. The question is the difference between the last two. Where is the last abuser and the first that needs help?

We are venturing into territory that none of us are qualified to talk with any authority.    I'm directly involved in the education and assessment of students with mild disabilities, and I don't feel qualified to determine who is abusing the system.

 However, the qualifying disability is not randomly selected.  There are criteria that must be met to qualify a student.   100% of the students I've had who qualify as autistic-like display traits that are on the spectrum.  Some of those students are mostly self-sufficient and require minimal support to function on campus.  Others require a lot of support.   However, I frequently have students who have other qualifications but do display traits that are on the spectrum.   In my experience, the true % of students on the spectrum is underrepresented.

[Kawaharu]

20 minutes ago, spark said:

That's an interesting observation.  AFAIK, K-2 students have always had accidents, but rarely to the level that you would consider putting them in a diaper.   20 years ago, it wasn't uncommon to put a change of clothes in a child's backpack, just in case they had an accident at school.   I don't remember it happening when I was younger, but I wasn't observant enough to notice.  I believe it's far more likely that those students would wear Pull-ups now, and most Kindergarten teachers have at least one student wearing a Pull-up or diaper to class.

There has always been this belief that a child can't start Kindergarten if they aren't fully potty trained unless they have a disability.   This has never been true, at least in the United States.   Private Schools can disqualify a student, but a public school can not.   If the child is over 6 years old and lives within the district boundaries, the school district is obligated to educate the student.

That's because look at the trend where kids are being homeschooled more or sending them out to private school or charter schools. On top of that, look at where society these days are willing to accept things such as starting potty training later or even making potty training an option and not a requirement. Even now, some parents are making potty training an option and only when the kid feels they are ready to be potty trained. It's why I predict in the coming decade, your gona see society be okay with kids starting potty training late or not potty trained at all and kept in diapers. You might see a trend where kids are wearing pull ups more than underwear. Coupled with society being okay with kids being kept in diapers into adulthood. Then you have the trend where diapers are slowly starting to be accepted in society and society is slowly becoming more open, tolerant an accepting of those who have to wear diapers. It's why I am not shocked if the coming decade where we see a tend where diapers are normalized in the world. On top of all that you had the COVID pandemic that made wearing adult diapers normal and acceptable because people are afraid of how unclean public bathrooms are. And if you look at the advances in diapers, I see them becoming a norm in society as well.

I'll make this prediction, I predict in the coming decade, you'll see more and more parents make potty training an option instead of a requirement. You'll see more and more parents either starting potty training late or keeping the kids in diapers until either the kid feels they are ready for potty training or decides to stay in diapers until they feel they are ready. At the same time, I see in the coming decade, adult diaper use in teens, adults and elderly rising, which will lead to more diaper acceptance in society as well. Which is why I would not be surprise in the next 5, 10, 15 or 20 years down the road, where you see a society that is accepting of kids, teens, adults and elderly folks who are wearing diapers. In the coming decade, I would not be shocked or surprise if you see diapers as normal as wearing underwear or shorts in society. 

I just think that the trend of society accepting diapers is slowly getting their and I would not be shocked by the end of the 21st century that diapers are accepted and normal in society. We are not their yet but we are slowly getting their.

[spark]

1 hour ago, Kawaharu said:

I'll make this prediction, I predict in the coming decade, you'll see more and more parents make potty training an option instead of a requirement. You'll see more and more parents either starting potty training late or keeping the kids in diapers until either the kid feels they are ready for potty training or decides to stay in diapers until they feel they are ready. At the same time, I see in the coming decade, adult diaper use in teens, adults and elderly rising, which will lead to more diaper acceptance in society as well. Which is why I would not be surprise in the next 5, 10, 15 or 20 years down the road, where you see a society that is accepting of kids, teens, adults and elderly folks who are wearing diapers. In the coming decade, I would not be shocked or surprise if you see diapers as normal as wearing underwear or shorts in society. 

I'll use my story as an example to compare generations.  I was raised well before Pull-ups, and just as Pampers were becoming popular.  In fact, I think I wore cloth diapers but was wearing Pampers before I was potty trained.   As I recall, I wasn't potty trained until I was four, and nearly five when I was finally reliably dry.   We moved to Asia just before my fifth birthday, which was in September.  I didn't wear a diaper on the flight to flight to Asia, and I don't remember any specific accidents during that time.  Neither day nor night.  It might have happened, but I don't remember.

I believe I was in a diaper when I traveled with just my mom in the previous December (4 yr 3mos).  I have memories of being diapered that March (4 1/2) when I got sick, which is the last time I think I was ever put in a diaper by my parents.  I also know that I didn't start Kindergarten until I was six because I was barely potty trained by my fifth birthday.  I was also relatively immature for my age, and even with the extra year, I was behind my grade-level peers until I was in high school.   I also remember pooping my pants when I was five and thinking that it had been a long time since I had an accident.   At the time, my mom's reaction to my accident was minimal, and it never happened again.

FTR- that was extremely late for a child back in the early 70's.  There is far less social pressure to use the toilet, and I might be the kid who is still in diapers on his 5th birthday had I grown up today.   I also could have easily been the kid wearing Pull-ups to Kindergarten.   Especially, because I was already prone to regression back then, and remember wishing my mom would make me wear a diaper when I was six, seven, and even eight.  

 

[Kawaharu]

1 hour ago, spark said:

I'll use my story as an example to compare generations.  I was raised well before Pull-ups, and just as Pampers were becoming popular.  In fact, I think I wore cloth diapers but was wearing Pampers before I was potty trained.   As I recall, I wasn't potty trained until I was four, and nearly five when I was finally reliably dry.   We moved to Asia just before my fifth birthday, which was in September.  I didn't wear a diaper on the flight to flight to Asia, and I don't remember any specific accidents during that time.  Neither day nor night.  It might have happened, but I don't remember.

I believe I was in a diaper when I traveled with just my mom in the previous December (4 yr 3mos).  I have memories of being diapered that March (4 1/2) when I got sick, which is the last time I think I was ever put in a diaper by my parents.  I also know that I didn't start Kindergarten until I was six because I was barely potty trained by my fifth birthday.  I was also relatively immature for my age, and even with the extra year, I was behind my grade-level peers until I was in high school.   I also remember pooping my pants when I was five and thinking that it had been a long time since I had an accident.   At the time, my mom's reaction to my accident was minimal, and it never happened again.

FTR- that was extremely late for a child back in the early 70's.  There is far less social pressure to use the toilet, and I might be the kid who is still in diapers on his 5th birthday had I grown up today.   I also could have easily been the kid wearing Pull-ups to Kindergarten.   Especially, because I was already prone to regression back then, and remember wishing my mom would make me wear a diaper when I was six, seven, and even eight.  

 

I just think now, their's less social pressure to toilet train kids and I do think that today, their's more acceptance of kids being in diapers. That's why now, some kids are going to school in pull ups and even in diapers. Parents are even delaying potty training to around age 4 or 5 years old. It's why now, your seeing a rise of more kids going to school in pull ups or even diapers. I would not be surprise if they are going into Middle school or even High school in diapers or pull ups as well.

I just think that society today is slowly accepting that some kids do need to be in diapers through out their school years and even into their adult years. I think society is slowly on a trend of accepting that adult diapers are normal in this world. It's why now, your slowly seeing the progression of diaper acceptance in society and people needing them. Which leads to where kids are delaying potty training or it becomes an option and kids are kept in diapers until they are ready.

I just think that kids that are delaying potty training is a sign that diapers are becoming normal and the social pressure to potty training is less than ever before. It could mean that people are growing accustomed to diapers and those who need them. The other, is that it could mean that social pressure to potty train is not that steep and that people are okay with those being in diapers.

I just wonder how much social pressure is it these days to potty train kids, knowing that technology for diapers have come a long way and you have diapers that can last up to 12 hours. On top of that I wonder if the weakening of social pressure to potty train is the direct result of diapers being more accepted, tolerated and open in society. I wonder cause we are seeing a rise of kids, teens, adults, elderly and especially those in the disabled community being more mainstream in society. It maybe why diaper's are becoming more accepted in this world and leading to less pressure on potty training.

[babykeiff]

2 hours ago, Kawaharu said:

That's because look at the trend where kids are being homeschooled more or sending them out to private school or charter schools. On top of that, look at where society these days are willing to accept things such as starting potty training later or even making potty training an option and not a requirement. Even now, some parents are making potty training an option and only when the kid feels they are ready to be potty trained. It's why I predict in the coming decade, your gona see society be okay with kids starting potty training late or not potty trained at all and kept in diapers. You might see a trend where kids are wearing pull ups more than underwear. Coupled with society being okay with kids being kept in diapers into adulthood. Then you have the trend where diapers are slowly starting to be accepted in society and society is slowly becoming more open, tolerant an accepting of those who have to wear diapers. It's why I am not shocked if the coming decade where we see a tend where diapers are normalized in the world. On top of all that you had the COVID pandemic that made wearing adult diapers normal and acceptable because people are afraid of how unclean public bathrooms are. And if you look at the advances in diapers, I see them becoming a norm in society as well.

I'll make this prediction, I predict in the coming decade, you'll see more and more parents make potty training an option instead of a requirement. You'll see more and more parents either starting potty training late or keeping the kids in diapers until either the kid feels they are ready for potty training or decides to stay in diapers until they feel they are ready. At the same time, I see in the coming decade, adult diaper use in teens, adults and elderly rising, which will lead to more diaper acceptance in society as well. Which is why I would not be surprise in the next 5, 10, 15 or 20 years down the road, where you see a society that is accepting of kids, teens, adults and elderly folks who are wearing diapers. In the coming decade, I would not be shocked or surprise if you see diapers as normal as wearing underwear or shorts in society. 

I just think that the trend of society accepting diapers is slowly getting their and I would not be shocked by the end of the 21st century that diapers are accepted and normal in society. We are not their yet but we are slowly getting their.

This trend started years ago indirectly by the actions of people like Marion Donavan and King Gillette. Prior to these peoples actions, the world percieved the resourses in the world as valuable, not disposable. Even in Marion Donavan's time, she found it impossible to convince companies to make disposable items such as diapers etc., and the reason was that at that time, the world attitude was that resources are valuable. It is all based then on the concept of repair and make do, the concept of survival, and it aphored people to waste anything.

King Gillette, for self greed, decided to create a product for single use and to be disposed afterwards. Once he became successful, the seed was set where other businesses, out of pure greed, followed suit.

When we come to the diaper industry, the change from the proliferic use of cloth to disposable - driven by Mills from Protector & Gamble with the invention of a diaper that didn't need to be washed and that contained its own plastic pants, being sold as being more convenient and better for a baby, both lies, but it created a secondary problem/solution that parents / careers didn't know of, or even want. Because a parent is no longer washing and drying soiled diapers, the drive to get their shitty pisssy brat out of diapers became dimminished. After all, the baby was comfortable, and although they were changing the babys diaper, the foul concept of dealing with diapers became mute. As a result, the nasty job of raising a child was shifted from washing the diapers to changing the diaper.

This was also worked on, and improved (if you believe advertising) by the addition of diposable baby wipes, more absorbant diapers and the new 'dry feel' liners plus 'baby shape' diapers. This effects both parties involved, the parent/career and the baby. The baby in super absorbant diapers does not get the feedback that they are wet/messy and the parent spends less time changing diapers. - which from a top down perspective seems to be better for both parties. However, this created a number of issues.

• The parent has more time, which they use to increase the amount of money they earn
• Disposable diapers can be changed by most idiots - so that is farmed out to third parties.
• Toilet training is no longer driven by the parent that washes / changes diapers - the concept is put that a baby will toilet train on their own - which is a lie.

Add to this, diaper companies increasing the size range of their diapers (to cover larger and larger babies) plus the increased lack of time the parent has due to being constantly working, this adds to the growing problem that toilet training is being delayed to an older and older child (2/3/4) plus being rushed (at age 5) where it used to be a requirement that a child starting school be potty trained.

This late / rushed potty training left children with some daytime control, but little to none over-night. Here comes the diaper companies to the rescue. They created 'pull ups' for bed wetters. Actually, all they did is produce a larger diaper for the 5+ year old market. This increased in size to include up to 12-14 year olds who happened to wet overnight. In a motion of some responsibility, P&G plus others created the 'wet feel' training pants, but very quickly removed it from the market after they realised that these 'wet feel' training pants was actally working to toilet train children - which conversly affected P&G diaper sales. Instead, to increase diaper sales, the 'pull-up' diaper was introduced. This teaches the baby/child that it is OK to wet/mess in underwear as there is really no difference (other than a pull-up is designed to be absorbant) between the pull-ups with underwear designs and actual underwear.

This come to today where a baby, from birth is placed in a disposable ultra absorbent and comfortable cloth feel diaper that by the age that the baby is old enough to stand, is placed in pull-up diapers. As a result, there is absolutely no feedback that they are wet/messy. The diapers are so thin and quiet, it is difficult for even the most observant to tell that the baby / child is wearing a diaper. These diapers go all the way up in sizes to fit a 14 year old child - so the child has no reason to learn to potty train. The parent working all the time will always see this child as their baby - and percieve everything that their baby does is cute.

In schools, it is now acceptable that some children are not potty trained - as it is percieved as abuse / discimination / unfair to the childs welfare to single out a child that wears a diaper. Many excuses are made by others to allow this behaviour to continue - the rights of the child, the child is 'differently abled', the child has 'adhd' or someother label. It's never that the childs parent is too lazy to have trained the child - it is always that the child needs to be protected - and babied. After all, the parent knows what the best treatment for their child, the same child that the parent was high on drugs to deliver the child, and has farmed out to every daycare / creche for the past five years of the childs life, and in the past (5x365x24hr) of the childs life, with the child sleeping for (average 10-12 hours overnight x 356x5) and the child spending 8 plus hours per day in the care of someone else, the actual parental interaction with the child is approx. 2 hours per day (30 mins in the morning, and approx 1 hour in the evening). This leaves the actual parental interaction with the child is only 14 hours per week. How can a parent with this interaction actually know their own child. The people that know the child is the daaycare / creche workers - the actual people who are raising the child.

What this all means is that year by year, more and more children are reaching school age still needing diapers, some children up to the age of 14/15, and this trend will continue. This also includes those children who, due to rushed / delayed toilet training, at times of stress wet during the day and also, overnight, wear some form of bedwetting protection.

This trend continues into adulthood where adults wear some form of diaper (it is called by advertisers a protection pad / discrete underwear etc) as a protection since their bladder control is less than perfect. In my humble opinion, these people have never been sucessfully toilet trained and a destined to end up in diapers again, and with the increasing number of people not being properly trained and the growing acceptance of diaper users, it won't be long before actual toilet training is no longer required.

Consider that infantile clothing is available in adult sizes, as are diapers etc., plus the proliferication of advertising showing adullts wetting oneself while in a public environment - I mention the add were two middle aged women in a fitness class state that while they are excersing one is 'letting it all go' etc plus diapers designed to enhance the female look and curves while being absorbant enough to last the whole night (of wetting) while at a concert etc as being normal behaviour, as well as the advert that supposed to show an adult pad that works better than a tampoon for holding wetness - this is attempting to convince middle aged adults that wearing and wetting diapers is normal and acceptable and better for you!

This type of advertising you will recal from the first adverts re 'disposable diapers from P&G driven by Mills that the disposable diaper is 'better' than cloth - and a good parent that puts the welfare of their child first would not use soggy disposable washable diapers, but use the new disposable diaper! I recal one of the first P&G diaper advert where they compare two babies, one in cloth (crying cause of the wetness) and the second child in the original pin on disposable diaper (supposedly happier) banging on a piano, with the catch line, 'before pampers, he couldn't play a note' and 'keeps babies drier and happier' because of the 'one way liner'. These concepts were accepted by parents despite them being aware of and using diaper liners on cloth diapers, but chose the disposable since they presumed that P&G etc is not lying to them.

This concept of people foolishly accepting what adverts say as truth is also the reason we are in such as ruined world, or disposable world. If we think before acting / beliving this, most of what we use today we wouldn't. So what is the price of convenience?

[Kawaharu]

16 hours ago, babykeiff said:

This trend started years ago indirectly by the actions of people like Marion Donavan and King Gillette. Prior to these peoples actions, the world percieved the resourses in the world as valuable, not disposable. Even in Marion Donavan's time, she found it impossible to convince companies to make disposable items such as diapers etc., and the reason was that at that time, the world attitude was that resources are valuable. It is all based then on the concept of repair and make do, the concept of survival, and it aphored people to waste anything.

King Gillette, for self greed, decided to create a product for single use and to be disposed afterwards. Once he became successful, the seed was set where other businesses, out of pure greed, followed suit.

When we come to the diaper industry, the change from the proliferic use of cloth to disposable - driven by Mills from Protector & Gamble with the invention of a diaper that didn't need to be washed and that contained its own plastic pants, being sold as being more convenient and better for a baby, both lies, but it created a secondary problem/solution that parents / careers didn't know of, or even want. Because a parent is no longer washing and drying soiled diapers, the drive to get their shitty pisssy brat out of diapers became dimminished. After all, the baby was comfortable, and although they were changing the babys diaper, the foul concept of dealing with diapers became mute. As a result, the nasty job of raising a child was shifted from washing the diapers to changing the diaper.

This was also worked on, and improved (if you believe advertising) by the addition of diposable baby wipes, more absorbant diapers and the new 'dry feel' liners plus 'baby shape' diapers. This effects both parties involved, the parent/career and the baby. The baby in super absorbant diapers does not get the feedback that they are wet/messy and the parent spends less time changing diapers. - which from a top down perspective seems to be better for both parties. However, this created a number of issues.

• The parent has more time, which they use to increase the amount of money they earn
• Disposable diapers can be changed by most idiots - so that is farmed out to third parties.
• Toilet training is no longer driven by the parent that washes / changes diapers - the concept is put that a baby will toilet train on their own - which is a lie.

Add to this, diaper companies increasing the size range of their diapers (to cover larger and larger babies) plus the increased lack of time the parent has due to being constantly working, this adds to the growing problem that toilet training is being delayed to an older and older child (2/3/4) plus being rushed (at age 5) where it used to be a requirement that a child starting school be potty trained.

This late / rushed potty training left children with some daytime control, but little to none over-night. Here comes the diaper companies to the rescue. They created 'pull ups' for bed wetters. Actually, all they did is produce a larger diaper for the 5+ year old market. This increased in size to include up to 12-14 year olds who happened to wet overnight. In a motion of some responsibility, P&G plus others created the 'wet feel' training pants, but very quickly removed it from the market after they realised that these 'wet feel' training pants was actally working to toilet train children - which conversly affected P&G diaper sales. Instead, to increase diaper sales, the 'pull-up' diaper was introduced. This teaches the baby/child that it is OK to wet/mess in underwear as there is really no difference (other than a pull-up is designed to be absorbant) between the pull-ups with underwear designs and actual underwear.

This come to today where a baby, from birth is placed in a disposable ultra absorbent and comfortable cloth feel diaper that by the age that the baby is old enough to stand, is placed in pull-up diapers. As a result, there is absolutely no feedback that they are wet/messy. The diapers are so thin and quiet, it is difficult for even the most observant to tell that the baby / child is wearing a diaper. These diapers go all the way up in sizes to fit a 14 year old child - so the child has no reason to learn to potty train. The parent working all the time will always see this child as their baby - and percieve everything that their baby does is cute.

In schools, it is now acceptable that some children are not potty trained - as it is percieved as abuse / discimination / unfair to the childs welfare to single out a child that wears a diaper. Many excuses are made by others to allow this behaviour to continue - the rights of the child, the child is 'differently abled', the child has 'adhd' or someother label. It's never that the childs parent is too lazy to have trained the child - it is always that the child needs to be protected - and babied. After all, the parent knows what the best treatment for their child, the same child that the parent was high on drugs to deliver the child, and has farmed out to every daycare / creche for the past five years of the childs life, and in the past (5x365x24hr) of the childs life, with the child sleeping for (average 10-12 hours overnight x 356x5) and the child spending 8 plus hours per day in the care of someone else, the actual parental interaction with the child is approx. 2 hours per day (30 mins in the morning, and approx 1 hour in the evening). This leaves the actual parental interaction with the child is only 14 hours per week. How can a parent with this interaction actually know their own child. The people that know the child is the daaycare / creche workers - the actual people who are raising the child.

What this all means is that year by year, more and more children are reaching school age still needing diapers, some children up to the age of 14/15, and this trend will continue. This also includes those children who, due to rushed / delayed toilet training, at times of stress wet during the day and also, overnight, wear some form of bedwetting protection.

This trend continues into adulthood where adults wear some form of diaper (it is called by advertisers a protection pad / discrete underwear etc) as a protection since their bladder control is less than perfect. In my humble opinion, these people have never been sucessfully toilet trained and a destined to end up in diapers again, and with the increasing number of people not being properly trained and the growing acceptance of diaper users, it won't be long before actual toilet training is no longer required.

Consider that infantile clothing is available in adult sizes, as are diapers etc., plus the proliferication of advertising showing adullts wetting oneself while in a public environment - I mention the add were two middle aged women in a fitness class state that while they are excersing one is 'letting it all go' etc plus diapers designed to enhance the female look and curves while being absorbant enough to last the whole night (of wetting) while at a concert etc as being normal behaviour, as well as the advert that supposed to show an adult pad that works better than a tampoon for holding wetness - this is attempting to convince middle aged adults that wearing and wetting diapers is normal and acceptable and better for you!

This type of advertising you will recal from the first adverts re 'disposable diapers from P&G driven by Mills that the disposable diaper is 'better' than cloth - and a good parent that puts the welfare of their child first would not use soggy disposable washable diapers, but use the new disposable diaper! I recal one of the first P&G diaper advert where they compare two babies, one in cloth (crying cause of the wetness) and the second child in the original pin on disposable diaper (supposedly happier) banging on a piano, with the catch line, 'before pampers, he couldn't play a note' and 'keeps babies drier and happier' because of the 'one way liner'. These concepts were accepted by parents despite them being aware of and using diaper liners on cloth diapers, but chose the disposable since they presumed that P&G etc is not lying to them.

This concept of people foolishly accepting what adverts say as truth is also the reason we are in such as ruined world, or disposable world. If we think before acting / beliving this, most of what we use today we wouldn't. So what is the price of convenience?

That means in a not too distant future, we can see potty training being an option and no longer a requirement. At the same time, I would not be surprise in a not too distant future where diapering becomes the norm in society.

[Little Cub Pants]

1 hour ago, Kawaharu said:

That means in a not too distant future, we can see potty training being an option and no longer a requirement. At the same time, I would not be surprise in a not too distant future where diapering becomes the norm in society.

Wow! Do you really think so?!😮😯

[Kawaharu]

6 minutes ago, Widdle Webslinger said:

Wow! Do you really think so?!😮😯

Yes and look at where society is going these days and look at the trends where diapers are being accepted and normalized. Combine that with parents delaying potty training and kids being kept in diapers or pull-ups up until age 15. I would not be shocked or even surprise that in the next 10 to 20 years where we see the normalization of kids being diapered and potty training being the option and not a requirement. Heck, I would not even be shocked if you see the day where high school kids are going to school diapered. I think the trend in the very near future is that you'll see parents making potty training an option and making diapers normal for kids. It why I would not be shocked or surprise if you hear a 14 or 15 yr old that is still in diapers. I just think that diapers are slowly being accepted in society because society has become tolerant and accepting of things and the shame is less and less these days. Just look at the trends where parents are delaying potty training and you'll see where we are going at down the road.

[babykeiff]

2 hours ago, Kawaharu said:

That means in a not too distant future, we can see potty training being an option and no longer a requirement. At the same time, I would not be surprise in a not too distant future where diapering becomes the norm in society.

 

1 hour ago, Widdle Webslinger said:

Wow! Do you really think so?!😮😯

Yes, from one perspective, it is possible that the world will go down that path of full diaper dependance - but one also has to consider the effects of the self righteous groups.

This world will always contain the groups of people who's mouths are bigger than their intelligence. I am not directly knocking the people who represent 'Greenpeace' and/or the people who prefer to be 'vegan' etc., or the people who claim to be 'green' or the 'religious groups'. It is not that they are fundementaly incorrect, but a certain number of their ideas are beyond stupid. There is a group of people who support the concept of complete diaper dependance. These type of groups have an impact on public perception which causes change to same - this is where media, due to sensationalism and mis-information, indirectly support these groups.

It is highly likely that although a high proportion of people will not be trained, there will be objection groups on both sides that both support and condeme this type of behaviour.

As a result, no one can predict when this will occur, but the way the trend is of older and older children still diaper dependant (day and/or night) plus the growing level of the perception of stress and diaper usage as being an acceptable methods of dealing with same which means the youth to middle aged still wearing some form of protection, plus the already accepted method of deaing with elderly by placing them in diapers (see China as an example as there, the sales of adult diapers excede by a factor of 10 baby sized diapers)

In a way, this trend is already here. All it will take to make it fully acceptable is for an offspring of some one famous to 'choose' diapers so it becomes fasionable. The item that stops this becoming worldwide behaviour is the people who a public idiots - i.e. the one who broke into a daycare / creche for self satisfaction and others who appear in the news for all the wrong reasons.

It is a trend that IS happening, which probably be supported by 'green' concept (it is better to use a diaper than flush human waste into the sea etc or some other silly idea) and knocked by religious groups out of some misperception that it is against some belief, but I think that it is already here. From a factual event, there are more adult (age 4+ and upwards) sized diapers made in the world today than (age 4 and smaller) baby diapers and that market is growing. Companies don't make a product that they can't / don't sell.

Only time will tell.

[Kawaharu]

8 hours ago, babykeiff said:

As a result, no one can predict when this will occur, but the way the trend is of older and older children still diaper dependant (day and/or night) plus the growing level of the perception of stress and diaper usage as being an acceptable methods of dealing with same which means the youth to middle aged still wearing some form of protection, plus the already accepted method of deaing with elderly by placing them in diapers (see China as an example as there, the sales of adult diapers excede by a factor of 10 baby sized diapers)

I think in a way we are headed towards that era where you'll see kids who are still diaper dependent way into their teen, adult and elderly years. It's just that we're on a cusp where diapers are slowly becoming accepted in society. In my case, I am seeing a trend where people are accepting those who have to wear diapers.

8 hours ago, babykeiff said:

In a way, this trend is already here. All it will take to make it fully acceptable is for an offspring of some one famous to 'choose' diapers so it becomes fasionable. The item that stops this becoming worldwide behaviour is the people who a public idiots - i.e. the one who broke into a daycare / creche for self satisfaction and others who appear in the news for all the wrong reasons.

Look at Taylor Swift fans for example. They started wearing diapers going to her concerts and at the same time, NorthShore is capitalizing on the trend as well. It wouldn't take much if a A-list celebrity came out and said they wear diapers. 

8 hours ago, babykeiff said:

It is a trend that IS happening, which probably be supported by 'green' concept (it is better to use a diaper than flush human waste into the sea etc or some other silly idea) and knocked by religious groups out of some misperception that it is against some belief, but I think that it is already here. From a factual event, there are more adult (age 4+ and upwards) sized diapers made in the world today than (age 4 and smaller) baby diapers and that market is growing. Companies don't make a product that they can't / don't sell.

The trend is happing and we're seeing the signs point to where being diapered is acceptable in society. I just think that we're close to a point where being diapered is as normal as wearing underwear.

[BabyJoseph]

On 9/4/2023 at 3:02 PM, Babyqtboy said:

Multiple reasons, in the 70’s and 80’s there were more stay at home moms (who had the time to potty train), cloth diapers were still accounting for the majority of diaper choices for parents which required more work, and disposable diapers though extremely thick and comfortable (speaking from experience), were not capable of the absorption of 21st century diapers, (which honestly started getting to the current capacity in the early 90’s), which meant wet diapers and messy diapers felt uncomfortable. Diapers now are designed to feel dry even after several hours and multiple wettings which eliminates the association of being wet and being uncomfortable, so kids now take longer to realize that they are wet and uncomfortable. I also believe believe that the amount of screen time has turned toddlers into zombies, they are too distracted to notice they are peeing and because the diapers are so affective, by the time they recognize that they are wet, it’s been multiple wettings, which also sets back potty training. Autism is on the rise too, when I was a teenager in the early nineties, autism affected 1-456 kids, when my son was born in 1999, it was 1-156, and when I started working in developmental psychology in 2010, it was 1-92, and now it’s 1-56. This is due to a combination of things, diagnosis criteria has been changed, parents are screening their children sooner, and it’s not a stigma like ot was before. In the 70’s and 80’s when I was growing up, kids were forced to assimilate, by any means possible, (shame and corporal punishment most often), but now we have a softer approach to child rearing. My youngest is autistic (moderate to severe rating) and wasn’t potty trained until age 9, the number of times my parents and grandparents said it was because he was lazy, or we as parents were lazy was unbelievable. My mother actually suggested punishing him to get him to potty train 🙄 needless to say she was never allowed to be alone with my kids 😂😂

my parents was that type with me. Force me to be trained and spank for accidents. That how I became a diaper lover