'Adult Baby Life Dynamics' And 'Ab Parents' Seminars

[rosalie.bent]

Hello Everyone. My husband Michael and I are about to trial a venture I have been pestering him about for months and to which he has finally relented. Since the launch of the book we have received a lot of email looking for assistance in developing a ‘parent/child’ relationship as well as single ABs looking for advice on a variety of lifestyle and practical topics. I have been wanting to extend the ways in which we assist people, so we are (finally) biting the bullet and now considering running either one or both of the following: A one-day seminar/workshop for regressive ABs (Adult Baby Life Dynamics) and a two day seminar/workshop on AB couples (parent/child relationship).

The thought of either of these is both exciting and terrifying, but having passed the idea around a few of our contacts we have had a favourable response - albeit with concerns of privacy and security. We are now looking for thoughts and comments about this for us to further consider. We are working now on a proposed program for how it would be run. We are experienced in running post-grad level short training so we have a fair idea how to do it successfully. We would both be presenters and facilitators at these events.

Without getting too hung up on the details (which are still some way from being defined), the seminar would be on topics like What is infantilism? Developing personal boundaries, Understanding Regression, Relationships with others (AB and non-AB), Where will it lead? Knowing your AB self and self-image. As well as lectures it would also have exercises and naturally a lot of Q&A time. The Couples Seminar would have all that and more using my book as part of the template as well as more extensive small-group discussion among existing parent/child couples.

We are located in Australia so this is where we would trial it for both convenience and financial risk minimisation - probably in Queensland’s Gold Coast at a fully catered hotel venue. We are looking for intelligent thoughts and responses as well as (for Australians) some indication as to whether or not you would be interested in attending. We are of course concerned about privacy and security so that should not be a problem. And yes, it will cost some, but once we get more details we will know how much.

If you have detailed/lengthy thoughts and comments (positive and negative) you can also email us direct at rosalie.bent@gmail.com so as not to clog up the thread. All I ask is that your comments be polite and constructive.

JUST ONE THING: we want to set up a minimal website and mailing list. Can anyone suggest a decent way of doing both and I will pass it onto my more tech-savvy hubby/baby?

[Repaid1]

I would contact Daily Di personally to check on the web hosting stuff. He could help you in that direction I assume.

[Bettypooh]

I like this idea and I think it will do well. I would point out that this isn't your average group of people though, so you might want to take a different approach than your average seminar does. Your participants would likely enjoy some AB-specific activities, both in public and in private, and you'll want a 'dress code' for the public areas where the group will meet and a place to change if there is a different standard once they get to the private areas The TG support group I used to run met at a hotel on Saturday with a dinner in public afterward at a TG-friendly restaurant. After that we'd go to a TG-friendly nightclub. For those who didn't wish to go out in public, the room we used for the meeting would have a VCR and some TG movies with pizza delivered in Other than the pizza delivery driver, it was all pre-arranged with the businesses management and done within their limitations. The looks we got from some of those pizza guys was worth a million all by itself We also had a 'hotline' phone where anyone having problems could call and get assistance in case of problems. The person with that phone had the phone numbers of the management at all our planned venues, and local knowledge to help people who got lost or needed services such as a mechanic or veterinarian

We discovered that there are people who want to remain in the closet completely; people who are totally OK with being publicly 'out'; and people who are more casually 'out' and don't want excess attention drawn to them By having activities compatible with these three groups of people there was something for everyone to enjoy beyond just our gathering More than just educating people, give them some fun too, and the event will be a success. Though I'm too far away to attend and I'm not AB, I'd be there just to meet people, learn something, and have fun with some age-play in RL, and I'm positive that there are many other non-AB's like me who would do the same Even if we're not your target audience, we do help make the numbers bigger and help pay the bills, and in a situation like this those bills will not be insignificant so it's something to think about. Do keep us informed and good luck with this!

Bettypooh

[rosalie.bent]

Thanks betty. yes, we realise we will need to vary the format and way of running an AB seminara/workshop. The seminar would of course be totally as adults as it would be difficult to conduct with regressive infants in the room! Of course I would expect most to be in diapers but Michael is in them all the time anyhow even during our post-grad workshops! Your experiences with the TG group sound great and (thankfully) well organised and secure. our seminar would be significantly different but I am developing quite a passion for helping ABs find balance between the often overwhelming baby desires and the need to be a functioning adult. I believe that understanding more about infantilism itself combined with a better understanding of ourselves is a great start. When I watch my own baby change from an adult male to a 3yo toddler girl I see the power of the experience and sometimes wonder what it must be like to at times experience the world almost exactly as a toddler does - the wide-eyed wonder and peace etc.

But it wil be very interesting to see how many ABs or parent/child couples are willing to show their faces at such a seminar. A year ago, I never would have gone to such a thing but now, I most definately would. Everytime I communicate with other 'parents' I learn more about the wonderful, scary and sometimes intimidating role as 'parent' to an adult baby. I would never give it up though!

[DLenforcer]

I'm sure there is a live web-cam system you would be able to set up as a Pay Per View system. Depending on the cost, I would consider paying a fee to remotely view the seminar. I've never done such thing, so I'm sorry I can't be more helpfull here, but just a thought for something to look into

-Dlenforcer

[rosalie.bent]

Thank DLenforcer. What we are hoping to do is have a workshop and seminar so we can handle questions and face-to-face is always easier.

Does anyone else have any opinions? Im a little surprised at the lack of comment.

[NewBaby94]

I'd absolutely love to go, but I don't live in Australia. That might be the reason for relative lack of comment. :/

[sarah_ab]

i think you will have to be very thorough in your accepting of particpants. I know from your past postings you are not interested in the sexual fetish side of this .... but many people ARE... and you might have people wanting to attending who are a bit more sexual in their age play etc..... so that is something you will have to clarify and have rules about.... which may cause many people to not want to attend, but would most likely appeal to others....

[rosalie.bent]

i think you will have to be very thorough in your accepting of particpants. I know from your past postings you are not interested in the sexual fetish side of this .... but many people ARE... and you might have people wanting to attending who are a bit more sexual in their age play etc..... so that is something you will have to clarify and have rules about.... which may cause many people to not want to attend, but would most likely appeal to others....

Well the seminar would be for regresive ABs but most of them also have a sexual aspect to it. But I am not proposing a 'play' workshop but rather a formal seminar on learning about ourselves and helping everyone to handle the AB drives and needs easier and better in the real world. There are plenty of play events. This is proposed to be a more educational and sharing of ideas and views event.

[rosalie.bent]

I'd absolutely love to go, but I don't live in Australia. That might be the reason for relative lack of comment. :/

if it worked well here we would take it overseas so I'd still welcome any commentary and thoughts (and criticisms) that apply in general.

[NewBaby94]

Well, referring to what you said earlier, I'd have to disagree. There are NOT enough play events. That being said, I know that isn't your intent for the event. However, maybe people would be more interested if it was partially both? Maybe a day or however long for education and formal seminars, and a day for play. After all, it makes sense to have the subject matter that you're discussing present at your event.

[NewBaby94]

Balance, right? You have to have both sides to achieve it! Lol

[sarah_ab]

i know its not a play event, my point was that you would want to make sure the rules were clearly stated and the intent, and whether or not fetishists were welcome.... because from your past postings you seemed pretty adamant in a separation between those who are sexual and those who are not... so you would want to make clear what it is you are proposing... there are many fetish events that offer educational seminars, but have a sexual aspect to them and if you do not want fetishists to be there, than it would need to be clear.

i think many people are afraid to offer up criticism because in the past you reacted very badly to criticism of your publications, so people may be reluctant to put in the effort give your responses to criticism in the past.

[rosalie.bent]

i know its not a play event, my point was that you would want to make sure the rules were clearly stated and the intent, and whether or not fetishists were welcome.... because from your past postings you seemed pretty adamant in a separation between those who are sexual and those who are not... so you would want to make clear what it is you are proposing... there are many fetish events that offer educational seminars, but have a sexual aspect to them and if you do not want fetishists to be there, than it would need to be clear.

i think many people are afraid to offer up criticism because in the past you reacted very badly to criticism of your publications, so people may be reluctant to put in the effort give your responses to criticism in the past.

Possibly because I find it hard to take criticisms of my book - especially very intense criticism - from people who havent even read it. That kind of thing tends to stick in my craw a little. Now cricicism based on actually reading it...? But moving on...

I personally feel uncomfortable with the 'play' aspect because it moves a long way from the intention plus it changes how and where we do it. Michael and I would rather have a seminar/workshop on what makes us all tick and how to deal with it all in a practical and effecive way. There really isnt much of that around. And I dont discriminate about sexual fetishism, but I am directing this at regressive Babies/Littles specifically with or without sexual fetish associated with it.

So what do you think of a classroom style seminar on the working of the regressive baby?

[rosalie.bent]

Well, referring to what you said earlier, I'd have to disagree. There are NOT enough play events. That being said, I know that isn't your intent for the event. However, maybe people would be more interested if it was partially both? Maybe a day or however long for education and formal seminars, and a day for play. After all, it makes sense to have the subject matter that you're discussing present at your event.

Not necessarily. Having overt regressive baby play at the event makes it a privacy and security nightmare plus essentially derails the purpose. I really think play events have their place as do educational seminars/workshops. Mixing the two together risks damging the import of both.

[Bettypooh]

So what you're essentially wanting is an 'adult/adult' setting where the AB personality must remain back at home? While I believe that some limits on overtness at the seminar itself would be good, you are automatically eliminating the many whose AB side is more frequent or more complete I think you'd do better to create spaces for all as I suggested earlier. There's a part of the ABDL world who express some of this in their life publicly through clothing choices or accoutrements such as a visible paci (dummy) in their daily lives already

Among the TG people who attended my group were many deeply closeted CD's and TG's and their spouses who were not out for various reasons, and who would not have been there had it only been for discussion but no expression allowed The depth of the need, the need for discretion, and the need for a place to safely express it are much the same between TG's and ABDL's with only the matter itself being different Your approach will keep a lot of people at home, perhaps 50%+ of your potential attendees. My approach gains you the largest audience possible Without too much trouble you could also 'sell' spots for a live webinar so that anyone online could 'attend' and see what's going on plus have their input through any audience-interactive parts If you and they chose to, they could even have their webcam pic projected on a screen for the live audience to see during that interaction. I go to some meetings now where this is done for those who cannot be there in person, and it's not terribly technical though a bit more than I know how to set up. I'm certain I could learn how to do it in an hour or so and I'm not good at that kind of thing at all

Just thinking out loud here. It's your seminar- run it however you want. I wish you well

Bettypooh

[rosalie.bent]

Betty, are you suggesting that there are Abs who cannto do a 9-5 day without using a dummy or visible AB paraphenalia? And I dont think there are many at all that wear baby clothes in public and are unable to not do so for 8 hours? that would to me suggest a serious level of dysfunction. People wear nappies 24/7. Thats ok. Men also wear panties and even bras under day clothes. Thats fine. But to suggest that a person CANNOT go 8 hours without visible AB wear or behaviour seems a little unreasonable. How to the millions of ABs get thru their days normally?

But as a serious side question cine you bring it up, how many ABs are actually like this and who are in baby clothes or the like most of the time an unable/unwilling to change that?

Thanks betty

[sarah_ab]

hmm and this is one of the many reasons i would never attend a seminar... you have already called a great number of people here dysfunctional.

but seriously you are proposing to hold seminar about adult babies, but than don't want them to engage in any adult baby acting... i mean... if you want it to just be for the 'parents' of the adult baby, than be specific, but to state its for those who are adult babies but there is no acting out the adult baby role would be pretty boring for lots of people and turn many people off from wanting to attend.

[curiositykilledthecat]

Your idea isn't quite my bag but I'm not going to rain on your parade so go for it.

Also, my pacifier, my choice!!!!!

This satirical quote was brought to you by the letters 3, 8 and the number Q.

[rosalie.bent]

hmm and this is one of the many reasons i would never attend a seminar... you have already called a great number of people here dysfunctional.

but seriously you are proposing to hold seminar about adult babies, but than don't want them to engage in any adult baby acting... i mean... if you want it to just be for the 'parents' of the adult baby, than be specific, but to state its for those who are adult babies but there is no acting out the adult baby role would be pretty boring for lots of people and turn many people off from wanting to attend.

The notion of TRAINING seminar/workshop seems to be confusing some so let me explain more. It is about learning more about yourself and learning to keep the AB self in perspective. Sometimes it is like treading on egg shells on here or other sites because you cannot dare challenge preconceptions, fantasies or delusions without drawing a great deal of criticsm- all of it without any actual debate. The very PURPOSE of most training courses - especially in relationships - is the removal of error, fantasy and delusion and replacing it with fact, life-affirming skills and understanding. You dont do that through a Littles Play Date even though such events are very good. our goal is to HELP not HURT.

The seminar is not play time. There are plenty of opportunies elsewhere for that. Our aim is to help lift the standard of understanding and lifeskills for some of the ABs who find it quite a burden and a struggle. it is quite apparent that the notion of this is quite new and so some are finding it difficult to get their collective heads around it.

But thanks for your post. I am trying to find peoples opinions and suggestions.

[BriGuy]

Are you or your husband Abdl or involved in a Abdl/power exhange relationship?

[Bettypooh]

Betty, are you suggesting that there are Abs who cannto do a 9-5 day without using a dummy or visible AB paraphenalia? And I dont think there are many at all that wear baby clothes in public and are unable to not do so for 8 hours? that would to me suggest a serious level of dysfunction. People wear nappies 24/7. Thats ok. Men also wear panties and even bras under day clothes. Thats fine. But to suggest that a person CANNOT go 8 hours without visible AB wear or behaviour seems a little unreasonable. How to the millions of ABs get thru their days normally?

But as a serious side question cine you bring it up, how many ABs are actually like this and who are in baby clothes or the like most of the time an unable/unwilling to change that?

Thanks betty

Well my internet dropped out last night, but you can see from the responses since then that there are several people who are both well-adjusted and fairly open with their ABDL selves In fact, very few people who will make a true assessment of themselves and have open communications with their spouse have a real problem dealing with their being ABDL When you get right down to it, this is simply about balance in one's shared life- just the same as if someone wants to spend all their time with friends, dress up as another type of person, or even sit on the porch too much while the spouse disapproves So yes- there are a lot of ABDLs who do not wish to spend this much of their time without expressing themselves to some degree. Where you decide to set the limit on appearances and behavior automatically limits who is going to be there. If you set that limit to making everyone appear to be normal adults you have driven off much of your audience already

In regards appearances, you might find that most venues do not care so long as the people you attract are not doing anything illegal. My TG group had to find another place to meet when our original; space closed down. None of the hotels we approached denied us their services- only the warmth of the management's welcome varied. And this with them knowing that we would have a lot of guys who could never pass as girls even though they would be dressed that way and we would be among their public in that appearance. In some of the larger TG gatherings it's not unusual to see a full beard and hairy legs on someone wearing a mini-skirt and a Rapunzel wig. That's pretty far out there in appearance and I fail to see how someone dressed as an AB would be very far from that. What I see here is that you have a problem with those who can be more open about this. Would you be uncomfortable next to your spouse were he dressed as an AB in a city where nobody knew you? If so, then you have a problem which you need to address before trying to offer solutions to others who might be dealing with similar issues. Most of us aim for a level of discretion, true, but that is simply dealing with yourself honestly in doing what you feel the need to do- just the same as what someone standing next to you dressed as an AB is doing. So long as such expression is done with the spouses knowledge and consent nothing is wrong Trying to make people like that conform to what you want them to be is most certainly wrong At the seminar itself some level of required discretion would be advisable but not so far as not allowing any expression at all. After all, everyone attending knows what the seminar is about and has a good idea that many of the people there with them will be wearing diapers whether they see them or not

When you set limits of any kind, you automatically lose everything beyond the limits you set, both the good and the bad Thus it is better to set limits at the extremes of what you can deal with in order to not lose any good. You can watch for and deal with any bad as it comes while doing that. Also, you cannot give someone something you do not posses yourself; so if you can't handle people- yes even your spouse- expressing themselves as they truly need to, they you have the problem, not them. Until you can reach that level of compassion and understanding in yourself you will never be able to help anyone else reach that level either. If that's not the real point here I fail to see just what it is.

Bettypooh

[abkarolyn]

First let me say that the idea of hiding who and what you are, even if for a short time is exactly what is wrong with society today as a general whole. It is precisely that kind of additude that has led to the stigmatization of TG's and many other groups, and does not help to promote an inclusive eviornment to be able to achieve the kind of results that you are most likely looking for.

Second, you called anyone that cannot go without visible signs and paraphinallia of AB dysfunctional. This is a paraphrase of what you stated, but I believe that it captures the essence of what you were saying. This kind of thinking and trying to force others to act within this kind of narrow box is once again indiciative of my first point. There is not about maybe two hours where there is not some visible sign of me being an AB present. I have even gone into restaraunts dressed in vary babyish clothing with my binki in my mouth and carrying my baba. The cashier asked me if I was having a baby day. My answer was "Yes I am" In my belief it is not about hiding who and what you are, but having the comfortability with who and what you are to be able to take what comes your way without letting it affect you. Furthermore, the mere fact that you would pass judgement as to peoples level of functionality based on the mere presence or absence of "paraphinallia" is disturbing and I would like to know what qualifications that you possess to be able to pass that kind of judgement on others.

[rosalie.bent]

Thanks for the comments everyone. It has certainly moved the thread to a different topic but perhaps an important one so that’s ok.

Betty you repeatedly state that many (50%) of ABs are unable to go 8 hours without an external baby behaviour such as pacifier, bottle or some form of clothing and infant behaviour. To be honest, the repudiation of that claim is pretty easy. Whilst it may be true for the very small segment of ABs you know personally, it is very false for the extended community. An AB like that would be totally unable to have a job. No boss is going to tolerate baby clothes in the office nor is a foreman going to permit someone to down tools and have baby time and a bottle. Likewise, adult relationships would be exceptionally difficult for an AB unable to go long periods of time without baby expression. We all accept that open AB behaviour in front of young children is unequivocably wrong so that would mean such ABs could never have kids. This simply isn’t credible. So no, the vast majority of ABs ARE more than capable of going 8 hours without overt baby behaviour and items because they do it now, every day, week in, week out. They take baby time where and when it is appropriate. Betty, you are not AB and being transgender is a very different experience where you seek to permanently express outwardly an inner conviction of who you really are and I accept that without reservation and applaud your courage. But that is not the AB experience. The AB drive is not 24/7 nor are ABs really children in adult bodies. If that were so none of them would be able to function independently - just as real infants cannot do so.

You talk about limits as though they are a bad thing and at that point we part company yet again. Having limits is the experience of every one of us in all of our lives. We cannot just do what we want whenever we want. To do so is to set yourself up for massive disappointment and conflict. Our world is full of limits and while some of them are unfair, that doesn’t make the limit go away. Life skills require that we learn to live within appropriate limits.

The irony is that the proposed seminar/workshop is all about helping ABs find understanding and skills for coping with a regressive drive that can at times be overwhelming. You hardly teach self-control and boundaries by letting them do the exact opposite!

@ABKAROLYN I get what you mean by hiding who you are and how that is often intrinsically unfair. But pretending it ain’t so is just silly. It would be great if adult babies were able to dress as themselves openly in public - but they can’t. And it is unlikely to change in our lifetimes. We have to learn to live with that. We’ve already seen the merciless media assassination of a public figure than merely wears diapers, never mind engages the entire AB behavioural spectrum. Do you really want the same thing to happen to you? Say a reporter takes a photo of you and prints it in the media? Do you want that kind of attention? Because you know what the vast majority of uninformed public opinion will be: deviant, pedophile, child molester etc etc. Why put yourself at risk like that?

It is also something to consider that while YOU may not go two hours without visible external AB signs, have you ever seen anyone else doing that in public? Your experience is not reflective of everyone elses. Do you have a full-time job? Family? Kids?

One notion worth thinking about is that there is a bit of an assumption that the views expressed on social media sites like DD, ADISC and Fetlife are representative of the entire community. More and more I am seeing that is quite false. I get a reasonable amount of email from those who have read my book and almost without exception they are either not on these sites or are occasional non-posting lurkers. And to be honest, most are very different from what the online AB looks like. I admit to being quite surprised by that. Whilst not in any way invalidating the experience or views of those that post regularly, I have dumped the assumption that they are necessarily representative of the entire community. Some things are, some most definitely are not.

Just one final thought. One topic of the proposed seminar was going to be “Defining the universe by your own experience: the removal of fantasy and delusion

[sarah_ab]

So will you and your husband be the only 'experts' leading these courses or would others who are well known in the ABDL world be speakers as well?

A broad spectrum of presenters will often bring in more people than just two people who are a couple and relatively new to the online abdl community.