Property Taxes are BS

[spark]

15 hours ago, Nat said:

Now I don't think anyone is going to drive 14 miles or 25 miles into Oregon just to shop here due to the cost of gas. It's just not worth it. 

I have some friends that live on the Washington side of the border.   At least one of them is working in Portland, so I wonder how they deal with shopping.  Interestingly enough, there are very large grocery stores on the Swedish/Norwegian border and Norwegian is the primary language at those stores (Norwegians can understand Swedish, but not read it- which is the opposite of Danish).   We had a family reunion in Norway, and my Norwegian relatives made the trip to Sweden (about 1 1/2) to get the groceries, but that's not their typical outing.

In general, it's best to buy gas at the Oregon border (at least from the south), which used to bother me because you can't pump your own gas in Oregon.

[Nat]

If you work in Oregon, I think it's fine to shop down there too before coming home from work. You kill two birds with one stone. Same as if you are at 1/4 of a tank, fill it up down here. My family used to come into Portland for Costco because Vancouver didn't have one. If a Washingtonian wants to go to IKEA, they will go into Portland, I see nothing wrong with it. I can remember the big hype when it first opened here. Even my work had it marked on their calendar for its grand opening. I of course never went there until 3 years after it opened. Of course men in our family hate it lol. I like to crack jokes about men not going to IKEA. 

[Cruiser 03]

I have some friends that live on the Washington side of the border.   At least one of them is working in Portland, so I wonder how they deal with shopping.  Interestingly enough, there are very large grocery stores on the Swedish/Norwegian border and Norwegian is the primary language at those stores (Norwegians can understand Swedish, but not read it- which is the opposite of Danish).   We had a family reunion in Norway, and my Norwegian relatives made the trip to Sweden (about 1 1/2) to get the groceries, but that's not their typical outing.
In general, it's best to buy gas at the Oregon border (at least from the south), which used to bother me because you can't pump your own gas in Oregon.

I am in one of those squeeze plays , we have crazy taxes and lower wages ,however get good deals on groceries and clothes ,so many people drive to nearby states for gas and employment ,every state around us has a higher minimum wage then we do ,and having the second highest gas tax in the country is no honor,and despite claims of boundless economic prosperity ,it aint happening we just had our 3Rd volunteer fire department close ,been around 125 years ,yet couldnt afford any longer to pay for needed maintenance and pump certifications on apparatus ,not to mention people are working harder & longer for less money ,leaving them little oppooryunity to volunteer .

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If you work in Oregon, I think it's fine to shop down there too before coming home from work. You kill two birds with one stone. Same as if you are at 1/4 of a tank, fill it up down here. My family used to come into Portland for Costco because Vancouver didn't have one. If a Washingtonian wants to go to IKEA, they will go into Portland, I see nothing wrong with it. I can remember the big hype when it first opened here. Even my work had it marked on their calendar for its grand opening. I of course never went there until 3 years after it opened. Of course men in our family hate it lol. I like to crack jokes about men not going to IKEA. 

Get 50 orders of Swedish meatballs and just take the whole Lingonberry jelly supply and send it here ! We used to go to the one in N.J ,I liked the cafeteria ,my mom liked the furniture ,we went our own ways and she'd meet me back in the cafeteria when she was done . The cafeteria is very good for the low cost .

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[spark]

3 hours ago, Nat said:

Same as if you are at 1/4 of a tank, fill it up down here.

If you are a resident in Singapore, you aren't allowed to drive into Malaysia without a full-tank of gas.   I'm not sure if they charge you if you have a full-tank of gas while driving in from Malaysia.   I'm pretty sure they have laws about bringing in new goods into Singapore from Malaysia

 

1 hour ago, Cruiser 03 said:

Get 50 orders of Swedish meatballs and just take the whole Lingonberry jelly supply and send it here ! We used to go to the one in N.J ,I liked the cafeteria ,my mom liked the furniture ,we went our own ways and she'd meet me back in the cafeteria when she was done . The cafeteria is very good for the low cost .

That cafeteria is a good deal.  I get frustrated with the way you are forced to walk through an IKEA (I purposely walk against the grain), but the store is good for what it is.

[Crinklz Kat]

On 1/18/2020 at 12:47 AM, Nat said:

Now I don't think anyone is going to drive 14 miles or 25 miles into Oregon just to shop here due to the cost of gas. It's just not worth it. 

Ah, but some will!   The "outlet" strips in Lancaster County (PA) can garner huge turnouts from NY, NJ and other places farther north east - by the busloads!  Why?  No sales tax on clothing in the state of PA. 

[Cruiser 03]

Ah, but some will!   The "outlet" strips in Lancaster County (PA) can garner huge turnouts from NY, NJ and other places farther north east - by the busloads!  Why?  No sales tax on clothing in the state of PA. 

We get every senior citizen with a pulse down from Canada for the holidays shopping .they go to top of Peach street and shop there way down ,but honestly locals avoid Peach street Jam as much as possible ,if your on a coach with entertainment probably not bad ,but to drive ,i think i would rather go to the dentist without a diaper .

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[foreverdl]

On 1/4/2020 at 9:49 AM, Menaiya said:

I don't understand property taxes except as a way to generate revenue. its the gift that keeps on giving.  The only property taxes I pay are my vehicle as I rent.

If you think you're not paying property tax because you rent, You are still paying taxes, its included in the rent. Otherwise the home or appt owner would not be making any money.

You may have a tax deduction when you file income tax. A renter credit that may cover some of the property tax, in Ca I think its $120-150. We pay pretty High property taxes in Calif, and also have very bad roads and I think we pay the highest Gas tax in the country its somewhere around a $1 a gallon. 

[rusty pins]

A little off the track, but be glad you don't drive a car and live in Michigan!  The insurance rates are the highest in the country, and I don't just mean $20 higher.  I'm talking hundreds of dollars higher than any other state due to a stupid law that requires every driver to have a specific high amount for medical coverage weather you plow into someone or they plow into you and put you in the hospital, weather you have medical insurance or not.  Yes, I agree that property taxes are a necessity to pay garbage pick up (although in some areas people have to pay to the garbage company and not their city or township), police, fire, etc.  Sometimes I do question the amount we are all taxed though.

[Clr224]

If you were to see your property tax bill itemized out ( we do here), the majority of property taxes pay for the school system.  The other items you mentioned are a small portion of the total. As far a requiring people to have medical insurance, I think it’s a good idea. Too often many people don’t think they need insurance because they are young and healthy.  However, if they do experience a medical emergency and they can’t pay for the help they need, doctors and hospitals are required to provide the medical services and then end up eating the cost. In rural areas, particularly, the hospitals are going bankrupt.

[square_duck]

Over all, and this might sound silly, but I don't mind property taxes.....what bugs the hell out of me is the ABUSE and or misuse of the tax funds collected!!! I know stuff and services need to be paid for somehow, but diverting funds for non related things...then whining that " there isn't enough money" blah blah blah is what pisses me off. Seeing and hearing the BS and abuse of the " system" that is supposed to benefit everyone who pays into it....... But it does'nt....... really bugs me. It's the corruption and brainless waste and abuse that needs to be corrected.  Ugh!

[foreverdl]

22 hours ago, rusty pins said:

A little off the track, but be glad you don't drive a car and live in Michigan!  The insurance rates are the highest in the country, and I don't just mean $20 higher.  I'm talking hundreds of dollars higher than any other state due to a stupid law that requires every driver to have a specific high amount for medical coverage weather you plow into someone or they plow into you and put you in the hospital, weather you have medical insurance or not.  Yes, I agree that property taxes are a necessity to pay garbage pick up (although in some areas people have to pay to the garbage company and not their city or township), police, fire, etc.  Sometimes I do question the amount we are all taxed though.

I don't see how any state can have higher car insurance than Calif. it would shock me if it were true. We have the most uninsured drivers of any state and that means we, the honest ones pay for the stupid people because we have to pay uninsured motorist so we can pay for all of them that think they don't need lic or ins, , and they are better than us so they won't get into an accident and if they do they just  hit and run, so we pick up the bill. As far as the medical part of car ins, I think its smart to have the highest amount the ins company will offer and I can afford, because if the uninsured person causes the wreck you can bet I will be paying all there medical bills for a long time.

[Nat]

22 hours ago, Clr224 said:

If you were to see your property tax bill itemized out ( we do here), the majority of property taxes pay for the school system.  The other items you mentioned are a small portion of the total. As far a requiring people to have medical insurance, I think it’s a good idea. Too often many people don’t think they need insurance because they are young and healthy.  However, if they do experience a medical emergency and they can’t pay for the help they need, doctors and hospitals are required to provide the medical services and then end up eating the cost. In rural areas, particularly, the hospitals are going bankrupt.

 

 

People shouldn't have to pay hundreds a month for medical insurance. Maybe if it weren't so expensive, then more people would have it. If all our taxes went towards that too, then everyone would have it. We pay for libraries and police stations and public schools, the roads, etc. so why not medical? 

4 hours ago, foreverdl said:

I don't see how any state can have higher car insurance than Calif. it would shock me if it were true. We have the most uninsured drivers of any state and that means we, the honest ones pay for the stupid people because we have to pay uninsured motorist so we can pay for all of them that think they don't need lic or ins, , and they are better than us so they won't get into an accident and if they do they just  hit and run, so we pick up the bill. As far as the medical part of car ins, I think its smart to have the highest amount the ins company will offer and I can afford, because if the uninsured person causes the wreck you can bet I will be paying all there medical bills for a long time.

I pay nearly $700 every six months for mine because some idiot hit me because he didn't yield to me and instead of waiting in the center lane to get on the road, he cutted over 3 lanes and into mine from a parking lot and he expected me to stop. Now I get nervous every time I see a car pulling onto the road because I don't know if they are staying in that lane or going to cut into mine. Plus I have full coverage because people don't always have car insurance. To afford car insurance, we went all month not doing anything. No eating out, no buying anything, nothing except for groceries and stuff we need. I even waited till I got paid to have enough for it and have $200 left over again after car insurance and I paid online because no way would my payment have been received in time by mail. 

[foreverdl]

3 hours ago, Nat said:

 

 

People shouldn't have to pay hundreds a month for medical insurance. Maybe if it weren't so expensive, then more people would have it. If all our taxes went towards that too, then everyone would have it. We pay for libraries and police stations and public schools, the roads, etc. so why not medical? 

I pay nearly $700 every six months for mine because some idiot hit me because he didn't yield to me and instead of waiting in the center lane to get on the road, he cutted over 3 lanes and into mine from a parking lot and he expected me to stop. Now I get nervous every time I see a car pulling onto the road because I don't know if they are staying in that lane or going to cut into mine. Plus I have full coverage because people don't always have car insurance. To afford car insurance, we went all month not doing anything. No eating out, no buying anything, nothing except for groceries and stuff we need. I even waited till I got paid to have enough for it and have $200 left over again after car insurance and I paid online because no way would my payment have been received in time by mail. 

WE do have 2 cars and a travel trailer, we pay about $200 a month for the 3. And the trailer is only $200 a yr out of that. so about $2200 a yr for 2 cars. we haven't had any accidents or claims for probably 5 yrs

[rusty pins]

11 hours ago, foreverdl said:

I don't see how any state can have higher car insurance than Calif. it would shock me if it were true. We have the most uninsured drivers of any state and that means we, the honest ones pay for the stupid people because we have to pay uninsured motorist so we can pay for all of them that think they don't need lic or ins, , and they are better than us so they won't get into an accident and if they do they just  hit and run, so we pick up the bill. As far as the medical part of car ins, I think its smart to have the highest amount the ins company will offer and I can afford, because if the uninsured person causes the wreck you can bet I will be paying all there medical bills for a long time.

Be prepared to be shocked then!  It's absolutely true about Michigan car insurance and has been for years.  See this information:  https://www.insure.com/car-insurance/car-insurance-rates.html  Just a small bit from the website: 

"Michigan is the most expensive state for car insurance for the sixth consecutive year.  The Wolverine State is in a league of its own when it comes to car insurance with an average annual premium that is $313 higher than that of Louisiana, which ranked second. A Michigan car insurance policy averages $2,611, which is almost 80 percent higher than the national average of $1,457".  This means your $2,200 cost for your two cars and trailer in California would cost you over $5,000 annually in Michigan.

I also find a problem with property taxes and school.  Sure, I went to school but a lot of the programs I was in like music and sports are funded by the students and their fund raisers.  When I was in music, we had spaghetti dinners, sold candles, tumblers, candy and other things door to door to pay for the music, uniforms and what we needed.  People always say, "Cut the band and choir if you need money!"  They don't realize that the only thing the school pays for is the instructor's salary!  Music, band instruments and uniforms are all paid for by student fundraisers.  Likewise, ticket sales for the football and basketball games pay for equipment and uniforms.  With all that, what gets me is a school never being satisfied.  They always want more even in a recession where people are struggling.  One school builds a new field house, the nearby one has to build one bigger!  One remodels the stadium and it's rival tears down their's and builds a bigger brand new one!  Then when a millage increase is voted down (a millage increase that they have on the ballot each and every year), they cry foul and say they will have to cut teachers, increase classroom sizes and all.  Bull S---!  The millage's they ask for are never for classroom improvements but always for sports upgrades.  People get tired of being asked to go to the table for more funds each and every year for schools.  Eventually we tax payers say, "Enough is enough!"  They always want more!

[Clr224]

7 hours ago, Nat said:

People shouldn't have to pay hundreds a month for medical insurance. Maybe if it weren't so expensive, then more people would have it. If all our taxes went towards that too, then everyone would have it. We pay for libraries and police stations and public schools, the roads, etc. so why not medical? 

Not a bad idea.  How much are you willing to add to your tax bill to pay for medical costs?  This is done in much of the world, but their taxes are 2-3 times the percentage we pay. Also consider who would be paying.  Will the government simply pay whatever amount the doctor or hospital bills?  Will they pay for any and all procedures performed or will someone say “no”, “that medical service is too costly or is unnecessary.”  Today, people die because they can’t afford the medical services they need.  Hospitals go bankrupt because people can’t afford for the medical services provided. Yet all of us happily vote for the politicians who claim we can have first class medical care and lower taxes, too.

[Cruiser 03]

Be prepared to be shocked then!  It's absolutely true about Michigan car insurance and has been for years.  See this information:  https://www.insure.com/car-insurance/car-insurance-rates.html  Just a small bit from the website: 
"Michigan is the most expensive state for car insurance for the sixth consecutive year.  The Wolverine State is in a league of its own when it comes to car insurance with an average annual premium that is $313 higher than that of Louisiana, which ranked second. A Michigan car insurance policy averages $2,611, which is almost 80 percent higher than the national average of $1,457".  This means your $2,200 cost for your two cars and trailer in California would cost you over $5,000 annually in Michigan.
I also find a problem with property taxes and school.  Sure, I went to school but a lot of the programs I was in like music and sports are funded by the students and their fund raisers.  When I was in music, we had spaghetti dinners, sold candles, tumblers, candy and other things door to door to pay for the music, uniforms and what we needed.  People always say, "Cut the band and choir if you need money!"  They don't realize that the only thing the school pays for is the instructor's salary!  Music, band instruments and uniforms are all paid for by student fundraisers.  Likewise, ticket sales for the football and basketball games pay for equipment and uniforms.  With all that, what gets me is a school never being satisfied.  They always want more even in a recession where people are struggling.  One school builds a new field house, the nearby one has to build one bigger!  One remodels the stadium and it's rival tears down their's and builds a bigger brand new one!  Then when a millage increase is voted down (a millage increase that they have on the ballot each and every year), they cry foul and say they will have to cut teachers, increase classroom sizes and all.  Bull S---!  The millage's they ask for are never for classroom improvements but always for sports upgrades.  People get tired of being asked to go to the table for more funds each and every year for schools.  Eventually we tax payers say, "Enough is enough!"  They always want more!

Our schools are literaly falling apart , the SOE devos was touring one and narrowly avoided injury , then denied the school district request for emergency federal funds to repair the roof and ceiling.

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[foreverdl]

12 hours ago, rusty pins said:

Be prepared to be shocked then!  It's absolutely true about Michigan car insurance and has been for years.  See this information:  https://www.insure.com/car-insurance/car-insurance-rates.html  Just a small bit from the website: 

"Michigan is the most expensive state for car insurance for the sixth consecutive year.  The Wolverine State is in a league of its own when it comes to car insurance with an average annual premium that is $313 higher than that of Louisiana, which ranked second. A Michigan car insurance policy averages $2,611, which is almost 80 percent higher than the national average of $1,457".  This means your $2,200 cost for your two cars and trailer in California would cost you over $5,000 annually in Michigan.

I also find a problem with property taxes and school.  Sure, I went to school but a lot of the programs I was in like music and sports are funded by the students and their fund raisers.  When I was in music, we had spaghetti dinners, sold candles, tumblers, candy and other things door to door to pay for the music, uniforms and what we needed.  People always say, "Cut the band and choir if you need money!"  They don't realize that the only thing the school pays for is the instructor's salary!  Music, band instruments and uniforms are all paid for by student fundraisers.  Likewise, ticket sales for the football and basketball games pay for equipment and uniforms.  With all that, what gets me is a school never being satisfied.  They always want more even in a recession where people are struggling.  One school builds a new field house, the nearby one has to build one bigger!  One remodels the stadium and it's rival tears down their's and builds a bigger brand new one!  Then when a millage increase is voted down (a millage increase that they have on the ballot each and every year), they cry foul and say they will have to cut teachers, increase classroom sizes and all.  Bull S---!  The millage's they ask for are never for classroom improvements but always for sports upgrades.  People get tired of being asked to go to the table for more funds each and every year for schools.  Eventually we tax payers say, "Enough is enough!"  They always want more!

I don't get it, why car ins is sooo high? what's the reason ? car theft? Snow? We have what I thought was the worst drivers ever.  I can't imagine living in the kind of weather you have and then paying so much for car ins. I grew up in Ohio, and car ins was not bad. Of course I moved west 40 yrs ago. I guess if I ever move out of state again,, I will check the car and property ins First.,, and property taxes. I have family moving to Montana in a yr. I wonder what car ins is like there?

[rusty pins]

13 hours ago, foreverdl said:

I don't get it, why car ins is sooo high? what's the reason ? car theft? Snow? We have what I thought was the worst drivers ever.  I can't imagine living in the kind of weather you have and then paying so much for car ins. I grew up in Ohio, and car ins was not bad. Of course I moved west 40 yrs ago. I guess if I ever move out of state again,, I will check the car and property ins First.,, and property taxes. I have family moving to Montana in a yr. I wonder what car ins is like there?

In Michigan it has been law (no fault insurance) that everyone has to carry unlimited medical insurance, also known as PIP (personal injury protection) on their auto insurance in case either someone hits you or you hit them. Many states have a choice that consumers can chose for the amount of PIP and some don't even require your policy to have PIP, but not Michigan.  In this state it's not an option and you must carry unlimited coverage.  All insurance in Michigan has to have unlimited PIP weather we like it or not.  https://www.mlive.com/news/2019/05/why-michigan-auto-insurance-costs-so-much-and-how-to-lower-it.html    Here are some highlights:

Michigan has the most expensive insurance because it has the most expensive benefits.  Michigan auto insurance has a unique and very expensive feature: Every policy includes unlimited medical coverage, also known as personal injury protection or PIP, for auto-accident victims.  If someone becomes a paraplegic or has serious brain damage that requires expensive lifetime care, it’s covered -- even when the cost runs into millions of dollars.  Only 12 states require PIP, and Michigan is the only state mandating unlimited coverage. New York ranks No. 2 in this category, and its mandated coverage is $50,000.

[WetDad]

My wife and I pay about $2700 every six months for 5 cars and two college-age drivers, plus the two of us.

[foreverdl]

10 hours ago, rusty pins said:

In Michigan it has been law (no fault insurance) that everyone has to carry unlimited medical insurance, also known as PIP (personal injury protection) on their auto insurance in case either someone hits you or you hit them. Many states have a choice that consumers can chose for the amount of PIP and some don't even require your policy to have PIP, but not Michigan.  In this state it's not an option and you must carry unlimited coverage.  All insurance in Michigan has to have unlimited PIP weather we like it or not.  https://www.mlive.com/news/2019/05/why-michigan-auto-insurance-costs-so-much-and-how-to-lower-it.html    Here are some highlights:

Michigan has the most expensive insurance because it has the most expensive benefits.  Michigan auto insurance has a unique and very expensive feature: Every policy includes unlimited medical coverage, also known as personal injury protection or PIP, for auto-accident victims.  If someone becomes a paraplegic or has serious brain damage that requires expensive lifetime care, it’s covered -- even when the cost runs into millions of dollars.  Only 12 states require PIP, and Michigan is the only state mandating unlimited coverage. New York ranks No. 2 in this category, and its mandated coverage is $50,000.

Thanks I had no idea we are not the highest But I'm sure we will follow suit sooner or later, it will just be a reason for more Californians to drive without car ins.