Classification Of Dl Vs Ab?

[Pipsqueak]

I think the terms Adult Baby and Diaper Lover are really only useful within the AB/DL community itself. It allows us to ascertain where on the spectrum someone else falls in terms of their likes and dislikes. Outside our own community the world will lump us together, regardless. No one besides us is really interested in the minutiae. You can almost compare it to something like a biologist. Someone might say to you "the new guy down the street is a biologist", but unless you're really fascinated by biology you're not going to go to the trouble to find out what sort of biologist, what he or she specializes in. Within the community of biologists that information would be very important, but to outsiders it's unlikely they'd be that interested.

My personal feeling is that we're all the same animal - we just fall in different locations along the spectrum. Even within the smaller sub-groups of DL's and AB's, people are different. Some, like me, start out as DL's and become AB's over time. Others never do. And there are definitely degrees of ABism. I think AB and DL are just simple broad terms to use as guidelines about where people's interests lie when chatting on a board like this.

[wsdler]

Pipsqueak, well put. This has always been my understanding of things.

[babybeowulf]

I've always thought of it as a spectrum as well. Where you fall on it, thats up to you!

[enfant]

I don't think there's any real distinction that matters, and the terms AB and DL have always bothered me for that reason.

I agree with superdiaperbaby and Pipsqueak. As far as anyone outside our tribe knows or cares, we're all the same, it's just a matter of degree. It's just how many babyish things to you like, and how often you play with them, and how much you get into the role.

Some of us who are on the less-extreme end of the spectrum get judgmental toward those of us who are on the more-extreme end, which leads to comments like the one above: "I know I wouldn't like it if I were confused with an AB." Listen, my friend, you might as well get used to it. People outside our community would probably find it hilarious that you even make the distinction. It would be like... what's a good analogy... like some guy at a science fiction convention, dressed up like Worf and speaking fluent Klingon, talking about how he hates it when people mistake him for one of those weirdos who really overdo it.

When someone goes to the trouble to identify himself as a DL but absolutely not! an AB--I'm thinking here of a guy a while back who wanted to start an online chat room that would be DL's only, no AB's allowed, because he just hated having to talk to us--it comes across to me as self-hating behavior. Like anti-semitic Jews, or so-called "straight-acting" gay men who put down other gay men for "acting gay". "I wear and use diapers for fun... but I'm not weird about it!" I always want to say, give me a break, dude, you like baby stuff, get over it.

[Pipsqueak]

When someone goes to the trouble to identify himself as a DL but absolutely not! an AB-- ... -- it comes across to me as self-hating behavior.

Exactly! Many years ago, before I became comfortable with being an AB, I made that same distinction. My first forays onto the internet for information about people like me, unearthed some pretty over-the-top examples of AB's that scared the crap out of me (figuratively speaking ) In my mind, I was nothing like them and I erected a clear dividing line between DL's and AB's. Now, I find that laughable. The only difference between me and what I saw as the over-the-top crowd is that I don't go quite as far into the baby role and I choose to keep my interests private. The only difference between me and a DL is that I like a few more "accessories" and enjoy the idea of being cuddled and cared for by another person, while in my baby mode. We all like diapers and let's face it ... everyone associates diapers with babies.

[wsdler]

Like anti-semitic Jews, or so-called "straight-acting" gay men who put down other gay men for "acting gay". "I wear and use diapers for fun... but I'm not weird about it!" I always want to say, give me a break, dude, you like baby stuff, get over it.

I think you might be perceiving hostility where there is none (I'm not saying you are rather, I'm asking you to ask yourself, is it possible that that might be the case? After all, it's VERY easy to misconstrue emotions and intent on the net... in the same spirit I may not completely understand what it is you're trying to say as well so there may be a misunderstanding on my part???). I personally have no interest in anything "babyish". I'd like to point out that ABs are often looking for "babyish" diapers, diapers with nursery prints, two tapes instead of 4 tapes, anything the further act out the fantasy of being an infant, etc. and that's a big difference from someone who wants to wear and use diapers. Although I do wear and use diapers I have absolutely no interest in anything that relates to age regression, role playing or babies (it's actually quite a turn off for me... topless woman in a diaper... hey, there's boobies, turn on... woman dressed up as a baby... for me it's actually a turn off, everybody is different). By you're logic would you also say that an incontinent person who decided to embrace diapers and make the best of a bad situation is also into baby stuff? I personally couldn't buy that argument. As pipsqueak mentioned I see it as merely a means us to communicate to each other what we're into.

I suppose DLs sometime go out of their way to say that they are DLs may be due to their experience with ABs. When I chat with other people on the net who are interested in diapers I'm interested in having adult conversations for the purpose of mutual support in having an interest that is considered taboo. I'm interested in sharing experiences about telling people and how they've reacted and comparing notes on certain diapers and where to buy. I've had ABs contact me even though my profile specifies I'm a DL and they talk like a baby. That's fine but when I say I'm happy to talk but I'm not interested in role playing and they persist it gets annoying. Not all ABs are like that, many ask if I want to role play and when I say no they respect those boundaries and I respect theirs. Anyhow, that's just a theory as to why some DLs may go out of their way to say they are not an AB.

I suspect another reason that many DLs may feel compelled to differentiate is the fear of being associated with pedophiles. We in the community know that ABs and DLs have no more interest in pedophilia than whatever is a normal cross section of "normal" people (and I use that term loosely). For clarification if you looked at the percentage of non ABs and DLs who were pedos and ABs and DLs who were pedos the percentage would be the same. The general public however is not aware of this and when one does a search for "diaper lover" one is overwhelmed with AB sites that show adults dressed in baby clothes with websites that have nursery themes. It's unlikely that most people unaware of the fetish would do any further research. They're going to assume pedophilia. In some cases these websites that show up in the searches give them good reason to believe that as well as some of them depict children and teens wearing diapers and baby clothes on a site with material that is sexual in nature. This is NOT ok and someone was actually banned from this website and wetset for just that reason if memory serves me correctly. I suspect that concern about the perception of others is also why DLs feel compelled to make the differentiation.

As has been mentioned though... the public is not going to make the distinction between AB and DL, etc. as television (Jerry Springer, and CSI come to mind) depict anyone into wearing diapers as ABs, and furthermore they depict ABs in a very unfair and completely inaccurate light.

[justindiapers]

When someone goes to the trouble to identify himself as a DL but absolutely not! an AB--I'm thinking here of a guy a while back who wanted to start an online chat room that would be DL's only, no AB's allowed, because he just hated having to talk to us--it comes across to me as self-hating behavior.

I disagree somewhat on that, as there are two really good reasons why a DL would want a separate chat room - baby talk and roleplaying. I don't have anything personal against it, and I understand why AB's like it, but it just annoys the crap out of me. I can't stand it in real life or AB life. Everytime I hear a parent talking like that to their child, I want to run out of the room screaming. It's like fingernails on a chalkboard. <_>

That said, I don't remember the specific person who you are talking about, and I definitely agree that there are a lot of DL's (and AB's) with too much self-hate over their diaper persuasions. Some of those people do draw wayyy too big of a line between themselves and the over-the-top AB's.

Also, while I agree that there isn't a clear line between the two, a pure DL does not necessarily have to associate their diapers with babies. A pure DL may or may not be simply a AB with fewer baby accessories. In my case, yes, I could be described as a AB with (much) fewer accessories - read Sea Otter's post, as that's a perfect description of my preferences. But as we all know, people of all ages wear diapers, so I would think it would quite possible for someone to develop a diaper fetish without associating the diapers with babies. A adult who wet the bed well into their teen years, for example, might be a plausible candidate for such a person...

[diaperwearntigger]

I think the reason why I have such a hard time with labels is because that a label does not specifically fit everyone. If you really wanted to start labeling people that covers every aspect of a person, the list would be greatly long and most likely still miss something or someone....

I consider myself an AB, however, I am not into the nursery print diapers, or looking for the most babyish diapers, or the baby clothes, nor do I mess in my diapers, nor do I eat babyfood or drink forumla... I love the blankies, the pacis, the bottles, the plushies, and of course the diapers, which i pick for thickness and comfort...The material items do not make me feel babyish... its how I am treated or spoken to... it the emotions and feelings that go much deeper than any material item could ever give me... There are many levels of being an AB, and it means different things to different people.

We forget that we are all in it for different reasons. (I apologize now if I have missed someone's likes)...Some wear because they have to, some wear for fun, some wear because they were punished, or a life long bedwetter, some like to wet and mess, some just like to wear, some just like to wet, some like the baby side of things, some find it to be a real sexual, some like a girl in diapers, some like a guy in diapers... Myself personally, do not get turned on by seeing a guy in a diaper.. My fiance/daddy wears, and thats great for him, but just cause hes wearing doesn't mean I want to jump him... however, if hes diapering me, and we are roleplaying, thats a whole other story.....

We tend to forget that we are here based specifically on one thing... Diapers. However you use the diapers, or however you don't shouldnt have any affect on anyone but yourself. We should be accepting of everyone, even if we don't agree with what they are into... is there lifestyle really affecting us personally?

To put a label on everyone and to put them into one specific category when there are so many differences and levels, is like saying everyone that has autism is specifically this way... which is totally not the case... people forget even with autism there are different levels.. but as soon as you hear, "Oh they have autism," you automatically think a certain way. Some people with autism are highly functional in society....(I'm sorry if some are offended with that comparision)

I'm ok being considered an AB, I claim to be an AB, even if I don't fit into every category that might describe an AB... just like I'm sure those who consider themselves to be DLs, don't necessarily fit into every category described as a DL... alot of people wear just for stress related reaasons... Like I said in my previous posts... We are adults, we should be able to say what we like and don't like...and if you are really interested in getting to know anyone, then you will take the time to carry on a conversation that goes further than... "are you an ab or a dl?"

As for those who PM/IM and ask if you want to roleplay and they continue and you get mad.. think about how us girls feel when we get PM/IM from those guys who won't take no for an answer... or get emails from guys that are looking for cyber sex... I think i take that more offensively than if someone wants to roleplay with me... you do have this great little function called, ignore....

I will end with this... we all here have a love for one thing... DIAPERS... and however you use them or don't use them should be irrelevant to decide which category you belong to, esp when those categories include such a wide variety of things that we all might not be into ....

Ok, i'll end with this... SCREW SOCIETY!!! Who cares how they see us... if we in the community can't be accepting with each other and the differences we have here, then how do expect society to accept us? And I personally don't need society to accept me, or to even understand what I am into, and they can portray the ABDL scene however they want to, because I know the truth and thats good enough for me.

[Topguy]

I came across this and it had some really bizarre assumptions.

Firstly.

I see three main classifications of people who wear diapers beyond the age of infancy.

Incontinents.

Regressionists.

Sexual fetishists.

They all have vast differences and reasons for wearing or using diapers.

Incontinents wear due to having no other choice.

Regressionists wear to regress to child like states.

Sexual feitshists wear to get erotic excitement.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Trying to lump all three together makes no sense whatsoever. I'm quite sure that your grannie who wears due to a weak bladder would be even more mortified to be called a "baby."

The sexual fetishist who wears to get sexual gratification probably isn't interested in having a Mommy or daddy.

And not being interested in being associated with the other two groups and thier prefferences is certainly not self hate.

I'd think it's more about self love, and a degree of satisfaction in being who they are, not what others would have them be. And in associating with people THEY like spending time with-rather than with those who annoy the piss out of them.

[tenderheart]

I see three main classifications of people who wear diapers beyond the age of infancy.

Incontinents.

Regressionists.

Sexual fetishists.

They all have vast differences and reasons for wearing or using diapers.

What if you wear diapers for a mix of the above reasons? I don't think it is quite as black and white as you are making it. But there is certainly many different motivations for wearing diapers.

[Guest]

Im disappointed that this has become an argument of semantics.In my opinion, and i may be wrong but, i believe that we are all Diaper Lovers. DLs in fact "love" diapers, and so do ABs.

So the way i see it is like, Squares and rectangles. i.e.: ALL SQUARES ARE RECTANGLES, BUT NOT ALL RECTANGLES ARE SQUARES.

Similarly, i would suggest that: ALL ADULT BABIES ARE DIAPER LOVERS, BUT NOT ALL DIAPER LOVERS ARE ADULT BABIES.

My opinion stresses mainly, that adult babies are a more specific sub-division of the greater diaper lover community. Is it a totally accurate classification? no, most likely it is not. However... Rarely can ANYTHING in real life be classified into a group accurately. Each person has infinite differences and variables which means that in order to classify human beings in a group, you have to simplify and generalize. It is also my personal opinion that classifying people is a social danger as it leads to jingoism, intolerance and, in some cases, hatred.

I say you should describe yourself as you would like. If you feel a tendency to want to call yourself a diaper lover, an adult baby, infantilist, or just as a person who enjoys wearing diapers, than it is entirely your decision. If we can not be open with each other about our own opinions of what it means to be a DL or an AB, then who can we be open with?

As for the versus thing, i think its a petty argument, and it goes without saying that the DEFINITION and DENOTATION of a word can often differ quite a lot from the connotation. Things can often have multiple meanings, and you would do well to view everything through multiple 'lenses' in order to see the big picture, imho.

Thats my 2-cents.

-kat

[Topguy]

I was simply making the point that some of us DO specialize in how we use diapers.

For myself, small children are extremely annoying. It's why I chose never to have any. And I certainly have no desire to behave like one. Diapers are just an erotic accesory for me. I probably will set up a diaper lovers group at some time in the future. I'd like to be able to dicuss the sexual aspects more expicitly-and DD cannot support that.

And with all of the pedo hunters out there, I can understand why. It's also why I will not be interested in involving any role playing ab's in the group-unfair as it sounds-it's them that get the fingers pointed at as potential pedophiles when the witch hunters start going through groups to cancel them. I don't like that any better than the rest of you-but feel no need to take on the guilt by association that it can potentially bring, and I am also not interested in the sort of people who join every diaper group out there, just to join.

But an ab willing to drop the baby stuff to talk about Diaper love? I'd have no problem with including.

You have to draw the line somewhere.

[Topguy]

Exactly! Many years ago, before I became comfortable with being an AB, I made that same distinction. My first forays onto the internet for information about people like me, unearthed some pretty over-the-top examples of AB's that scared the crap out of me (figuratively speaking ) In my mind, I was nothing like them and I erected a clear dividing line between DL's and AB's. Now, I find that laughable. The only difference between me and what I saw as the over-the-top crowd is that I don't go quite as far into the baby role and I choose to keep my interests private. The only difference between me and a DL is that I like a few more "accessories" and enjoy the idea of being cuddled and cared for by another person, while in my baby mode. We all like diapers and let's face it ... everyone associates diapers with babies.

I think you may be basing this assumption on looking through your own lenses pipsqueak. From the very beginning,I have always seen diapers as erotic. Trying a few baby acessories years ago just made me feel like a total idiot.

There really is NO regrassion component in a lot of us who wear diapers-period.

And to us-to be classed as "babies" is outright insulting. Pretty much along the lines of calling every woman out there a "whore"-because SOME have sex for money.

[tenderheart]

I was simply making the point that some of us DO specialize in how we use diapers.

And with all of the pedo hunters out there, I can understand why. It's also why I will not be interested in involving any role playing ab's in the group-unfair as it sounds-it's them that get the fingers pointed at as potential pedophiles when the witch hunters start going through groups to cancel them. I don't like that any better than the rest of you-but feel no need to take on the guilt by association that it can potentially bring, and I am also not interested in the sort of people who join every diaper group out there, just to join.

But an ab willing to drop the baby stuff to talk about Diaper love? I'd have no problem with including.

You have to draw the line somewhere.

Guilt of what? Being a Pedo? Because your an AB? Talk about outright insulting.

[Topguy]

Guilt of what? Being a Pedo? Because your an AB? Talk about outright insulting.

See how it feels when people make assumptions, and try to pigeonhole you into places you don't belong?

*I* don't happen to be the one who started that. Should we do the same to each other?

[Baby D]

Can I ask why it would be the AB's that would draw the "pedo hunters"? I look at it like this, people DO associate diapers with babies. That's only natural. It's when sexual activity and the infantile icon get mixed that makes people think we're pedophiles. If anything, I would think that the sexual aspect would draw the "pedo hunters" not people just pretending to be babies.

And as far as the topic of the post goes, I think diaperwearntigger said it best. Seriously, if we of all people can't accept others who slightly vary with us, then how could we possibly ever except society to accept us? And anyways, I said screw society a long time ago. I've never been society's picture of normal and I really don't want to be. Simple as that. I personally don't care for labels... it only leads to people making assumptions which are usually more wrong than they are right. I really don't see why it is necessary to break us down any further. We know who we are and that's all that really matters.

[Topguy]

Is anyone else noticing that it only seems to be the ab's that want to lump everyone that likes diapers into the "baby" category?

[Baby D]

Who said that AB's want to lump everyone together? Maybe we're the open-minded ones who really don't give a damn what anyone else thinks.

[Topguy]

Who said that AB's want to lump everyone together? Maybe we're the open-minded ones who really don't give a damn what anyone else thinks.

What was posted previoiusly doesn't exactly agree. Go back and count how many said everyone who had a diaper fetish should be seen as a baby. Isn't that a bit ego centric?

You cannot get acceptance by making everyone else the same as you. You do it by respecting the differences.

[Baby D]

Only like two people (AB's) leaned towards the side of thinking that DL's should be considered AB's. You can't deny that diapers are an icon of infancy so it is only natural for people to assume that anyone who likes diapers are big babies. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just saying, that's how people view it.

I think you're making this whole thing to be much more complicated than it needs to be. Honestly, I don't see what's wrong with things as they are. The majority of the people here, have no problems with the classification. For the most part, the only people classifying DL's as "babies" is the media. And until our community becomes more known, the media is bound to make mistakes.

But fear not, I do have an idea. You could speed up the process if you want, by starting some DL march in Washington DC to draw attention to the fact that you're not a "baby".

[Topguy]

Only like two people (AB's) leaned towards the side of thinking that DL's should be considered AB's. You can't deny that diapers are an icon of infancy so it is only natural for people to assume that anyone who likes diapers are big babies. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just saying, that's how people view it.

I think you're making this whole thing to be much more complicated than it needs to be. Honestly, I don't see what's wrong with things as they are. The majority of the people here, have no problems with the classification. For the most part, the only people classifying DL's as "babies" is the media. And until our community becomes more known, the media is bound to make mistakes.

But fear not, I do have an idea. You could speed up the process if you want, by starting some DL march in Washington DC to draw attention to the fact that you're not a "baby".

LOL,not a lot of need for that. Going to be plenty of diapered people out there in the next twenty years. I doubt that the baby boomers are going to have a lot of tolerance for people dissing thier members who go incon about it. Watch out Leno!

[Mostest Anonomi]

Incontinents

Regressionists = Adult Babies

Fetishists = Diaper Lovers

A person who is purely an Adult Baby doesn't make it sexual at all. They are into diapers, regression and baby play for a sense of security and escape. They feel comfortable regressing to a period in their life where they had no responsibilities or worries. It is technically not a fetish at all.

A Diaper Lover does make it sexual. They are into the humiliation and lack of control wearing diapers brings to a person. It seems like dominance/submissiveness to me. The person wearing the diaper is dependant, out of control and embarrassed. The other side of it (dominant?) enjoys seeing people in this 'helpless' state and perhaps contributes to this.

Incontinents are neither AB nor DL.

These do overlap all the time... people can be a mix of all of these things. And I do agree that there is often a problem classifying people exactly.

[diaperwearntigger]

Incontinents

Regressionists = Adult Babies

Fetishists = Diaper Lovers

A person who is purely an Adult Baby doesn't make it sexual at all. They are into diapers, regression and baby play for a sense of security and escape. They feel comfortable regressing to a period in their life where they had no responsibilities or worries. It is technically not a fetish at all.

A Diaper Lover does make it sexual. They are into the humiliation and lack of control wearing diapers brings to a person. It seems like dominance/submissiveness to me. The person wearing the diaper is dependant, out of control and embarrassed. The other side of it (dominant?) enjoys seeing people in this 'helpless' state and perhaps contributes to this.

Incontinents are neither AB nor DL.

These do overlap all the time... people can be a mix of all of these things. And I do agree that there is often a problem classifying people exactly.

I would one like to know how anyone can speak for someone else in what they like, don't like, think they are, feel who they are, or how they classify themselves. I for one personally don't care what category you fit into nor am I one that says that if you are DL you should be classified as an AB... my daddy/husband is a DL and I certainly don't classify him in the same category as AB as I am.

What really pisses me off, is the quote above, I'm an AB, and it is very much a sexual thing. It has nothing to do with security. Yes, it has some to do with escape, but even for my DL daddy/husband, its an escape for him too. I know this and I can speak for him because its something we have discussed on many occassions. Being diapered, being babied, what have you, is more sexual for me than it is about having a secure feeling.

Please don't go speaking for the whole AB group when you have no idea what you are talking about because I personally don't fit into your category you claim ABs to be.

[Mostest Anonomi]

I would one like to know how anyone can speak for someone else in what they like, don't like, think they are, feel who they are, or how they classify themselves. I for one personally don't care what category you fit into nor am I one that says that if you are DL you should be classified as an AB... my daddy/husband is a DL and I certainly don't classify him in the same category as AB as I am.

What really pisses me off, is the quote above, I'm an AB, and it is very much a sexual thing. It has nothing to do with security. Yes, it has some to do with escape, but even for my DL daddy/husband, its an escape for him too. I know this and I can speak for him because its something we have discussed on many occassions. Being diapered, being babied, what have you, is more sexual for me than it is about having a secure feeling.

Please don't go speaking for the whole AB group when you have no idea what you are talking about because I personally don't fit into your category you claim ABs to be.

I apologize, I didn't mean to offend you. The question asked about the terms' definition and I tried to define them based on what I've read in research articles. In reality, many people don't fit clearly into either definition. I never said they did. But to say that I have no idea what I'm talking about is really unfair. I've been into this fetish for almost ten years and have spent a lot of time trying to find out what these fetishes are and where I fit in into them. This is what I've found out on those sites... and it is the most clear definition I've found. It may be difficult for us here because many of us (including me) don't fit perfectly into either one but they're technically two different things. It is a fact that there are people who this is completely non-sexual for, and they do indeed tend toward the dressing up like babies, the baby-talk/actions and the crib. Their relationship is often more caring and nurturing. It is also a fact that other people find this sexual. They tend to not like the baby stuff and the person in diapers is usually under some form of psychological distress. You can call these two things whatever you like but they do exist. As I said it wasn't me who came up with this and I've done a lot of reading about the topic. I have a lot of respect for those researchers who study this, as the articles have helped me understand a lot of things about my past and what causes these fetishes. It also helped me become more accepting of what I am and what I like.

So my apologies to anyone I offended, I tried to give a technical answer to a technical question.

btw, you talked in a previous post about AB vs. DL. I'm not trying to divide the community and I'm not trying to imply that one is better than the other. I'm sorry if it appeared that way. I am an open-minded and welcoming person and would hate to give that impression. I just think it is important to understand who we are and why we are the way we are. Lumping everyone together makes it really hard to do this.

[diaperwearntigger]

A person who is purely an Adult Baby doesn't make it sexual at all. They are into diapers, regression and baby play for a sense of security and escape. They feel comfortable regressing to a period in their life where they had no responsibilities or worries. It is technically not a fetish at all.

A Diaper Lover does make it sexual. They are into the humiliation and lack of control wearing diapers brings to a person. It seems like dominance/submissiveness to me. The person wearing the diaper is dependant, out of control and embarrassed. The other side of it (dominant?) enjoys seeing people in this 'helpless' state and perhaps contributes to this.

I had a problem with what you said above as if you are an AB you don't make it sexual at all. So not true... Secondly, a DL does make it sexual, again so not true. Maybe you should stop reading articles that most likely are written by people who are neither AB or DL or incontinent and maybe talk to those who truly are and in the community. I think if you do you will find that most of those articles have no idea what they are talking about.

Everyone is different. Diapers represent and mean many different things to many different people and to make quotes like the ones above are both narrow minded and ignorant.

And you are a DL, you can't speak for us ABs no matter how much you read because even us ABs are different from each other.