Am I Intolerant ? Nearly Had A Bike Accident Yestereve...

[Eric D]

i have to say if i had been in Eric's shoes.....i'm pretty sure i too would have had a negative response......

i guess all i can say is for me it's about respect for others..........i personally don't like having anything blatently shoved in my face........religious preferences...sexual preferences...clothing preferences....political preferences...gender preferences.......whatever it is that makes you unique...different...ecentric......different then the norm....etc...if you are shoving it in my face....i'm not going to have the same reaction as i would if you carry yourself in a less "LOOK AT ME" sort of manner................

there is a time and a place for everything.....fetish parade = ab costumes for all my friends and whips and leashes for the Mommies and Daddies ............ quiet family neighborhood = sweatpants with a diaper underneath and a tshirt that may afford a quick glimpse at one's diaper so that if someone was really looking they might have to do a double take but because you are riding your bike so quickly you are now off in the distance .......

and while for me it isn't necessarily about being disgusting....although sometimes when out of "context" i too can certainly relate to finding some ab/dl topics or scenerios actually pretty ackie or uncomfortable ....i just personally don't feel that riding your bike in a residential neighborhood dressed in full ab costume is ...............respectful to anyone in the vicinity....

it's true we don't know what this persons motives were but if i had to guess.......there was a reason an idividual would choose to do this...be it sexual or not....this persons desires must surely include wanting to be noticed and not just a little noticed...

ramble ramble ramble....end of reply

Entirely my point... thank you jenniebear...

it's about RESPECT towards your surroundings and not to be so god damn "pushy" just because you life a so called alternative lifestyle.

The main thing I often fail to get here is that so many here scream for a broader public acceptance and to see them not as fetishists, perverts, kink-people, whatever... Many here are very loud at voicing how much they want and need to be accepted - BUT let me ask you this:

Do you think the way of getting acceptance is by disrespecting the feelings of others, by shoving up your "alternative lifestyle" on strangers?

If you believe that's the way, then you couldn't be any more wrong.

What you will gain though, is quite the opposite - if you piss off people, they will not go out and accept you... and you don't need to be a genius to see this.

[Eric D]

As DLs, I suspect that 99% of the people out there who discovered that we wore diapers by choice would automatically assume that we're ABs. And more than a few of them would probably then conclude that we're perverts. Does it matter that we're not? Nope. To the rest of the world, Eric, you and I are ABs. Discretion doesn't change that.

In your original note, you brought up gays as evidence of your tolerance, and I take you at your word on that subject.

But there are a lot of people out there who see any evidence of someone being gay as "flaunting" their sex life, whether it's as mundane as some of the stereotypes associated with gays to something a bit more overt as boyfriends holding hands or kissing in contexts similar to where similar behavior is routine among straight men and women, e.g., strolling along the sidewalk, greetings at a restaurant, etc. As a gay man, I've been accused of flaunting my sex life for simply stating that I'm gay in response to someone asking me if I have a girlfriend. The "flaunting" charge is simply an attempt to push gay people back into the closet, to justify getting rid of whatever they're not comfortable with by sexualizing everything about it.

That's why I'm not real keen on worrying about whether some people will assume that for the AB in question, it's a sexual fetish. Diapers aren't a sexual thing for me - I just like to wear them. I don't automatically assume that an AB sees this as a sexual fetish.

Obviously I don't know the situation involving the AB you saw. Perhaps the neighbors are fine with it. Perhaps not. But I do know that there are a lot of parents who don't want gays anywhere near their kids no matter how discrete we gays are. And I suspect that there are a lot of parents out there who wouldn't be too keen on men who wear diapers for fun anywhere near their kids either, again no matter discrete we are.

If it was a sexual thing, sure, that doesn't belong in public. But if not, then I see no reason to pander to other people's fears.

You raise a good point about gays - I think the problem is that many are freaked by the bare thought of two many loving each other. I'm not.

I don't mind if a gay or lesbian couple holds hands or kisses in public... after all I kiss my grilfriend too in public sometimes.

But having sex (gay or hetero...) at a public location is off limits to me... simply because I know that there are many (not everyone) out there who would find this rather disgusting. When I'm in a public environment I try not to be a complete intolerant moron.

I travelled through places where for men it was considered indecent to wear shorts... and damn it was hot, but I still wore my long trousers...

it is something "larger than my own person" and I try to respect a societies morals and rules unless it is an emergency. For example if someone needed medical help fast I wouldn't hesitate to steal a car to bring him to a hospital real quick. I would however bear the full consequences of my actions later - as I am fully responsible.

in the end a bit of respect a bit of decency and in 90% of the cases you're absolutely ok.

If I ask a gay guy (when I don't know he's gay) if he's got a girlfriend and he says that he's gay and got a boyfriend, I don't think that's flaunting or offensive...

if I see someone with a diaper beneath some sweatpants and we somehow got into a discussion about this and he says "I wear for fun or comfort" I don't see any problem either. if I see a dude with just a binky... hell I think it's weird, but not "wrong",...

But the AB back there was a full-outfit full-show... in a quiet family neighborhood and sorry, that's generally just "over the edge".

and I don't believe that so many here are actually willing to say that's "OK". when exactly that type of guy gives you a bad rep.

[Codymoogle]

I wear my diapers because I need to from incontinence, and I also use my binky in public at times. Every so often I've used one of my bottles when it was quiet outside as well. I have also had one of my plushies with me on occasion, either with or without my binky. (Note: I only bring out ONE at a time, if that wasn't apparent.)

Sure, I've had a few stares (mostly from seniors), but I wasn't hurting anyone. If anyone ever questions me (which they haven't yet): I would tell them my binky is to help me quit smoking or something like that, even though it isn't true.

And as far as my plushies? As far as my plushies go, I haven't even gotten any stares at ALL. Heck, there have even been a few people that have wanted to know where I got them!

Besides my binky and/or plushie, however, I don't act and be myself in public. It sucks - there's a very big emotional burden there, that carries over into harming a person's physical health. I wish I could just be ME, no matter where I am.

From what I've seen, (a lot of, not all) DL's and AB's that are AB as a fetish do not really understand this, because they can be themselves wherever, because DL's can just put on a diaper and they're content. And the AB's that have a fetish, it's just a "playtime" thing for them. Now I may be generalizing, but this is just what I've observed on the whole. So I ask other people, please don't freak out, because it was just a general observation. I did not say ALL.

Now, I am not expecting to be allowed to act up in public ("make a scene"). Contrary to the belief of - again, SOME, not all - DL's that I've talked to, many AB's, including myself, do NOT want to make a scene in public. There are the few rare exceptions, I know, but the few AB's that do make a scene are probably sexually driven by it. Most of us AB's just want to be ourselves. No sex, no public indecency, no harassing people.

I completely understand that in the eyes of the public, AB/DL is considered a fetish, even when it is not for a lot of people.

But as I've said, the AB's like myself that aren't looking to make a scene. We just want to be able to express ourselves in peace, which does no harm to the general public. Seeing someone using a paci or dressing in babyish clothes like overalls or a "little girl"-ish dress will not harm anyone unless they CHOOSE to be harmed by it.

If a child comes up to me and asks, "why are you using a pacifier?" etc, I'll answer in simple terms the child can understand. Even children - they more than likely won't think it's wrong unless their parent says so. Hate and disgust is taught.

It's not like we're going off and asking random strangers "Goo goo gaa gaa, i a baby, will you change my diaper?" - and those few that do, as I said above, are probably sexually driven AB's.

But I will say it again at the risk of sounding like a broken record -

Most of us AB's just want to be ourselves. No sex, no public indecency, no harassing people.

Why is that sooooooo wrong?

~ Moogle

[Eric D]

Moogle,

Wrong - it's not wrong or right in every case... there's no black and white stuff with most things.

"Most of us AB's just want to be ourselves. No sex, no public indecency, no harassing people"

That is good, and I agree as long as there's no public indecency involved and no people are "harassed" than frankly, even I don't see any problem...

BUT - well no matter if your AB Side for you is sexual or NOT AT ALL towards the broad public, towards an outsider this doesn't really matter.

And unless I get into a discussion with a certain INDIVIDUAL who has chosen to take his/hers AB life to the outside world in such a fashion (by walking through a family neighborhood all dressed up as an AB) I have no way to know whether his motives are sexual, whether he's getting off on that or not.

I can only assume - but that is the whole point - he forces me to make an assumption or walk him up and confront him. Now the later might be a bit more involvement than some may want for a number of different reasons. But he, imho, is taking it too far.

Let me explain this using a different example: This is all just hypothetical though... just some idea to show what I mean:

Someone decides that he doesn't like to wear any cloth at all... clothes of any type especially underwear make him feel "restricted" and "bound up"... so that individual decides to go all naked... he goes to the shopping mall, all naked, he goes strolling around town and suburbs - naked... he walks in front of a decent, quiet family neighborhood - again naked. he walks in front of a school or kindergarten - once more totally naked.

You get the idea I guess....

whilst there isn't particularly anything wrong with some people enjoying to be naked at designated beach-areas or places... the scene above would be not acceptable by most. It's not that I have a big issue seeing another guys dick and balls... but again it's not something I need to see that way.

And not for no reason in most places and countries there are laws against such "activities". it is public indecency... it is forcing your choice upon others and maybe even mildly visually assaulting - especially depending on the state of that persons body....

it's a simple example - one to which most would agree that it is at least not very acceptable and polite behavior... some may find it bemusing or "don't care" but we can see that this is not what should be done.

if the "naked-guy" would live all alone in a remote forest area and decides to go all naked forver - well that's a different issue... but within society there are certain things an individual should avoid to do for the sake of the others around him.

Or an even more blatant and bold example would be if a couple likes outdoor-sex and being watched... would you find it ok that they do it in a quiet public family neighborhood? I mean SEX per see, in a love-making sense of the word, is a beautiful thing ... none of us would exist without it, it's all natural, it's nothing dirty about it... so why make it such a taboo?... there are things which most within a society think would be more decent to do at a quiet all-alone place instead of where others might be forced to watch... it's something which has found wide acceptance and helps to regulate life together in a huge city or small town - respect others and they're more likely to respect you.

And now I ask you (and anyone else who thinks that AB was OK with his actions): WHY Should ABs be EXCLUDED from basic social rules?

[Codymoogle]

And now I ask you (and anyone else who thinks that AB was OK with his actions): WHY Should ABs be EXCLUDED from basic social rules?

You're right, Eric, we shouldn't. However, dressing like a baby, or using a pacifier or carrying a plushie in public, is not illegal. Your example of public nudity IS illegal.

Until which time sucking on a pacifer or wearing childish clothing in public becomes illegal (which i HIGHLY doubt it ever will), there will be people doing it. I personally don't see that as wrong as long as there's no harassment involved (which in my case, and quite a few other AB's cases, there is none).

Just my thoughts,

~ Moogle

[Baby Bethany]

I think the guy Eric saw just didn't make enough effort with his image, if you saw me in my gear Eric you'd get a right stiffy!

Sorry guys, te, he........I know I'm a sick geezer!

If it makes you feel better Eric I'm not over keen on seeing other male AB's dressed either. I quite like seeing the female ones though!

Dressing as a AB isn't always about sex, I've never had or wanted sex dressed.

Nobody should be arrested because of the clothes they wear.

Just my little comments.

Beth

[babykeiff]

This started as a shock to a member at seeing another adult dressed in the way he choses. Despite the fact that he is dressed as a baby, there is NOTHING illegal about the way he is dressed, and in the great scheme of things, nobody has the right to condemn him for his choices. Yes, I do agree that it may have been a shock to the member, but I do not know his history, so I do not know what would shock him, and neither does the person.

On a side note, incontinent people wear diapers 24/7, some so thick that an obvious waddle is noticed when they walk. The clothes that they wear is to compliment their diapers - which in all forms, is baby clothes. It the person has some mental illness that would cause constant drooling, it would not be unusual to see the person wearing a bib, and either sucking their thumb / pacifier. Also, it would not be unusual for them to have a comfort toy of somewhat. To others, this person may seem as a 'freak' or a 'adult baby' but to the informed who is aware of this persons affliction, they would either try to care for him/her or get him back to the care of his caretakers.

So I ask you all, although that this member was shocked to what he perceived, did he ask the question - 1 Is there some reason this person is dressed the way he is and wandering the neighbourhood. 2. Did this member pre-judge this person and assume that the reason for his attire was for some sexual conitation.

I say shame on you all for convicting this person without even simple information. Shame on you all.

[Vic]

Moogle,

Wrong - it's not wrong or right in every case... there's no black and white stuff with most things.

That is good, and I agree as long as there's no public indecency involved and no people are "harassed" than frankly, even I don't see any problem...

BUT - well no matter if your AB Side for you is sexual or NOT AT ALL towards the broad public, towards an outsider this doesn't really matter.

And unless I get into a discussion with a certain INDIVIDUAL who has chosen to take his/hers AB life to the outside world in such a fashion (by walking through a family neighborhood all dressed up as an AB) I have no way to know whether his motives are sexual, whether he's getting off on that or not.

I can only assume - but that is the whole point - he forces me to make an assumption or walk him up and confront him. Now the later might be a bit more involvement than some may want for a number of different reasons. But he, imho, is taking it too far.

Let me explain this using a different example: This is all just hypothetical though... just some idea to show what I mean:

Someone decides that he doesn't like to wear any cloth at all... clothes of any type especially underwear make him feel "restricted" and "bound up"... so that individual decides to go all naked... he goes to the shopping mall, all naked, he goes strolling around town and suburbs - naked... he walks in front of a decent, quiet family neighborhood - again naked. he walks in front of a school or kindergarten - once more totally naked.

You get the idea I guess....

whilst there isn't particularly anything wrong with some people enjoying to be naked at designated beach-areas or places... the scene above would be not acceptable by most. It's not that I have a big issue seeing another guys dick and balls... but again it's not something I need to see that way.

And not for no reason in most places and countries there are laws against such "activities". it is public indecency... it is forcing your choice upon others and maybe even mildly visually assaulting - especially depending on the state of that persons body....

it's a simple example - one to which most would agree that it is at least not very acceptable and polite behavior... some may find it bemusing or "don't care" but we can see that this is not what should be done.

if the "naked-guy" would live all alone in a remote forest area and decides to go all naked forver - well that's a different issue... but within society there are certain things an individual should avoid to do for the sake of the others around him.

Or an even more blatant and bold example would be if a couple likes outdoor-sex and being watched... would you find it ok that they do it in a quiet public family neighborhood? I mean SEX per see, in a love-making sense of the word, is a beautiful thing ... none of us would exist without it, it's all natural, it's nothing dirty about it... so why make it such a taboo?... there are things which most within a society think would be more decent to do at a quiet all-alone place instead of where others might be forced to watch... it's something which has found wide acceptance and helps to regulate life together in a huge city or small town - respect others and they're more likely to respect you.

And now I ask you (and anyone else who thinks that AB was OK with his actions): WHY Should ABs be EXCLUDED from basic social rules?

My my Eric,

you have had a lot to say! And I have found your flaming of Witch and others to be NOT so amusing. I grew up with an opinionated "decent" father who took every chance he got to beat "GOD FEARING" and DECENCY" into his kids.

Funny that all that that abuse did was to make all of us turn out to be hellions (but don't let your "God fearing decent soul worry, we've reformed). You know something? When a guy walks down the street in his birthday suit, he gets arrested (much like your development) for indecent exposure. The same would happen if a couple cared to have sex in public, that's why doing so is AGAINST THE LAW!! However dressing as an AB is NOT!!

Now I'm not saying that many might find it CREEPY, many might feel that way, but that does NOT change the fact that it is NOT illegal. He has broken NO LAW of indecency, okay? If you're so offended, then I suggest you look the other way. If seeing this guy makes you want to toss your cookies, by all means toss them, then go on your way. If you are so truly appalled by him then why don't you go up to him and beat him up? Oh that's right, you won't because that would be BREAKING THE LAW!, Well then, I suggest you simply look the other way.

I've met a lot of people who I FEEL think like you, one comes to mind, so let me give you an example. When I was stationed in Germany I was in the park one day with some guys from my unit, a German walked up and started telling me about how he didn't like Americans being in his country. He thought that we were too violent, and that we took advantage of some of the local girls, and that when we were on manuevers we were destructive of some of the environment. I listened to all of this, and when he was finished I said that what he said may seem true to him, but that if we weren't there that he most likely would be speaking Russian within a week. He thought about that and said that that MIGHT be true, and he walked off.

One of the other NCO's who was there (A RIGHT THINKER LIKE YOU), said to me sgt, I can't believe you stood there and let him talk about America like that, I looked at him and said "I'm here to defend our constitution, I may not agree with what he has to say, BUT I WILL defend to the death his right to say it. Then I walked off (I really never cared for that NCO in the first place).

What I have to say Eric, is that I find you to be far too intolerant to call yourself tolerant, and I've found a lot of self rightious people in my life, most of them RIGHT THINKERS. Most of them shoving their religions or prediguesses in my face, well sir I don't like it, not at all.

That's my two cents, I've read all through your post to finally post here on the end, so I don't feel bad that you've had to read such a long post from me. You probably will think you're RIGHT anyway and THINK THAT I'M JUST ANOTHER SNIVELLING WEAKLING like you called witch (by the way let's NOT stoop to name calling YOU INSENSITIVE LOUT).

By the way, can ANYONE tell me what imho means?

Vic

[Baby Bethany]

I don't really want to take sides in this argument at all, but I feel compelled to point out the Irony of using this statement in a post defending an adult walking in public dressed as a baby. Whether he is intending to do harm or not, he is disturbing the peace in the same way a topless woman would.

Just thought of an interesting question though, any law expert present can answer it, if a beautiful woman was walking down the street topless, would anyone who got into a car accident because of the distraction be able to sue or press charges?

Here in the UK (going back some years) the clothes store H&M were taken to court, because a advertising hording they used for 'Wonderbra' (with Anna Nicole Smith) caused a driver to crash his car. Apparently, it caused a few other crashes too, but I believe they were only taken to court the once.

Beth

[Eric D]

My my Eric,

...

By the way, can ANYONE tell me what imho means?

Vic

now where getting somewhere interesting...

but before I indulge myself in giving out some answers and feedback to your post vic, let me enlighten you on the meaning of the all-ever present internet acronyme IMHO - it simply stands for "In My Humble Opinion" - there are then some deviations for this "IMO" and "IMNSHO" (the later being rare but used sometimes) - the first ist simple: In My Opinion and the later being "In My Not So Humble Opinion".

but enough of that.

first I'm as much an atheist and non-religious person you'd be able to find. I have never been baptized, I have never taken any religious oath or have believed in gods, demons, devils, ghosts or anything like that.

Then about my political view on things, I'm not right-wing - but I'm not purely left wing either... with most political issues I stand somewhere in the centre.

There are a few issues on which I take a slightly leftist view and on some a slightly conservative view. It depends largely on the issue and on the options offered.

so much for your assertion of my person. so much for your judgment of who and what I am - I let this speak for itself.

I didn't start the name calling, but I'm not turning in my other cheek either - DiapWitch has often before proven to rattle things up and voice her own very opinionated position of things out loud without respect for someone else's feelings, so why should she be treated any different?

About dressing as an ab not being against any law - then tell me why has there been a police hunt for some dude whilst back going around at night in nothing but his diaper? if dressing up as an AB is ok than it surly is ok to walk around in a DL outfit only? eh?

obviously a good number of people including the police thought so otherwise.

but that's a different story...

I never said it was illegal - my whole point basically is that I find it very indecent to push your alternative life style, fetish or whatever into someone else's face. There are places where this would be ok and appropriate, and there are clearly places where with just a little bit of social skill you would see that it's inappropriate whethere there is an acutal law against it or not...

One of the reasons why there is no general law against AB outfits in the public is, as I must assume that it has happened only on very rare occasions...

But only because there's no law against this it doesn't make flaunting your alternative life style and fetish towards a small family neighborhood right.

I stick with what I said before - I don't mind if you (and anyone else) is into AB Stuff... I don't mind if someone gets of on wearing a sheep-skin underpants. Whatever floats that lil' boat of yours... hell I like diapers... But the difference is - that I know that the general public wouldn't be thrilled with seeing me in just a diaper, especially not in a family hood (no matter if that's sexual or not). And I RESPECT this.

At home, I live with my girlfriend, and she knows of my diapers and is "ok" with it as long as I don't want her to involve (to her credits she tried but didn't find it something appealing to her)... so I respect that and wear something over my diapers when I choose to wear diapers (which isn't daily btw... I do so sometimes when I feel like it). - that's respect. Yet I'm sure as sure I can be, that there is perfectly nothing Illegal about wearing diapers at my private home - and yet out of respect for someone else I choose to do so with some decency.

It's all about that. and I find it VERY appalling to see so many adults here trying to utterly defend their chosen lifestyle and have a hard time just to see that it can be perceived as disturbing or indecent when displayd in public areas.

I have never attacked your lifestyle as a general thing - I think that public stunts like the one I've encountered is morally wrong and doesn't go well with the broad society. that's all - and yet you feel personally attacked.

Another thing I've said and stand by it is that I don't find pictures of a 50+ year old out-of-shape man in a baby-doll outfit pleasing... But for what it's worth, I feel like I have the right to dislike something personally... It's like some people don't like watching porn... some like this, some find that gross or whatever...

when you're talking so big about acceptance and all that things (back when you're stationed in germany) - why not act the same here and now?

[Baby Bethany]

Eric,

I can't be bothered with long winded replies to this argument, not being funny, but heard it all before. But I would like to respond to your dig at DW.

You say above that carrying a "stuffed wolf and sucking on a binky as a comforter doesn't come over as strength" and "If you were really strong, you wouldn't need one" is a bit of a stupid comment. On that basis you are suggesting that no AB can be a strong person, unless they do it for sex only. And using that logic, it would mean that no DL can be a strong person unless they do it for sex, or need diapers for a medical condition.

What I'm saying is that if someone using a soft toy or binky for emotional comfort is a sign of mental/emotional weakness, then so is using a diaper for emotional comfort.

Beth

[Guest]

Witch,

I find it RUDE TOWARDS OTHER PEOPLE to shove them your "LOOK AT ME"-Style in their faces if asked or not. But Pissing me off, you might should try that in my area.

I don't have a "Look at me" style. I have a "I am me, and I like to be me" style. I only stand out because everyone else is so dead set on blending in, being a bunch of clones. If I lived on a block of white houses, I'm going to paint my house the same shade of purple I would have painted it if I lived on a block of multiple colored houses. Not because I want people to stare at my house, but because I like purple. Like wise, I'm not dressed the way I'm dressed etc because I want to shout "FUCKING LOOK AT ME", I dress in certain ways and carry particular items as an expression of who I am, or simply because I like certain things. For example, my cell phone isn't a statement, I just like making calls. Like wise, my pacifier really isn't a statement, I just like sucking on it.

comfort items - it doesn't matter what it is to you - you push it onto others, willing or not, you have obviously never heard of moderation or decency. and that, that is truly SAD... it's not more, it's sad. it's nothing rebellious or "great" or "strong"... it's simply a very egoistic, intolerant, fucked up way to go through life... it's not always only about YOU... as long as you live within a society it's never just "about you". a bit of decency and RESPECT towards the feelings of others wouldn't hurt you.

What about all the people comforted by a cigarette? I have to look at them carrying cigarettes, talking about cigarettes, and OMG SMOKING cigarettes. Ok, so why is my pacifier so different? My pacifier isn't going to cause non-participants lung cancer, or even any immediate unpleasant smells or allergies.

I'm not asking the public to come up and interact with me as a toddler, or change me, or anything.

If my diaper smells, I go change it instead of making the public smell it.

I change when wet to avoid leaking on public furniture.

Don't tell me I'm not respecting others.

Strong, eh? you think you're mighty strong, don't ya?

Carrying around a stuffed wolf and sucking on a binky as a comforter doesn't really come over as "strength"...

and just being an egoistic, respect-less human being doesn't mean you're strong.

My strength is in my "live and let live" attitude. I don't care what others do unless thay are harming people against their will. (I add "against their will" because if somebody enjoys being hit in the face, who am I to say they shouldn't be hit in the face)

About the quite family neighborhood... sorry, but again your attitude shows not the slightest amount of tolerance, decency and respect.

I'm just me. Not even going near their children.

[Guest]

And last but not least, who the fuck do you think you are, that you have the right to criticize parents on their moral standard as long as they don't harm their children?

I didn't criticize their moral standards. I simply said that if those moral standards can be erased by simply seeing me walk by, then they did a lousy job of teaching those standards.

If my walking by can erase something, it wasn't written there very well.

This includes that I moderate my actions and try not to offend someone who clearly has done nothing to "deserve" it. That includes, that if I go out and choose to wear diapers, I do so in a decent way without forcing strangers to "face" it.

I do moderate. Trust me, I'm much more childish at home.

As far as forcing the public to face things... First off, part of "public" is running in to things you don't agree with. I think the "thug" way of dressing, with 4 inches of boxers showing, is absolutely ridiculous, but I would NEVER ask them to go home or dress differently. If I hate it so much, I can avoid them. Likewise, if they don't like my childish style of dress, they can avoid me. As far as the amount of skin, even just a diaper and shirt would cover more than some of the outfits I've seen in public, and I'm not talking about swimwear! I've seen mini skirts so short, you can see 2 inches of butt, and they only have a thong on that butt.

It astounds me to see how far your own little intolerance towards the people around you goes.

Did you ever think that the other ones who never mentioned anything to you, just had the decency to keep their thoughts to themselves? it doesn't necessarily mean that they approved of your actions.

But go on, throughout life like this and give a shit...

it's about RESPECT towards your surroundings and not to be so god damn "pushy" just because you life a so called alternative lifestyle.

Do you think the way of getting acceptance is by disrespecting the feelings of others, by shoving up your "alternative lifestyle" on strangers?

I choose to express myself. I don't force anybody to do anything in regards to how I express myself.

With a pacifier in my mouth, I've had people come up and chew me out about the religious symbol around my neck. So, no, I don't really think they ALL keep to themselves.

I've had people come up and praise me for it. "Cute" is something I get a lot. I've had children approach and want to hug my wolf, and the parent was fine with it.

I'm not intolerant of others, I just refuse to be like everyone else. I'm going to be me. If what/how/who I am becomes the norm, and everyone is in diapers with a pacifier, I'll still be me with the same pacifier. I am me regardless of what society is doing around me. I'm not publicly masturbating, and I have whatever bits I've got more covered than most people.

I'm not handing my bottle to a stranger and asking them to get me juice, and only people I know ever get asked to hold my wolf if I need 2 hands for a minute.

Expressing myself on my own person is not shoving anything on anybody. It's not like when people turn away (which I've NEVER had happen), I walk out in front of whatever direction they turned to... or following individuals around. I'm keeping to myself for the most part, and I interact as nessesary. If somebody is enjoying my presence, I may stick around.

Likewise, if somebody thinks Paganism is "wrong", I'm not going to follow them and make them look at my pentacle. However, no fucking way will I take it off because they don't want to see a pentacle! Just the same, I wouldn't expect somebody else to take their cross off for my sake.

[Guest]

I wish I could just be ME, no matter where I am.

Now, I am not expecting to be allowed to act up in public ("make a scene").

Most of us AB's just want to be ourselves. No sex, no public indecency, no harassing people.

But as I've said, the AB's like myself that aren't looking to make a scene. We just want to be able to express ourselves in peace, which does no harm to the general public. Seeing someone using a paci or dressing in babyish clothes like overalls or a "little girl"-ish dress will not harm anyone unless they CHOOSE to be harmed by it.

It's not like we're going off and asking random strangers "Goo goo gaa gaa, i a baby, will you change my diaper?" .

Why is that sooooooo wrong?

~ Moogle

This is exactly what I strive to do with all aspects of my life, except for my sex life.

AB isn't part of my sex life. How ever, the fact that I get off on having my hair pulled is... Which is why I ask partners not to publicly pull on my hair, cause if they do it too hard, I can't keep quiet.

See the difference?

When a guy walks down the street in his birthday suit, he gets arrested (much like your development) for indecent exposure. The same would happen if a couple cared to have sex in public, that's why doing so is AGAINST THE LAW!! However dressing as an AB is NOT!!

He has broken NO LAW of indecency, okay?

Laws don't drive my sense of right and wrong.

I don't avoid killing people because I'll get arrested, I don't kill people because it's wrong to kill people. If killing people became legal, I still would not go around shooting the place up.

Likewise, if sucking on my pacifier became illegal, there's nothing wrong about it, so I would continue to suck on it.

What I have to say Eric, is that I find you to be far too intolerant to call yourself tolerant, and I've found a lot of self rightious people in my life, most of them RIGHT THINKERS. Most of them shoving their religions or prediguesses in my face, well sir I don't like it, not at all.

I agree. Somebody coming up and telling me I'm disgusting or an abomination for any of various reasons (trans, les, pagan, even vegan. Never yet for AB tho) is pushing themselves on me. However, I don't see how enjoying my pacifier is pushing anything on anybody. It's not like I ran up to them and said "OMG, you've got to try this! Try it.... TRY it.... TRY IT!"

By the way, can ANYONE tell me what imho means?

IMHO means In My Humble Opinion

[Guest]

Eric,

I can't be bothered with long winded replies to this argument, not being funny, but heard it all before. But I would like to respond to your dig at DW.

You say above that carrying a "stuffed wolf and sucking on a binky as a comforter doesn't come over as strength" and "If you were really strong, you wouldn't need one" is a bit of a stupid comment. On that basis you are suggesting that no AB can be a strong person, unless they do it for sex only. And using that logic, it would mean that no DL can be a strong person unless they do it for sex, or need diapers for a medical condition.

What I'm saying is that if someone using a soft toy or binky for emotional comfort is a sign of mental/emotional weakness, then so is using a diaper for emotional comfort.

Beth

My take on it is...

The fact that I've ACCEPTED my use of a pacifier and my beloved Floppy (stuffed wolf) is my show of strength. I have the strength to be myself, to be different, to not be another Jane Smith in the crowd.

I'm also strong enough that somebody who hates people being different unless they do it in some closed room deep within their own property and not in front of anyone, isn't going to cause me any tears.

[Huggie]

WOW this is a thread with alot of "hotzbah" - I am DL w/ mild AB tendancies but respect each totally in their own category. I have DL friends and AB friends. I can't stand religious ppl forcing their holy life on me criticizing everything I do putting me on a guilt trip, I live life as a good person. Thus a person running the streets in full blown AB gear I feel is not appropriate, there is a time and a place. We are in a civilized world "for the most" part. Respect and courtesy should prevail.

Personally speaking to Eric and Repaid...you both do a great job keeping these boards filled with interesting info...lets agree to disagree at times. You both rock!

Huggie

"with my head down I have had sex in my diaper many times and friggin loved it"

[Lost_Little_Sarah]

Witch,

Heck, look I find it RUDE TOWARDS OTHER PEOPLE to shove them your "LOOK AT ME"-Style in their faces if asked or not.

a bit of decency and RESPECT towards the feelings of others wouldn't hurt you.

and i find it extremely rude that those not comfortable with it would tell those of us like myself to just hide who we are and not be ourselves and continue to try to force their "normalacy" and "Social rules" upon us.

I will have respect towards those types as soon as they start to have respect for people like myself and quit calling me things like fag and queer and other such derogatory terms simply becuase i was born with a birth defect.

and another thing this isnt my alternative lifestyle this happens to be the only lifestyle i have and so to tell me to shut up about it is to tell me to be fake and those who are not willing to be themselves are the ones with the true problems.

[Baby Bethany]

My take on it is...

The fact that I've ACCEPTED my use of a pacifier and my beloved Floppy (stuffed wolf) is my show of strength. I have the strength to be myself, to be different, to not be another Jane Smith in the crowd.

I'm also strong enough that somebody who hates people being different unless they do it in some closed room deep within their own property and not in front of anyone, isn't going to cause me any tears.

I agree that it requires more inner strength to be yourself than a fake. For instance, if a Goth walks down the street you see people taking the piss, but I always think that the Goth has more dignity than the group of guys pointing, because the Goth is being the person 'they' want to be and the pointer is being the person his 'mates' want him to be.

I'm not saying that is always the case, but I have noticed that the guys who mock people with alternative lifestyles are usually wearing the same trainers (sneakers) same cap, same jacket, same hair and listen to the same music as the six mates they have with them.

Whilst we are on the subject of mental strength, It's known that the AB community has an unusually high percentage of highly qualified professionals. So where did we get all those college degrees and BA's? As a free gift in a packet of corn flakes perhaps!

Beth

[Guest]

I agree that it requires more inner strength to be yourself than a fake. For instance, if a Goth walks down the street you see people taking the piss, but I always think that the Goth has more dignity than the group of guys pointing, because the Goth is being the person 'they' want to be and the pointer is being the person his 'mates' want him to be.

I'm not saying that is always the case, but I have noticed that the guys who mock people with alternative lifestyles are usually wearing the same trainers (sneakers) same cap, same jacket, same hair and listen to the same music as the six mates they have with them.

Whilst we are on the subject of mental strength, It's known that the AB community has an unusually high percentage of highly qualified professionals. So where did we get all those college degrees and BA's? As a free gift in a packet of corn flakes perhaps!

Beth

I'd be loligoth if I could afford it. (Lolitgoth = Gothic Lolita)

So, I go more practical and just live for the cuteness. I love all things cute.

It's why I can't help watching kids play, or a kitten chew on a dog's ear, and why I can't walk past Sanrio anything without stopping. Cute and AB fit nicely, and that's what I am. I wish I had this level of courage years ago. I wouldn't be struggling just to get my transition started. I'd have probably gone to college. I might be making $20+ an hour.

Maybe I'd have learned the "uncool" violin, or tried ballet.

Fitting in was a cage, and one day I found my lock pick!

So now I'm just short of 25 carrying around a stuffed wolf and wearing Hello Kitty earrings. Anybody who doesn't like it can go die for all I care. "But other women don't dress like that!" my mom says... Well sorry mom, I'm not other women, I'm THIS GIRL, and she's a freak!

[Eric D]

DW,

a few notes, and I'll keep this short as I'm rather tired after a loong day working hard and looking forward to some nice sleep...

so forgive me if this post lacks my usual depth

If someone is truly strong he/she does not need to say it out loud... either you're strong and then it's being naturally recognized or you aren't and then you either accept it or say whatever you want like repeating how strong you're supposed to be.

but that's another topic, I don't want to pick on you particularily - you've indulged in this debate on a various levels and I have gone along.

The statement like "Anybody who doesn't like it can go die for all I care" is one of the things I find sad. it's not what strength is all about. And as long as you choose (and it is your choice, believe me) to live within a society, it is not only about you.

I don't hate people who are different, you got that all wrong - I don't have much respect for those who take things a bit too far when it comes to public stunts.

I haven't seen you and how you walk around, I will not judge YOU - I was reffering to a sighting I had made and that sighting was something I percieved as rather WRONG. But that guy was not you... he was most likely not anyone of the forumites here (most likely).

Sarah,

I never called you or anyone else a fag, a queer or anything like that - I'm not much into name calling at all... so don't blame me instead of those who called you that.

Beth,

what has IQ or professional-achievment got to do with any of this here?

Huggie,

Thank you... some people here seem to get what I try to make clear...

[Guest]

The statement like "Anybody who doesn't like it can go die for all I care" is one of the things I find sad. it's not what strength is all about. And as long as you choose (and it is your choice, believe me) to live within a society, it is not only about you.

I don't hate people who are different, you got that all wrong - I don't have much respect for those who take things a bit too far when it comes to public stunts.

I haven't seen you and how you walk around, I will not judge YOU - I was reffering to a sighting I had made and that sighting was something I percieved as rather WRONG. But that guy was not you... he was most likely not anyone of the forumites here (most likely).

I never said it's all about me. However, I can only be me, the same as the dude with a mohawk can only be him, and the goth chick can only be her. I'm not going to hide myself to make others happy. What makes me me isn't harming anybody. It doesn't make me less able to drive safe, or give others cancer, or expose people to disease (I keep myself clean!).

Now, if that guy is happy going out like that, then he should be able to. He's covered up enough, more than some of my co-workers at my last job.

Sarah,

I never called you or anyone else a fag, a queer or anything like that - I'm not much into name calling at all... so don't blame me instead of those who called you that.

I'm pretty sure she's referring to the fact that this whole AB go home crap is just another case of "hide who you are, and be one of us, or else!".

When I wasn't passing well, I'd get told that I'm an abomination, I should be the man I was born, or at least keep my girl "side" in the closet behind closed doors.

Well, now I've got people, 99% of whom are here on Daily Diapers, saying I should be the grown up I grew up to be, or at least keep my child "side" in the closet behind closed doors.

So, instead of fag, I'm getting called sicko.

I was physically attacked twice in 07 for not being what society wants. Did I stop being me? Fuck no! I held my swollen chin high, and limped with a sense of pride knowing I'm strong enough to take this crap and keep being myself.

Regardless of which aspect I'm being attacked or harassed or insulted for, be it the fact that I'm a girl born in a boy body, or that I'm attached to my stuffed wolf and hate the potty... I will be me no matter what you or anybody else does to me.

Threaten to kill me, and I'd still be me.

As far as you insisting saying I have strength is a sign of weakness.

Lol, no. I know where my strengths and weaknesses are. Being myself is a strength I pride myself in. One of my weaknesses is when my composure runs out and I resort to insults and profanity, although, that's been improving.

[Jay-in-Pampers]

I would like to give you my take on DL's. I have been to more than 50 gatherings of AB's and DL's. Quite more than most..perhaps not as many as others. The simple fact is on my Take DL's are just plain RUDE!. Take this as I do your comments. I could care less why you wear you just do as any AB/DL. 45 partys out of 50 the DL's have done nothing to contribute..they alienate themselves. Choose not to involve themselves before any baby games or whatever even start. They have been so retarded as to come up and try to steal my Girlfriend /Mommys or God Forbid my Wife/Mommy from me at the same Party!!!

Sounds like you're going to the wrong parties with the wrong people.

In addition to the dozens of parties I've attended, I've hosted around 40 myself over the past few years. Good mix of ABs, and DLs, male, female, young and old... Sometimes in groups of 30 or more.

I've NEVER experienced any of what you've suggested. Considering you have no problem calling people "retarded", maybe the issue lies from within.

As for the "ABDL public spectacle" debate, I think it is poor taste. It might not be illegal to go gallivanting about in public in AB garb, but I do think doing so says a lot about one's lack of common sense, and respect for others.

[gweg]

And now I ask you (and anyone else who thinks that AB was OK with his actions): WHY Should ABs be EXCLUDED from basic social rules?

And who are you to decide what the social rules are for the neighborhood? As long as the fellow is covering his rear and or sexual organs than he is within the letter of the law. His social obligation has been met. If you take his attire and decide to go confront him with violence then you are against the social rules of this country and will or at least should be punished for that behavior. Personally I would look at him and go about my my business... Heck maybe even go talk to him. I also feel maybe you should go read the Phoenix articles to learn the difference between right and wrong...

[gweg]

About dressing as an ab not being against any law - then tell me why has there been a police hunt for some dude whilst back going around at night in nothing but his diaper? if dressing up as an AB is ok than it surly is ok to walk around in a DL outfit only? eh?

obviously a good number of people including the police thought so otherwise.

but that's a different story...

They stopped looking for the guy too I assume as nothing more was said... it may be that some one turned him in for indecency and it took the DA's office to tell the cops they can't just arrest him if he is covering his/her private areas.

[tauschung]

I really honestly think that this isn't going anywhere.

That person was wrong. Not any more wrong than someone streaking for erotic pleasure. But, I guess the gross out factor is a bit more.

Does this mean I hate AB's? No. But, I do think that something should be done with that individual.

I wish people wouldn't get so...emotionally charged. Its the internet. People. Get a grip, please.