ABDL? What is it? How do we define it?

[rosalie.bent]

Yeah, it is this topic again. Usually when this is brought up, everyone goes to their corners and yells at everyone else. It rarely occurs to most that relying on your own experience to project onto everyone else is probably going to end badly. That is at the very core of vicious political debates. But Dylan Lewis, ever the clever and methodical thinker, researcher and writer has written an article on this very question that makes a lot of sense.

It is a long article, but that is because he goes into it in depth. In essence, he distinguishes between our own PERSONAL definitions of self as ABDLs vs the COLLECTIVE definition and says that both are valid.

https://abdiscover.files.wordpress.com/2019/05/abdl-a-definition-1.pdf

It is well worth reading and I suggest you stick with it to the end.

[NewGuy20]

I must be late to such discussions. I wasn't aware that nailing down a precise definition of ABDL evoked so much angry debate and controversy among members of our community on DD. Though I suppose I have seen multiple people who expressed anger/outrage at ABDL people being compared to the LGBT community. Admittedly, the two communities are different and distinct and Mr. Lewis addresses that in this piece of writing, which was interesting in its own right. On a side note, I'll ask another question that might reveal how uninformed I am. Who is Mr. Lewis? Is he a user on DD? Does he have other non-fiction, ABDL publications beyond the one he mentioned? 

At the risk of sparking another heated debate, I think the below definition is sufficient to define everyone who is ABDL:

A strong emotional, sexual, or psychological fascination (to varying degrees) with inanimate objects typically associated with children or childhood - in particular: diapers. The list also includes but is not limited to bottles, pacifiers, onesies, cribs, high chairs, etc. 

I can only assume most if not everyone on DD would agree with the above definition, right? As to whether it is a kink, fetish, or identity; that obviously depends on the individual. Wearing and using diapers 24/7 might very well constitute an identity, as would living functionally as a baby. (There is an ABDL man on one episode of Dr. Phil who comes to mind but even that individual had a job that he worked outside of his ABDL home life.)

For me personally, its just one part of my identity. On a side note, I always thought it was interesting to see photos of ABDL individuals with extensive tattoos, body piercings, and/or facial hair. I have never seen a baby in my life that had any of these things. (Except maybe ear piercings?) I can only conclude that the ABDL individuals who had tattoos, body piercings, and/or facial hair have something ADDITIONAL in their identity and how they present that they are trying to express to the world, beyond their ABDL tendencies. And thats great! Who among us has only interests that are ABDL? Even as toddlers, we exhibit our own unique personalities, proclivities, temperament, and interests! Who among us could really say that we've never at least seen a movie or read a book that appealed to us - that we would never have been able to understand or appreciate as babies or, at the very least, a book/movie that wouldn't have been appropriate for an infant/toddler audience. 

A healthy and developed adult, biological male who identifies as female still has an ADULT brain. But what can be said about an adult who literally identifies as a baby? They might very well have personalities traits that appear immature and infantile but assuming that they do not have severe mental disabilities; they likely have an adult brain. And adult brains don't have all the same thoughts as the brains of babies. They couldn't possibly have such thoughts. Adult brains are simply more complex. That doesn't mean one can't say that ABDL is their personal identity. Of course, thats perfectly fine for one to say that. Its a free country, after all. However, to literally say that the brain of a one year old is inside an adult's body implies severe mental disability. And if you're not severely mentally disabled, you're having adult thoughts inside your fully developed adult brain. (But again, I'm not suggesting that people cannot or should not identify as ABDL!) 

As far as identity is concerned, we must all acknowledge that human identity - for anyone - is an incredibly complex subject. And our identities grow, evolve, and change with our life experiences. Along the way, we might tell lies to ourselves or others. And if you're lying to yourself, then you're likely incapable of being honest with others. I'm not suggesting ABDL is a choice, that we can magically rid our minds of this fetish, or that it goes away with time. I'm merely saying that defining human identity is vastly and infinitely more complex than defining ABDL. 

Edited May 9, 2019 by NewGuy20

[rosalie.bent]

37 minutes ago, NewGuy20 said:

I must be late to such discussions. I wasn't aware that nailing down a precise definition of ABDL evoked so much angry debate and controversy among members of our community on DD. Though I suppose I have seen multiple people who expressed anger/outrage at ABDL people being compared to the LGBT community. Admittedly, the two communities are different and distinct and Mr. Lewis addresses that in this piece of writing, which was interesting in its own right. On a side note, I'll ask another question that might reveal how uninformed I am. Who is Mr. Lewis? Is he a user on DD? Does he have other non-fiction, ABDL publications beyond the one he mentioned? 

At the risk of sparking another heated debate, I think the below definition is sufficient to define everyone who is ABDL:

A strong emotional, sexual, or psychological fascination (to varying degrees) with inanimate objects typically associated with children or childhood - in particular: diapers. The list also includes but is not limited to bottles, pacifiers, onesies, cribs, high chairs, etc. 

I can only assume most if not everyone on DD would agree with the above definition, right? As to whether it is a kink, fetish, or identity; that obviously depends on the individual. Wearing and using diapers 24/7 might very well constitute an identity, as would living functionally as a baby. (There is an ABDL man on one episode of Dr. Phil who comes to mind but even that individual had a job that he worked outside of his ABDL home life.)

For me personally, its just one part of my identity. On a side note, I always thought it was interesting to see photos of ABDL individuals with extensive tattoos, body piercings, and/or facial hair. I have never seen a baby in my life that had any of these things. (Except maybe ear piercings?) I can only conclude that the ABDL individuals who had tattoos, body piercings, and/or facial hair have something ADDITIONAL in their identity and how they present that they are trying to express to the world, beyond their ABDL tendencies. And thats great! Who among us has only interests that are ABDL? Even as toddlers, we exhibit our own unique personalities, proclivities, temperament, and interests! Who among us could really say that we've never at least seen a movie or read a book that appealed to us - that we would never have been able to understand or appreciate as babies or, at the very least, a book/movie that wouldn't have been appropriate for an infant/toddler audience. 

A healthy and developed adult, biological male who identifies as female still has an ADULT brain. But what can be said about an adult who literally identifies as a baby? They might very well have personalities traits that appear immature and infantile but assuming that they do not have severe mental disabilities; they likely have an adult brain. And adult brains don't have all the same thoughts as the brains of babies. They couldn't possibly have such thoughts. Adult brains are simply more complex. That doesn't mean one can't say that ABDL is their personal identity. Of course, thats perfectly fine for one to say that. Its a free country, after all. However, to literally say that the brain of a one year old is inside an adult's body implies severe mental disability. And if you're not severely mentally disabled, you're having adult thoughts inside your fully developed adult brain. (But again, I'm not suggesting that people cannot or should not identify as ABDL!) 

As far as identity is concerned, we must all acknowledge that human identity - for anyone - is an incredibly complex subject. And our identities grow, evolve, and change with our life experiences. Along the way, we might tell lies to ourselves or others. And if you're lying to yourself, then you're likely incapable of being honest with others. I'm not suggesting ABDL is a choice, that we can magically rid our minds of this fetish, or that it goes away with time. I'm merely saying that defining human identity is vastly and infinitely more complex than defining ABDL. 

A very rational and meaningful post. Yes, human identity is VERY complex. I will give you the URL to Dylan Lewis' 4 books on the subject of Adult Baby Identity. He has also written a book about his own growing up and two wonderful fiction books.

https://abdiscovery.com.au/dylan-lewis/

 

[oznl]

On 5/9/2019 at 8:48 AM, rosalie.bent said:

Usually when this is brought up, everyone goes to their corners and yells at everyone else.

I've always been alternately amused, bewildered and annoyed by the factionalising that goes on there...

 

 

[Bettypooh]

On 5/8/2019 at 10:59 PM, NewGuy20 said:

I think the below definition is sufficient to define everyone who is ABDL:

A strong emotional, sexual, or psychological fascination (to varying degrees) with inanimate objects typically associated with children or childhood - in particular: diapers. The list also includes but is not limited to bottles, pacifiers, onesies, cribs, high chairs, etc. 

 

Not at all. My interest here is limited to only diapers and directly associated things, and there's nothing else "on the list" which is what those coming from an AB aspect usually cannot understand. If you limit that description to only those with attractions to diapers you'll hit the target. That's really the one and only thing we all have in common here even though the majority here do seem to have some AB interests too.

There's no need and no point in trying to justify one's position. You are what you are and I am what I am and neither is right or wrong. ABDL is simply an "umbrella term" we gather under or use to help find others with similar interests. If you need justification or explanation then you don't yet really understand what you're about, and lacking that means you can't be any more understanding of others either. This is where so many lose touch with reality which does not change with changes of perspective or opinion- in fact that's how one goes about finding it.

Bettypooh

[rosalie.bent]

On 5/11/2019 at 4:41 PM, Bettypooh said:

Not at all. My interest here is limited to only diapers and directly associated things, and there's nothing else "on the list" which is what those coming from an AB aspect usually cannot understand. If you limit that description to only those with attractions to diapers you'll hit the target. That's really the one and only thing we all have in common here even though the majority here do seem to have some AB interests too.

There's no need and no point in trying to justify one's position. You are what you are and I am what I am and neither is right or wrong. ABDL is simply an "umbrella term" we gather under or use to help find others with similar interests. If you need justification or explanation then you don't yet really understand what you're about, and lacking that means you can't be any more understanding of others either. This is where so many lose touch with reality which does not change with changes of perspective or opinion- in fact that's how one goes about finding it.

Bettypooh

No, the definition is still a very good one. Part of the reason for public arguments is that one person's 'variation on the theme' must therefore alter the theme itself. ABDL isnt just diapers. In fact, those whose interests do not extend further than that are the small minority. The vast majority involve the infantile aspect.

ABDL is an umbrella term that s true. What many people object to are those who rudely insist that THEIR experience defines everyone elses. That was the essential message of the article I posted: we can have our own private definitions, but we are not entitled to impose it on everyone else.

[Bettypooh]

If you look closely at your definition, it's you being restrictive and not me. ABDL means there is an interest in diapers- the single commonality among us all- and possibly interests other things juvenile too. There can't be two definitions, just personal variations involved which may define oneself but do not define others. In everything there is a spread of personal positions, not just ABDL matters and it's rather shallow to argue that which is so apparent.

The most important part of all this is that each of us find our own true self and become comfortable with that person because you're not ever going to escape them.

Bettypooh

[Brudda Voodu]

I prefer to refer to this as a peculiar psychology.  I use the old familiar "ab/dl" when online, but if I had to describe myself to someone I would avoid calling myself an adult baby or diaper lover. I would instead describe the psychological compulsions, and my theories on why I have them.  Some of the head doctors I have spoken to about this, call it  autonepiophilia.

The term or acronym ABDL came about entirely from unqualified individuals in online forums.  I say unqualified because they are not individuals with years of experience and training in psychology, they are people like me and you, people who are affected by this psychology.  Ever since I started coming online and trying to learn about my compulsions, 20 plus years ago, I have encountered many people who claim to have it all figured out.  Usually it's the same people who would rather describe themselves with acronyms instead of words.  I think they use the acronyms because they don't have the insight or ability to communicate how they actually feel about their desires and compulsions.  Labels are a short cut way to create definition and stability with the unfamiliar.