Objectivism

[peelover]

Ayn Rand's political philosophy of Objectivism, as shown in her many books, details how individualism is the only way to truly live free. To learn more Objectivism, read the book Atlas Shrugged, or watch part one of the movie which is out now. (Parts two and three come out this year and next year, respectively) Once you have watched the movie or read the book, you can take the John Galt pledge here. There is also more information on the bottom of that page about the Objectivist philosophy. Please post your opinions about Objectivism and spread the word.

[DailyDi]

'Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.'

[ForbiddenFruit]

There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged.

One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world.

The other, of course, involves orcs.

[peelover]

Can you be more specific as to why you don't like objectivism?

[babbler110]

It is, oh I don't know, selfish and self centered and something that seeks to tear down a society and create anarchy.

And please don't waste your breath responding to me, I have a family member that is a Ron Paul person and been thought this with them. The greatest achievements in the history of humankind have been done because people have worked together, through a governement, to accomplish great things.

- defeat of fascism

- man on the moon

- building a great system of free education

My happiness depends on a functioning governement that can ensure old folks don't live on the street and the sick are tended to and I like my niehbors have clean air to breath and clean water to drink.

[sarah_ab]

i have tried to read atlas shrugged numerous times.. and each time i just cannot do it... its just one of those books i simply cannot get through.. i can't get past the first 20-30 pages... its like i'm slowly tortured every time i try....

Oh well... i feel if i have given a book 6 or 7 tries in the past 10 years and still cannot do it... its just not for me....

[peelover]

If anyone on this site is for Ayn Rand and her philosophy of Objectivism, please say so.

[sarah_ab]

well from the first paragraph of the wikipedia page you linked to seems like its a pretty selfish philosophy really...

buuuuuttt i've no interest in other people telling me how i should live my life... so i didn't really read the whole thing in depth....

[Diapered Jason]

Peelover, you are probably only taking what you want from it. This is indicated by that movie you mentioned. For example, if you are religious, you are against the objectivism philosophy. Everything else is basically the modern day Republican platform, but like all things, they don't look deeply enough.

I think it is incorrect because Ayn Rand is making claims about human psychology that are not necessarily true. In fact, she has no scientific references, because the science was not that well developed at the time. Therefore, I provide a logic loop hole in her "objective" logic. Saying you are objective while pretending to know what everyone else is thinking is a common case in egoism. She strikes me as something similar to a scientist who believes so strongly in their work that they cannot admit they are wrong and forget why they became a scientist in the first place. Of course, I'll admit, that is my assumption.

What I do not understand most about her philosophy is why she says there is a distinction between rational selfishness and hedonism. How can you distinguish between that which promotes your life and that which you mindlessly believe will promote your life? In order to know beyond a theory, you must first know the conclusion of the choice. Therefore, it is a possibility people will make all the wrong choices leading to poor outcomes if the philosophy is adopted. This is one huge fundamental assumption made in the philosophy. You are assuming you are actually helping yourself by being selfish. Even if people do make the right choices for themselves, collectively, they can be making a bad choice as a whole, for example, a stock market crash.

I do not think too highly of her philosophies despite being for the most part an atheist and someone who believes in healthy narcissism. I still want to help people. In fact, helping people makes me feel, well, good. So perhaps being somewhat altruistic is in your best interests.

[ForbiddenFruit]

I do not think too highly of her philosophies despite being for the most part an atheist and someone who believes in healthy narcissism. I still want to help people. In fact, helping people makes me feel, well, good. So perhaps being somewhat altruistic is in your best interests.

That's the Objectivist Escape Hatch. "You didn't REALLY want to help them, you only did it because it made you feel good". This even applies to saving the lives of your children by means of jumping in front of a car. "You weren't REALLY acting for your children, just on your own selfish desire to have them live on." It's the Objectivist's Goddidit / Flooddidit / Satandidit / Falldidit.

[Diapered Jason]

That's the Objectivist Escape Hatch. "You didn't REALLY want to help them, you only did it because it made you feel good". This even applies to saving the lives of your children by means of jumping in front of a car. "You weren't REALLY acting for your children, just on your own selfish desire to have them live on." It's the Objectivist's Goddidit / Flooddidit / Satandidit / Falldidit.

Maybe, but they don't know that, you don't know that, and I don't know that. No one really knows until we have made the choice. Therefore, we don't know if being selfish or being altruistic is in your best interests or even in our best interests.

[ForbiddenFruit]

Guys, I can't believe it, yesterday, I handed in a student ID I found lying around into the Lost Property office, and then my parents came over and gave me two frozen meals and I...I...I accepted help from them...I'm so immoral...

[Diapered Android]

Ayn Rand is the the 'Mother Courage' of the 1%.... I think that sums it up nicely why Objectivism is terrible.