ABDL vs Incontinence

[littleJaina]

On 6/28/2019 at 4:56 PM, jonbearab said:

Hi all, long time lurker here. I was browsing the Incontinence - Medical subforum today and I got to thinking...

But first, some disclosure: I've been a DL ever since I can remember, but not officially until I was in my teens. I am also now untraining my bladder for UI. I've had incontinence desires for many years, and until recently, have only been speculating on doing it. Until now.

I've been thinking about the various aspects of being ABDL vs being incontinent. Here in the Incontinent-Desires subforum, you see time and time again when someone posts here about wanting to become incontinent, or how to become incontinent, etc., there are a ton of naysayers warning the poster about the consequences of being incontinent. (And with all due respect, it gets old, but that's another topic for another day.) However, today I've been trying to connect some dots and was wondering what you all had to say about it.

This post might get a little long, so bear with me...

Why is it when an incontinent (non-ABDL) person finds the ABDL community and becomes ABDL themselves, for one reason or another, that ABDLs tend to respond (very) favorably by welcoming that person into the club? This seems obvious, right? No one questions this transition and every ABDL that I know of will always respond favorably to this. Because, who doesn't want to share this wonderful community and lifestyle with everyone else?

Now a reciprocal question: Why is it when an ABDL (non-incontinent) person finds the incontinent community and becomes (or tries, or desires, or wishes, or fantasizes to be) incontinent themselves, for one reason or another, that incontinents tend to respond (very) poorly by trying to dissuade that person from joining the club?

Why does it appear to be a one-way street? Arguably, there's more stigma attached to being ABDL than there is to being incontinent. The ABDL community is often used by incontinents as a support group and sometimes (but not always) incontinents become ABDL themselves. Among other reasons, the ABDL members who wish to be incontinent are looking for the same support that ABDLs provide for the incontinent community, but rarely get it. If an incontinent person becomes ABDL themselves, it's often used as a coping mechanism for something they can't control in their lives. From what I read, this is a good thing for that incontinent person and generally makes their mental health about their situation better. Why can't it be the same in reverse? Why is there a stigma within our own community for ABDLs who wish to become incontinent for one reason or another? Shouldn't incontinent people be more reciprocal about letting an ABDL into their community? If not, why not?

Why is there a difference between want and need? Doesn't it occur to people that some ABDLs need to be incontinent (whether or not you agree with that statement) for the betterment of their own mental health? Sure, an incontinent person generally can't change their situation and from their experience, incontinence is a burden, but surely incontinent people can realize that being ABDL is also a burden, but in a different way? Both ABDLs and incontinents need acceptance and understanding. How many ABDLs stop being ABDL because the burden is too high? (To my knowledge, none! One can't not be ABDL once they are ABDL...)

In a way, this can be boiled down to ableism. Or disableism, if you will. Because one has a physical medical necessity to wear diapers, one has the right, so to speak, to feel justified for being placed into that camp against their will. As a life-long ABDL myself, I never had the choice to become ABDL. It just happened that way. ABDLs physically need to wear diapers just as much as incontinents do, but for different reasons. Why do those different reasons matter when it comes down to it? Why does the question of permanence seem to divide our two camps? (I.e., incontinents generally have to wear 24/7 but ABDLs don't have to.)

To be fair, my statements are just generalizations, but I think they are fair generalizations. Maybe there are some ABDLs out there that don't want incontinent people joining the club? And there are definitely some incontinents out there who are okay with ABDLs joining their ranks. But that's where it seems to end.

Why aren't ABDLs naysaying the incontinent people from becoming an ABDL, when it clearly is a far more secretive thing to be ABDL in our society? Society already accepts that some people need to wear diapers for medical reasons, but society has yet to make that leap for ABDLs. Not only are we stigmatized by society, but we stigmatize ourselves. Why is it not okay to become incontinent in order to have that final justification that will equalize the playing field for the both of us? I mean, c'mon, we're all playing the same game here, why not just finally accept the situation both ways and be done with it?

Put another way: Why is it okay for incontinents to become ABDL (a switch from a socially acceptable situation to socially unacceptable behavior) but not for ABDLs to become incontinent (a switch from socially unaccepted behavior to a socially acceptable situation)?

I guess I'm having a hard time understanding why this one-way street situation exists. Wouldn't it be better if we can both support each other both ways?

I could keep going, but I think I'll leave it at that. I hope this becomes a useful discussion. Thanks!

Jon

I think your confusion lies in your definition of "community".  People who are incontinent aren't a community they don't have a group identity or culture.  It is not the same as something like being deaf.  So there is not exactly a cohesive nature to it. 

People with incontinence experience a lack of control, against their will.  The very act of attempting it makes you different.  Even if you manage to achieve genuine loss of control, it was still your decision and completely different than the experience of someone who has no choice.  Can you imagine what someone who is paraplegic would think of another person cut their legs off on purpose?  Do you really think they would feel that person was in the same boat as themselves? Cutting your legs off is different than just rolling around in a wheel chair because it's fun. 

The AB/DL community is different.  People can choose to belong or not.  (This isn't the same as saying you get to choose the urges your body has, but you choose whether or not to join to community.). An incontinent person choosing to join is just doing the exact same thing as anyone else chooses to join the community.  They don't have to come.  Plenty of incontinent people don't.  But some do choose to embrace it because they see it as a way of taking back some control over a situation they did not choose, by enjoying it.  

[littleJaina]

On 7/2/2019 at 6:32 PM, DAQ said:

That's the point though. Some AB/DLs find incontinence as a fetish or casual desire that might be cool once in awhile. Others like myself feel trans-abled. I don't feel right using the bathroom. I have wanted to wear and use diapers as long as I can remember. 

I think that people who are incontinent that want to dissuade the average diaper user from ever seeking incontinence is full disclosure and letting adults make up their minds. If a story about messing on a 6 hour flight or leaking during a wedding or some other hypothetical horror story won't make someone turn back I think it is good odds that they are going into it with open eyes and deserve support opposed to chastising.

I don't see them as chastised as much as just not considered incontinent in the same way.  Asking someone without legs to actively support someone sense chopping then off is asking too much.  

No one is telling them they can't do it their just refusing to help.  There's a difference. 

[DiaperedAllTheTime]

19 hours ago, dlnoir said:

And in all honesty we can learn from each other for we diaper lovers have a tendency to push diapers to its limits.

I post a lot in incontinence forums to share my padded experience and to answer a lot of questions particularly for those that are newly incontinent.  Which diaper do I wear?  How do I travel wearing diapers?  How do I wear diapers discreetly to work?  We all have are own diaper style so to speak but most of us on here who have worn diapers for a lifetime are diaper experts and that experience and knowledge is great to share with someone who all of the sudden had to start wearing diapers for a medical reason.

I have never looked in my medical file but I assume it says I am urinary incontinent.  My doctor knows I wear diapers and she only asked me if I wanted to try medicine once.  In her eyes it is about quality of life and since wearing diapers makes me happy there is nothing more to talk about.

Interestingly enough my desire for diapers all started over having week bowels which I still have to this day.  For me having a degree of bowel incontinence as a child and being humiliated for that actually made me want to be in diapers.

[Alex Bridges]

To answer the OP’s question, people don’t like being fetishized or their misfortune being fetishized. And ABDLs who join incontinence forums often behave badly, asking prurient questions and making it obvious they aren’t there to be part of that online community but to find and solicit fap material.

That being said, I think the ABDL community can teach incontinent people and their caregivers more about diapers than they can learn through sources targeted toward them, as evidenced by how often one sees Depends listed as a reputable brand.

[DAQ]

1 hour ago, Author_Alex said:

That being said, I think the ABDL community can teach incontinent people and their caregivers more about diapers than they can learn through sources targeted toward them, as evidenced by how often one sees Depends listed as a reputable brand.

I think you are seeing that shift as reputable incontinence supply companies stocking AB/DL diapers. With maybe the exception of the Megamax I would say AB/DL diapers outclass medical grade ones.

[Alex Bridges]

7 minutes ago, DAQ said:

I think you are seeing that shift as reputable incontinence supply companies stocking AB/DL diapers. With maybe the exception of the Megamax I would say AB/DL diapers outclass medical grade ones.

I disagree on that as it seems to me all the AB diaper companies are producing only thick, 8-12 hour diapers that use plastic and are designed with a lot of pulp for thickness. I like those sometimes, but for a balance of absorbency, discretion, and comfort (the things incontinent people care about) I think the best diaper out there is Abena. And most incontinent people don’t want to wear a used diaper for as long as ABDLs do.

I just wish Abena would make a diaper without the wetness indicator and in some colors just so it doesn’t look like a medical diaper. 

Or alternatively, the AB companies could make their diapers more like Abena in terms of less pulp, more SAP, and a softer, more breathable cloth backing.

[stevewet]

On 7/1/2019 at 3:07 PM, DaveeBEd said:

I feel truly sorry for those who are incontinent by the results of an illness or injury. That must be very hard to deal with. However, I have an overwhelming desire  to become incontinent and to then suffer the consequences. I do hope that my desire in no way diminishes my respect or support for those who would do anything to not be IC.

For me the incontinene came first but soon I beame DL as a result of having to wear nappies. Now I thoroughly enjoy being dependant on nappies. I have no Idea why I just do,

[Inconito]

It is a strange discussion.

I compare the situation with this analogy.

"You cannot have what I have, because I didn't want to have it, and so shouldn't you. Because I want to decide for you."

Well, get off your high horse. You have my sympathy, that's it. But you will not in any way be able to deny me, what I want. And I want to be incontinent, like you.

You were either born with this, or got it later in life though whatever. I also got it in later life though whatever. Only difference is, I don't dislike wetting myself, like you do.

However if we join together I can help you, just as you can help me. for instance, By increasing the market demand for better diapers, or providing valuable advises like Mark does. Why the fuss?