What Is It To Be Transgender?

[WallaWalla]

Bailey was smeared by the academic tranny cabal imo. His research was purely good intended from what I have read of it, and the basis on which he was disputed was purely political. James and Conway are intellectually corrupt and selfishly motivated. Not to mention they propagate the idea of 'true transsexuals' and various other sorts of nonsense which seek to rob people of their own identity. Frankly, I think the portrayal they offer of transsexualism is so politically correct and nonsensical that the falsehood is evident to the general population. The kind of screed put out by their sort is exactly what is holding transgender people back.

The way they have attacked Ann Lawrence and drug her through the mud for her admitting that she derives sexual pleasure from her own personal body image is particularly disgusting and ignorant of feminine sexuality.

Oh wait, this is why I stay out of conversations like this. Never mind any of what I just said.

[PrincessDragonette]

I would not believe anything by Blanchard, Bailey and Zucker as they are propagandists.

If you had read the rest of my post you would have seen that it was a rhetorical question. You dismissed Cohen-Kettinis's research, not because you saw a flaw in the research itself, but because you didn't like what it might mean. People spouting "propaganda" can be dismissed by showing the error in their work. If they are shown to consistently engage in unprofessional behavior (e.g., lying, falsifying studies) then you could eventually dismiss them based on reputation. But, that is not the case with Cohen-Kettinis, you stated:

Cohen Kettenis always tries to prove TS as mental illness/psychological disorder.

You dismissed the work based solely on the fact that she has an agenda. My response is: even if that is true (I don't know if it is), so what? If she continues to do her research in a professional manner and submit her co-authored publications to peer-reviewed journals then her agenda is irrelevant. (Just as a side note, showing that the origins of transsexuality aren't in the brain (which has NOT been done) does not mean that it is automatically a mental illness. There are still other possibilities.)

I don't know what any of the other things you mentioned have anything to do with this conversation, so I'm not going to answer them.

I do find it interesting that you ignored the first study I posted even though it wasn't headed by any of the researchers you dislike. It showed no significant difference in any area of the brain, except the putamen, between MtFs (prior HRT) and control males. This study was done using live tissue, as opposed to post-mortem.

Overall, our study provides evidence that MTF transsexuals possess regional gray matter volumes mostly consistent with control males. However, the putamen was found to be “feminized

[PrincessDragonette]

Bailey was smeared by the academic tranny cabal imo. His research was purely good intended from what I have read of it, and the basis on which he was disputed was purely political. James and Conway are intellectually corrupt and selfishly motivated. Not to mention they propagate the idea of 'true transsexuals' and various other sorts of nonsense which seek to rob people of their own identity. Frankly, I think the portrayal they offer of transsexualism is so politically correct and nonsensical that the falsehood is evident to the general population. The kind of screed put out by their sort is exactly what is holding transgender people back.

The way they have attacked Ann Lawrence and drug her through the mud for her admitting that she derives sexual pleasure from her own personal body image is particularly disgusting and ignorant of feminine sexuality.

Oh wait, this is why I stay out of conversations like this. Never mind any of what I just said.

Since you didn't say any of this, I won't say that I agree with it.

[KittenAB]

Okay, my 2 cents: Transgender is a very broad term, taking the word itself apart it applies to almost everyone who isn't perfectly in line with the binary gender system required for procreation of the species. But the binary gender system is outdated, we simply don't need it anymore and should not have such strict classifications. Considering, based on modern ideology of males, any male who wears pink would also fit as transgendered, since they are transgressing the gender roles, which is really utter bull. They've had to create new labels to keep up as they discover new gray areas, and this is bull to.

As for the whole "is it natural/okay" debate, you don't like your nose, you get a nose job. You don't like your breasts, you get those changed. You don't like wearing glasses/contacts, you get laser eye surgery. Same goes for your "bits" ... don't like them, change them, if that's unnatural or wrong then so is 99% of all plastic surgery.

[Saschadzg]

Bailey was smeared by the academic tranny cabal imo. His research was purely good intended from what I have read of it, and the basis on which he was disputed was purely political.

His expression homosexual transsexual for androphile mtf is self evident. This speaks for his contempt of transwomen as women.

Scientists have absolute NO right to define me. Doctors did what I demanded on the basis of human self determination. F64.0 and the backing WHO and APA are a bunch of jerks denying basic human rights and pathologizing a whole group.

Psychologists want to keep themselves in business in order to continue to write costly referal letters and other nonsense papers, selling their books, etc.

I would describe the relation of the T* community and doctors and scientists as the so called Stockholm syndrome.

[Saschadzg]

I'm done with this conversation now, I'm not interested in the trans rhetoric, I want science. I want to know why. That means keeping all possibilities open, and closing each door as they prove it isn't the right one. Even if the eventual answer isn't what I want to hear. Hopefully, it isn't the one that I don't want to hear .

As I do not have to justify myself any more for my decisions as a human beeing, I am tired of finding so called scientic explanations. As I have the basic right to choose my own sex/gender expression, it should not matter.

I do not need to cite any studies to justify my way.

My own ridiculous definition for TS is always hiding any clues, that anybody can discover that you are a man. A game, that noone can reach and only fail.

[curiositykilledthecat]

Not even sure how the hell I wound up in this thread but since I'm here, I'm going to post a link that may or may not help.

transgenderism

On a side note, I have no stake in this argument, regardless of science or facts people will do or believe what they want so why bother? We can't simply dismiss any counterpoint argument as propaganda. Based on what I know of Transgenderism all I can say is it is plausible. Do I blieve it's a birth defect, I don't know, however it is at least plausible.

[Total Trash]

After being told by one specialist (who was apparently quite respected in gender studies) when I first started thinking about transitioning that I couldn't be a "true transsexual" and still be attracted to women, I have to say that I'm a little biased against Blanchard-Bailey-Lawrence.

[Bettypooh]

After being told by one specialist (who was apparently quite respected in gender studies) when I first started thinking about transitioning that I couldn't be a "true transsexual" and still be attracted to women, I have to say that I'm a little biased against Blanchard-Bailey-Lawrence.

Their ignorance (or is it stupidity?) shows when they cannot understand that gender and sexual preference are NOT related in any way Makes you wonder which Cracker Jack box they got their degrees from

Bettypooh

[Pootattoo]

I've been watching this subject with some interest, I've always wondered if I was TG, But I'm just not sure what to consider myself....

I was born a male with gynecomastia (female like breasts) and have really skinny arms.

I could have easily passed as a female if I wanted to (when I was younger), but never had that desire.

I guess my brain is male, but my body is sorta half n' half.

As for sexuality, If I had to choose, I would go for females, but I really have no interest in either sex and prefer to be alone.

Any thoughts?

[KittenAB]

I've been watching this subject with some interest, I've always wondered if I was TG, But I'm just not sure what to consider myself....

I was born a male with gynecomastia (female like breasts) and have really skinny arms.

I could have easily passed as a female if I wanted to (when I was younger), but never had that desire.

I guess my brain is male, but my body is sorta half n' half.

As for sexuality, If I had to choose, I would go for females, but I really have no interest in either sex and prefer to be alone.

Any thoughts?

The scales of gender and identity as well as sexuality are so full of gray areas, there is no single label for anyone really. Just be yourself, live how you want, and don't worry about the labels. The only use the labels have are if you want to make certain changes, other than that, don't worry too much about it.

[Bettypooh]

The scales of gender and identity as well as sexuality are so full of gray areas, there is no single label for anyone really. Just be yourself, live how you want, and don't worry about the labels. The only use the labels have are if you want to make certain changes, other than that, don't worry too much about it.

I never thought I'd do it, but plus 1 This is almost exactly right My only gripe is that labels do have a use beyond this- they differentiate via language How one uses labels can be offensive so great care should be given to their usage Like any wording the understood definition can change with time, location, and setting- among other attributes. I use TG more than other more concise labels since it seems to garner the least offense from non-cisgendered persons, yet sometimes there's a need for more clarity Rare is the person who fits one label alone. In a discussion of this topic elsewhere one friend of mine who didn't like "TS" defined herself with three lines of text That's too cumbersome for most purposes That's the main reason the term "Transgender" came into it's current usage and meaning It covers the most with the least getting offended- yet some still get huffy when this term is applied to them If you don't label yourself, then someone is going to label you from their perspective

In the end, people are people whoever we are, we're all different, and that is how things are supposed to be You can play a role as someone else but you can't be them, you can only be you There's nothing wrong with that!

Bettypooh

[Luci Vaughn]

After being told by one specialist (who was apparently quite respected in gender studies) when I first started thinking about transitioning that I couldn't be a "true transsexual" and still be attracted to women, I have to say that I'm a little biased against Blanchard-Bailey-Lawrence.

Okay, so what if you're a trans woman who is into women, but is dating a woman who is also a trans woman, and you fantasize about having sex with your lover even though she has functioning male genitalia, but also fantasize about having sex with her with fully functioning female genitalia...

Oww...

Bugger it for a game of soldiers. I'm a trans woman who's gay. *shrugs* Let science or religion or society be damned.

~Luci

[LILJIM]

I wish I could do something to help but as usual all I can do is listen but that isn't much.

- I certainly will be thinking about you all.

That is more than you realize!!!! My Grandma (sometimes) just sit knit & listen (not a word maybe knod 1-2 times) But as she sat there & I talked the answer to my problem would POP into my head. I miss those talks alot now.