New Documentry About Infantilism Being Made...

[Bettypooh]

....Until this community cleans its act up....

No community I know of meets that standard, be it ABDL, TG, GLB, BSDM, or even churches

If changes are to be made in public opinion they have to start somewhere and be started by someone. Is Stanley the right one for this? I dunno Is the time right for this to begin? I think yes- society has never been this open and even accepting of diversity even if those against it have been very vocal. I counseled a TG friend to not come out as a TG, but to go into a stealth TS life instead. There was every reason for this- she could 'pass', she could more easily get a job as a woman, she lived in a very intolerant and conservative city where violence wasn't unknown and the police rather lax about protecting minorities. I was worried for her safety. She wouldn't budge- she was going to do this

It wasn't easy but she managed and is still managing to do OK. She hasn't had much trouble, has found more tolerance than I thought possible and even some acceptance! She even has a job where she appears in public and deals with just about everyone in that town there. I asked her why she chose this path in this town- her answer was that this was a place which needed to be educated about TG's as badly as any and more than most. Making changes here would make more progress for the TG community than going stealth in a more accepting town. And it was time for that to happen. It turned out that I was wrong about everything I believed would come of this

Having gone through that I am not going to judge Stanley or these show episodes. I would have done differently but this wasn't me- this was Stanley. And he could have done a lot worse than he did. In the end it was (and is) his choice to do whatever he wants, and unless you want to present a different picture on TV to counter him, there's no point in bashing him for that- the deed is done and life goes on for all of us I think the average person can understand that nobody exactly represents any segment of society. Jesse Jackson doesn't represent every Black person, the Pope doesn't represent every Christian, and Ron Paul doesn't represent every Republican. They a one part of their groups and only one part. Others in those groups are different

Stanley is a part of us, and Stanley is different. There's nothing wrong with that. Stanley went on TV with his life, just as many others do and there's nothing wrong with that either unless you're advocating censorship (in which case you need to let me run your life since I think you're messing it up) But I tried that already with my TG friend and I was wrong, so I'm not asking to run your life- or Stanley's Instead I'm trying to learn from whatever I can. I know there was at least some good done, even if those who disagree are vocal about that. In the end it is not my life, it is not me, and I know that nobody else can be me- they have to be themselves and do what they think best. And most importantly, I know I can be wrong no matter how strongly I think I'm right.

The water has flowed under the bridge and whatever the result of that is cannot be changed or completely undone. It can only be noticed and learned from. If there was something you wanted Stanley to do differently he would have listened better had you befriended him instead of bashing him. Those who bash have gotten what they asked for and yet they complain still because they didn't get what they wanted. Those who are intolerant themselves have exposed that Stanley has done this twice and may yet do it again- and that takes guts, more than most of us have- especially when you consider what is at risk with him which he is fully aware of. And we as a community know all this, but we as a community still don't see the opportunity we had (and may still have) to present ourselves as good and decent people who are just different. Stanley is not the first to go public with the ABDL lifestyle and he's not going to be the last. When are we going to learn what to do with that fact? That's what I want to know.

Bettypooh

[ForbiddenFruit]

If there was something you wanted Stanley to do differently he would have listened better had you befriended him instead of bashing him. Those who bash have gotten what they asked for and yet they complain still because they didn't get what they wanted. Those who are intolerant themselves have exposed that

This is more or less the first time I can't actually agree with you. In this thread itself, yes, Stanley did get a lot of venom coming his way, even, I'll admit, from myself, but a large amount of it was well-put and, dare I say it, warranted - particularly at first when people were explaing that he was, and still is, putting himself in immense danger.

I don't think Stanley would have changed his actions either way. This thread was made solely for his playdate hunt. Warnings both about him and the 'community' as a whole went ignored. Does he have guts and great strength of will for going out and doing what he did regardless? Definitely, I'll give him that much. Did it help anyone in any way? Not particularly, if at all.

I can't tell if Stanley actually understands what he's getting into when he does these things. There's a complete clashing agenda between what he wants to represent and what people who actually have control (editors, execs, stations, pretty much everyone involved who isn't a subject) want to represent. Was he aware he's being showcased alongside a man with a proud sex doll collection and a woman whose beverage of choice is her own urine? You can't make a good case for evolution at a rally of dedicated creationists, the same way you can't give a good impression of any eccentricity on the 'freak show shock value' subgenre of documentary. That's what these shows boil down to. what little sympathy DOES exist is used mockingly. Are we shown as harmless? Yes, but only in the same sense that a woman who lives in a rusted shack with fifty cats, living on licking the fungi that grows on the walls, is harmless.

On a few occasions I've said how I'm very cynical on the idea of a 'community'. I don't beleive in a 'battle for AB rights' or anything of the sort. Even if it's not a sexual thing for you, it's simply beyond common decency to want to go around in public dressed as a baby. It's a coping method. Keep it where it belongs. Just because I don't want to see men necking on the street doesn't make me homophobic (far damn from it, I prefer boys myself), I'm annoyed by anyone being so vulgar and animalistic in public.

And yet at the same time, I can't help but feel what Stanley did hasn't helped, and now I think I'm starting to understand why. Best case scenario, vanilla people laugh, leave vitriolic comments, everything goes back to the way it was. Middle-case scenario: this bites Stanley personally in the ass, as it did last time. If it does, my sympathies go out to him, but he was cautioned for his own sake before the community's sake.

Now, the real problem is what adverse effect this can carry. Not as bad as the news stories that associate ABDL with paedophilia, but negative nonetheless. It just has a detrimental effect on general perception of people like 'us'. I don't think it's possible, or exactly necessary, to foster some kind of positive attitude. But every incident like this paints it as being absurd and life-consuming. If it continues, ABDL practicioners coul be actively villified instead of just dismissed as being odd.

I'm not suggesting it would end in some kind of freaky witch hunt, but in cases where people were discovered to have diapers for their own recreational use the general reaction could be more negative than it is now by (ill-informed) association. My boyfriend-of-sorts knows that I have an AB side but doesn't particularly understand it, partly because through the net he's a cloud cuckoolander and partly because I don't have the courage to sit and try to articulate it to him without seeming needy. Imagine if the clearest representation he got was from shows like this. Yes, he knows I'm nothing like Stanley, but it certainly won't do any good.

By extension, whenever a camp / gay actor is on television and my parents are nearby watching, if one takes a jab, even in jest, at the "fairy" or "poofter" on air, it makes me scared. Every time my lesbian cousin posts some vulgarity on facebook, or her fiancé responds with 'lovvvvvve yhhuu bbeeee mwaaaaaaaaah xx' that makes me afraid. No, I don't want to hear about your facesitting habits even if it's a joke, the same way my family doesn't need to know about my wishes that my boyfriend would dress me up as a baby girl and bottlefeed me. I cringe at many of the goings-on I see at pride parades. I'm almost terrified of coming out as being bisexual to my parents as it's something they need to know but negative influences are all around, and I'm trying to think if it's possible to live without telling them I'm bigender.

See what I'm getting at? I always have been and am likely to remain cynical about the idea of the 'ABDL community' but I can't deny this doesn't have an adverse effect.

[kootzkoo]

... is an awful tactic if you want to present yourself as somebody who hasn't researched Littles, as it implies that you have prior knowledge to the conversation, or really like talking about things you know nothing about.

Either way, it is a poor tactic. A Little or an idiot.

And, to make it clear, I have no responsibility or wish to defend Adult Babies/DLs in general. Until this community cleans its act up, ejects ALL of the HNGs, sends a clear message that misogyny is intolerable, clearly condemns any and all acts involving children, clearly condemns those who would force their fetish on others, and starts to realize that a fetish isn't an excuse to make an ass of one's self, it is simply not worth defending.

And it has done none of the above.

(To be clear, by "this community," I mean the ABDL community as a whole, not DD in specific)

where did I say present yourself as someone who has not done any research on it? I am pretty sure I said you can tell people that you are aware of this because of research you have done.

[Leilin]

If changes are to be made in public opinion

To be clear, I wasn't referring to public opinion. Just what was required for this community to be defensible, which it is currently not, in my eyes.

One might say that it's not feasible, but pockets of the ABDL community have done just that. Of course no community is perfect in that standard, but the ABDL community stands out as one which is pretty much unwilling to make any effort at all on the whole. There ARE places where being an HNG or spouting outright bigotry in the ABDL world is openly listed as intolerable and against the rules. Does it makes those small pockets smaller than they might otherwise be? Yup, but it sure as hell makes them nice places to be.

The best thing that can happen for "public opinion," in my opinion, is for certain individuals to decide that their bedroom practices are not everybody else in the world's business. However, that's their choice to make, so I have no illusions of a situation other than one which has gullible individual after gullible individual going on television, assuming they can be "better" or make a difference in a better way than the last gullible individual.

where did I say present yourself as someone who has not done any research on it? I am pretty sure I said you can tell people that you are aware of this because of research you have done.

Which immediately paints you as somebody interested enough in the topic to have researched community standards and norms to anybody who's paying attention and can exhibit even a modicum of reasoning skills. No, thanks.You have fun with that but I have no desire to be outed.

[ForbiddenFruit]

One might say that it's not feasible, but pockets of the ABDL community have done just that. Of course no community is perfect in that standard, but the ABDL community stands out as one which is pretty much unwilling to make any effort at all on the whole. There ARE places where being an HNG or spouting outright bigotry in the ABDL world is openly listed as intolerable and against the rules. Does it makes those small pockets smaller than they might otherwise be? Yup, but it sure as hell makes them nice places to be.

I meant not feasible as an entirety. There will always be...undesirables...around. That much is certain. Can you provide names of such communities?

[Leilin]

Diaperspace is one example of a common culprit.

[ForbiddenFruit]

I meant examples of ones that cleaned themselves up, sorry, should have been more specific.

[Eir]

I have a feeling that Stanley may lose his disability assistance this time. What a foolish decision, jeapordizing everything to go on a freak show, what did he honestly expect? I have a feeling he will hit us up for a living room sofa to sleep on!

[sarah_ab]

unless he meets the financial criteria i highly doubt he will lose ssa .... think of it this way if you need to .... many here say how mentally ill he must be to need to display his private life in public and how he has very poor judgement.... well there ya go you just provided even more reasons why he WOULD be an allowance .... many people mistakenly think he wants to be a 24/7 baby ... could a person who lives as a baby 24/7 be mentally healthy enough to work in an adult job and maintain appropriate behavior 40 hours a week?

[Bettypooh]

Terryfighter, you may be right- it is unwise to make enemies of powerful people even when you are totally right. I might have done it once, but to go with the second time I'd have to be the one controlling the content and comments shown- and of course they won't let you do that. If Stanley gets screwed over for this I will feel sorry for him but I will have to temper that by knowing he took that chance willingly and he should have known it could happen. He was certainly told that here.

As to good or bad done, we're at a point where some know something about us. Maybe half of those understand what we're about and the other half lost as ever To those who know nothing of us, maybe the ratio will continue- who knows? But at least we will now be more known and more discussed- and that is a gain for us even if the discussion doesn't cast us in a good light. Let me explain why.

When people come from knowing nothing and are misinformed, on discovery of that they will come around to the truth. When I came out as a TG to some friends, they thought "Drag". When I explained it wasn't the same at all. some still didn't understand. When I proved my point by showing them pictures of me they saw that indeed it was different and indeed they were wrong. That converted all but two of them to knowing the truth about the difference. We may not have as easy a way to 'prove' this thing, but some will still come around anyway. We are better off for the subject being discussed, especially if we chime in with the facts. That can be done by saying you ran across it online or knew someone like that who pointed you there. Of course it is your choice whether to speak up or not, and what to say if you do.

Not everyone will agree with me and that's fine- to each their own. Not everyone will want to speak of this- even as an uninvolved third party. What I might do or say would have to be based on the who and where of things- some times, people, and places I'd rather avoid this. But is pressed I would always say "To each their own. If it's not hurting anyone it's none of my business what anyone else does." I use that all the time already so nobody would notice it as applying to me, but they would see that this too is just one of the diversities of life, all of which I have no problem with.

To those who believe this should be private I say apply that to yourself, but don't tell others how to live unless you want your own life controlled by the ones who disagree with you. Neither of you has the right to do either, it's live and let live so what works for you may not work for someone else. That is an individual choice and whether you like it or not, you can't control what anyone else does or does not do. If you have a valid argument to back up that point then state it well, discus it if you wish, but don't say that it's wrong just because you wouldn't do it that way- that is not enough reason for someone who is not you.

Bettypooh

[Leilin]

I meant examples of ones that cleaned themselves up, sorry, should have been more specific.

Honestly, I'm not sure I can name one. Most descend and just don't come back. Fetlife is "clean," but that's specifically because it is fissioned and the HNGs can find their own board, whereas the rest of us who want to avoid them like the plague can be elsewhere where they can't annoy us or perv on us.

[Honeywell6180]

You know, I think that in some ways, Stanly could have done us a favor. He really exposes some of the uglier parts of the fetish and AB issue. I put in a nice review of a new Medline product on another site, and got no response at all in 17 hours for the work I put into it. This was the type of pullup that so many people were looking for, with the padding that extended fully, the length of the product, like many of the store brands.

Instead, people wanted to talk about sticking marshmallows up their rectum, to induce an "accident". They wanted to talk about how "wonderful" it feels to be in a "wet, squishy diaper". Stupid is, as stupid does. And I think that perhaps half of those folks at least, have a problem that's probably worse than Stanly's. What in the World is wrong with "dry, and comfortable"? Well, that's my preference, the love for good hygiene, the ability to function, and the pride of being in complete control of my facilities. Not to mention, the thankfulness of people around me, for my ability to care for my own needs without depending on others.

Sadly, about half of the people who visit these sites, really don't represent us at all. Not the DL community, not the AB community, and certainly not those with disabilities or suffering from some form of incontinence.

[Honeywell6180]

Correction on the above post: The adult pull-on actually has the padding that extends like a child's pullup, not the low-rise center panel of a typical Depends. Sorry for the error.

[sarah_ab]

You know, I think that in some ways, Stanly could have done us a favor. He really exposes some of the uglier parts of the fetish and AB issue. I put in a nice review of a new Medline product on another site, and got no response at all in 17 hours for the work I put into it. This was the type of pullup that so many people were looking for, with the padding that extended fully, the length of the product, like many of the store brands.

Instead, people wanted to talk about sticking marshmallows up their rectum, to induce an "accident". They wanted to talk about how "wonderful" it feels to be in a "wet, squishy diaper". Stupid is, as stupid does. And I think that perhaps half of those folks at least, have a problem that's probably worse than Stanly's. What in the World is wrong with "dry, and comfortable"? Well, that's my preference, the love for good hygiene, the ability to function, and the pride of being in complete control of my facilities. Not to mention, the thankfulness of people around me, for my ability to care for my own needs without depending on others.

Sadly, about half of the people who visit these sites, really don't represent us at all. Not the DL community, not the AB community, and certainly not those with disabilities or suffering from some form of incontinence.

well duh... lots of people like to be wet and squishy.. so apparently according to t his, if someone doesn't respond to a post after 17 hours, and instead responds to a post about somethjing that also turns them on... they are stupid?

seriously not everyone CARES about pullups... i mean .. many of us want the traditional taped on crinkly thick diaper.. and we want to be 'made' to wet and mess it like a baby.....

just because YOU like to be dry and comfortable in no way makes you a good representative.. for example.. right there you are cleary NOT representing the community very well as you just pointed out most people didn't care about your post... so dry and comfrotable... great that you enjoy it..

dont knock on those of us who done, or those of us who come to ABDL sites for something other than diaper reviews....

[belinda_sue_fox]

Wait..what...so if it's under seventeen hours i have to say i'm wet sloppy stinky and flies follow me around? After that and i'm clean and everyone who smells is a freak?

Or is it the other way around? No it's i'm always wonderful and you lot are always stinky no matter the time. of reply.

[Honeywell6180]

I guess you're right. I'm not representing the community, because I'm really not ABDL. I am autistic, and diapers are among the tools I need to keep some parts of it managed, and under my control so I can be productive. But at the same time, I have seen the ABDL community help with a lot of the innovation seen with many of the adult products out there today. People made fun of the thought of diapers that use a single tape on each side for adults, then a company called ABUniverse came out with one. And, the nay Sayers were put to shame, because the system they designed works. No more need for a 50-tape, green plastic grandma garment that so many ignorant people were so excited about. Customer demand from the ABDL community is what also brought about the premium lines such as Molicare, Abena, Secure X-Plus, and finally Bambino. It leads to innovation, and at the same time customer satisfaction. It created a windfall for many folks with medical needs, because now they finally have products they can choose from instead of some idiot's idea of what an adult should wear.

And it's much of that product research, that brings me to places like this. But you know something else? You really don't have to keep me here if you don't want to. But, the moderators assured me that I am here to stay. And as long as I am here, I will do what I can to answer any questions about my experiences with specific products, to help others who have to go through similar experiences as mine. Sorry folks, but you're stuck with me regardless.

[sarah_ab]

lol and this is not to be argumentative.. but actually the one tapes dont' work that well for many body types... i know as a woman w/ hips most adult diapers are awfully designed anyway.. and assume all people are straight rectangles.. but even worse with the one tape.. and abuniverse only made those to cater to adult babies.. they weren't made for people who buy for need, but were made because they look more babyish.... so really ab's still have had no influence on the acutaly adult incontinence world, but rather on a fetish product....

I wasn't upste with you being here, but rather with your stating that people who did not respond to your review of a specific pull up product immediately were stupid.... and implying that those people who enjoy being in a wet and messy diaper were somehow inferior....

[Honeywell6180]

Well, no, it wasn't the lack of response to a post I made on the Medline product. But rather, my beef was with those who do unhealthy things with these products. It is not healthy to stick a foreign object up one's rectum, that shouldn't be there. What if someone did this, and tore the lining of their colon? Then it's strait to the emergency room, and PRAY for recovery!

[sarah_ab]

hmm i have butt plugs in my bum often... never had an problem.. never been to the er.. nothing but pleasure....

i see your point, putting food up there could be dangerous..

but your approach was nothing like this.. you approach came off completely different than what you just said....

[WBDaddy]

Honestly, I'm not sure I can name one. Most descend and just don't come back. Fetlife is "clean," but that's specifically because it is fissioned and the HNGs can find their own board, whereas the rest of us who want to avoid them like the plague can be elsewhere where they can't annoy us or perv on us.

Probably one of the most hated "pockets" in this entire community - ADISC - you can accuse them of a LOT of things, but tolerating HNG's, stealth pedos, etc. just doesn't happen there.

[Leilin]

Probably one of the most hated "pockets" in this entire community - ADISC - you can accuse them of a LOT of things, but tolerating HNG's, stealth pedos, etc. just doesn't happen there.

I patently disagree with that assessment.

ABDL community is what also brought about the premium lines such as Molicare, Abena, Secure X-Plus,

What on earth gave you that idea?

[WBDaddy]

I patently disagree with that assessment.

Elaborate?

[Leilin]

Elaborate?

Moderators watching and refusing to act on minors in sexual relationships on the site, trolls, and other various things. Not pedophilia, but still a fair degree of hypocrisy.

[WBDaddy]

Moderators watching and refusing to act on minors in sexual relationships on the site, trolls, and other various things. Not pedophilia, but still a fair degree of hypocrisy.

They actually banned the biggest troll there for a year. In fact, his ban is due to be up sometime in July, if I recall correctly.

I have no idea what you're talking about regarding minors in sexual relationships on the site. They are very, very vigilant about sexual content of any kind on the forums - it's not tolerated. If you're talking about the chatroom, then that's a whole other story. I never log onto chatrooms anywhere - not enough opportunity for thoughtful discussion when the conversation changes direction 500 times a minute. That said, minors in sexual relationships with other minors isn't the problem - it's the adults in sexual relationships with minors.

[Leilin]

If you're talking about the chatroom, then that's a whole other story.

I am, and when they are allowing adults input on those relationships, it is certainly a problem. Voyuerism of minors in sex acts (yes, even cyber ones) should be unacceptable.

I am speaking solely from my personal experience here, for the record. They may have improved in the 2 years since I left, but if the same people are still in charge, I doubt it, and considering their other dubious elements, I have no desire to find out.